Let down by their countrymen: how our Forces often feel unappreciated

I'm sorry were you saying something?

The majority of soldiers have no idea why they're fighting, they're just obeying orders.
In the USA, soldiers are praised, perhaps quite naively, but it is a good thing they're serving their country.

It's the issue I was complaining about in the first place. They represent our country, but on the whole they do not fight for it's people, and a huge percentage of the population (including the army) and the media seem to be praising them for putting their lives on the line for us, as if it's in our interests.

Gloss over it all you like. The British military have killed civilians in my name in far, far away countries.

**** em.

Come back when you actually have something intelligent to say.

Gloss over it all you like. The British military have killed civilians in my name in far, far away countries.

**** em.



**** the murdering scum. They deserve no respect. And to the racists on here I am white and English.

Civilians have died and it is tragic, however the vast majority of the British armed forces is professional with good means, abilities, and intentions. If you want to be taken seriously I'd suggest you stop making uninformed generalisations. It's clear you don't know the facts or you are biased, or both.

What the hell is the British army even in Iraq in the first place (where that girl died)?

The people who sign up for this sort of stuff are sick and the whole thing requires you to be racist or you would simply refuse to get involved in things like Iraq.

Peacekeeping is part of what they do though, which is why the idea of all troops coming home and staying here is unlikely. Our troops are part of the UN forces that deploy around the world to peacekeep and provide aid.

What the hell is the British army even in Iraq in the first place (where that girl died)?

At the very least, get the tense right. We left Iraq years ago.

You're required to be a racist? Oh dear, poor you.

This is obviously not what I am talking about

lol, I suppose pedantry is easier than trying to justify the antics of "our boys" overseas.

I'm afraid the British military make me ashamed to be British, a rotten institution along with our rotten political class. It pains me to say it as somebody whose grandfathers and great grandfathers fought in WW1 and WW2, but when you remove blind patriotism from the mix, it is the only conclusion I can draw I'm afraid..

Yes, I believe you do. I think you have to subscribe to the Iraqis and Afghans as "unpeople" to participate in both of these conflicts. For example in the early stages of the Afghan conflict in 2001 (the bombing campaign before the invasion) around 3,500 civilians were killed directly by NATO bombs (a death toll higher than 9/11) - women, men and children..whole families and in many cases communities. These sorts of facts are just waved away as nothing and all part and parcel of war. I think this sort of indifference requires a racist attitude towards the countries you are occupying. I don't think the pilots of the USAF and the RAF would be so non-violent about killing 3,500 civilians in California or Kent for example, even if it was for what they perceive to be the "greater good".

I'm afraid the British military make me ashamed to be British, a rotten institution along with our rotten political class. It pains me to say it as somebody whose grandfathers and great grandfathers fought in WW1 and WW2, but when you remove blind patriotism from the mix, it is the only conclusion I can draw I'm afraid..

You said:

"At the end of the day - the sooner the british govt stop sending it's employees to get killed in foreign countries the sooner we can stop having this boring ****ing argument!"

To which I replied that such a thing is highly unlikely, not least of all because of the work they do helping with aid and peacekeeping. That is part of what they do whether you like it or not and whether you accept it or not. I was merely responding to what you said.

Now take a deep breath and try again.

If you want us to love your stupid army then stop invading foreign countries like Iraq.

Until then the "brave" British army can go and **** itself..

here are our heroes beating up some Iraqi kids..

I'm obviously not talking about "peacekeeping". The Irish Defence Forces are involved in "peacekeeping". The British army was involved in things like the Iraq war - a conflict that even the majority of Europe was opposed to (including the Franco-German axis). This is not "peacekeeping", nobody objects to "peacekeeping" do they?

Right, and what success is this? Iraq? Northern Ireland?

What insurgents attacking an occupation force? I have a feeling you would have described the Irish freedom fighters of the early 20th century as "terrorists" and "insurgents" (which from the perspective of Westminster they were). I think to a lot of people around the world..it is actually the British army who are the terrorists invading countries like Iraq - all of your "endless list" can be turned around and used against you.

What a load of bull. What is Britain doing to promote human rights in say Bahrain? Mubarak in Egypt? The British and American governments (along with many European governments and Russia and China) don’t seem to care about overthrowing the corrupt, torturing, murdering tyrants of Saudi the way they claimed they did in Iraq or Afghanistan. In fact they seem keen to help them stay in power. Promoting democracies abroad has never been an aim of any of the major world powers’ governments. The foreign policy aims of democratically elected governments are generally the same as those of undemocratic countries like China and Russia - to install governments who are their clients and will run their countries for the benefit of foreign companies rather than the benefit of their own people. In return the client governments get a cut of the proceeds of exploiting their own people. The British government remain allies of corrupt torturing dictatorships worldwide (indeed the monarch of Bahrain will soon be having meals with the queen), so forgive me if I feel a little cynical about human rights being an overriding factor in any of this.