The Student Room Group

A Curfew(tagging) or community service. what would you accept?

Well, I had a pretty bad day today. I was in a carcrash (which wasnt my fault the woman was drunk) and my best friend got stretchered away to hospital and I got arrested, I didnt give them a blood sample because I was injured and arrested instead of going to hospital (I broke a couple of ribs and had a broken) then I had totaly rudeness from the police doctor instead of any sympathy or any of my injuries looked at. Now a year later I Went to court, and got found guilty of failing to provide and now Im looking at the prospect of doing either Community service or being tagged.

Which do you think is the lesser of the two evils?
Working for free... for however amount of hours?
or being tracked.... ?

My first criminal offense and I do intend to appeal btw.

Scroll to see replies

Reply 1
I'd rather do community service.
Reply 2
Gahh that sounds like such a hassle, i'd be so pissed off. How old are you, i think if your under 18 the criminal record will be wiped if its minor.
I think being tracked would be the lesser of the two, but will you be able to walk wherever you go or will you be prohibated from certain areas? As long as you dont visit any dodgy places, i'm sure you wont even notice it.
Reply 3
it could be something like 180hours unpaid work though? If it was minimum wage it'd be £540 lost!
Find out how many hours of community service and what for and compare it to the extent of the curfew. :smile:
Reply 5
~the_one~
Gahh that sounds like such a hassle, i'd be so pissed off. How old are you, i think if your under 18 the criminal record will be wiped if its minor.
I think being tracked would be the lesser of the two, but will you be able to walk wherever you go or will you be prohibated from certain areas? As long as you dont visit any dodgy places, i'm sure you wont even notice it.


i'm 21 so it wont get wiped, though it is under the road traffic act so it wont affect the getting of jobs or anything.
The tag would also be a curfew order? so I'd have to be home for a certain amount of time and I'm thinking of moving soon as its summer!
I want to appeal, but part of me says just get it over and done with now, because yes i didnt give blood (i was too injured to give breath) but i've never given blood before anyway, let along when I was injured!
Reply 6
NDGAARONDI
Find out how many hours of community service and what for and compare it to the extent of the curfew. :smile:


I Find all that out tommorow. Total nightmare!
Anonymous
i'm 21 so it wont get wiped, though it is under the road traffic act so it wont affect the getting of jobs or anything.


it will, failing to provide is serious offence in the eyes of many people, it doesn't matter what part of the law you have broken, a Criminal conviction is just that ... You will have to delcare this conviction when applying for jobs until it is considered spent, and for some jobs non conviction is everr spent ...

it will show up as a conviction shoudl you need to be CRBed for anything - misleading a potnetial employer is far worse than admitting you have made a stupid mistake and all becasue you hadn't got the wherewithal to consent to one of several options to porovide a sample



The tag would also be a curfew order? so I'd have to be home for a certain amount of time and I'm thinking of moving soon as its summer!
I want to appeal, but part of me says just get it over and done with now, because yes i didnt give blood (i was too injured to give breath) but i've never given blood before anyway, let along when I was injured!


get a grip , and take some responsibility for your own actions and pay the price for failing to be a responsible and sensible person.
Anonymous
I Find all that out tommorow. Total nightmare!


I didn't think convicts had a choice though.
Reply 9
I'm no lawyer but it sounds like you should appeal on principle. That said, you should talk to someone to see if you have a case. Otherwise, I'd pick community service just because I don't like the idea of being tagged at all. But it's whatever you feel more comfortable with.
Reply 10
I am going to appeal on principle, I was considered not in a fit state to give breath, I was definitly not in a fit state to give blood either, I couldnt leave the house for a month after the accident. and to ndgaarondi I've been told I get the choice, I have to decide tommorow which one. and to zippyRN, considering the two other people in the crash got taken to hospital and I was refused medical treatment as they didnt believe my injuries, I think that it was reasonable considering the state that I was in.
Reply 11
I think youve been treated pretty unfairly to be honest. if you werent well enough to give breath, then surely you werent well enough to give blood. appeals can be expensive and lengthy though, its a lot of hassle, but as this conviction may affect you in later life, it is probably worth it. although im sure if you explain what happened to potential employers, then there prob will not be a problem.
I think id prefer community service. when you have a tag you have a curfew, and they always know where you are, and they may place restrictions on where you can and cannot go. also, you can see them, and with summer coming up, if you want to wear shorts, you will have to have the tag on display. im always a bit wary of people who i see wearing tags as well, although the ones i have seen tend to look like scallies!
icedout
I'm no lawyer but it sounds like you should appeal on principle. That said, you should talk to someone to see if you have a case. Otherwise, I'd pick community service just because I don't like the idea of being tagged at all. But it's whatever you feel more comfortable with.


it's a completed , absolute offence

the Op would have been offered the opportunity to do a roadside test, a evidential breath test and /or a evidential blood test, it appears they refused all three on the basis of minor injuries

No levle of injury ( even death) is an excuse for there not to be samples take
Ariel4
I think youve been treated pretty unfairly to be honest. if you werent well enough to give breath, then surely you werent well enough to give blood.


if you aren't well enough to give a breath sample you are perfectly well enough to give blood

refusla to provide a sample is an absolute offence, there is the option of breath or blood, as one or other is obtainable from everyone ...


appeals can be expensive and lengthy though, its a lot of hassle, but as this conviction may affect you in later life, it is probably worth it.


it's really not worth it , becasue there is no injustice, no failures of the system , the OP refused to given breath or blood therefore , society and the law has determined that this is a crime which in certain circumstancers is equal to driving while intoxicated

the background to the crime is related to spurious medical reasons being suggested as a way to get out of giving samples ...

blood sampling for evidential purposes is undertaken by health professionals .


although im sure if you explain what happened to potential employers, then there prob will not be a problem.


believe that if you wish, but refuse to provide is up there with dishonesty offences in the eyes of some employers ...


I think id prefer community service. when you have a tag you have a curfew, and they always know where you are, and they may place restrictions on where you can and cannot go. also, you can see them, and with summer coming up, if you want to wear shorts, you will have to have the tag on display. im always a bit wary of people who i see wearing tags as well, although the ones i have seen tend to look like scallies!


the easiest answer of course is to abide by the law, especially when it's a law that is as simple as that to stick to.
Reply 14
I wasnt reading the posts properly, sorry. i thought that a police officer or a paramedic had said he was not fit to give breath.
I still think this is overly harsh though, if it his first offence. in my eyes, its not that serious. however, if he was actually under the influence, then this changes. imo, driving under the influence is serious, as it puts other people in danger, but as the op hasnt stated that he was under the influence, i am assuming he wasnt.
Reply 15
I accept that its an offense, but the paramedics and police said I wasnt capable of giving breath, which is why I wasnt charged with that offense, to then refuse me treatment to drag me off to the policestation, in the back of a police ford transit van, driving so badly I slipped of the seat, and couldnt get back up again, resulting in immense pain and a panic attack due to constriction of breath, all to get me to take a blood test whilst still refusing me treatment, I though I was making a protest especially as the 'doctor' didnt even introduce himself to me or show any concern to my injuries. He told me that he was a police doctor, and his name or anything like that was of no concern to me.

I used to work in a nightclub so had to drive home a lot late, and have been pulled over many times, and have always coperated and given breath tests, but this time I was physically and mentally distressed.

You can only fail to give blood with 'reasonable cause' be it, physically or mentally... and I plead not guilty as I thought I had a good case.

but the prosectuter managed to put words in my mouth, but the magistrates still went away for an hour and a half to decide. So It obviously wasnt as clear cut as zippy makes out. It obviously wasnt an absolute. which is what makes me want to appeal. On the principle that the other woman was charged for drinkdriving, she got taken to hospital and I got taken to the police station as I couldnt give breath. Totally unfair. I'm currently wondering If I can sue the police for negligence? I'll have to bring it up with my solicitor tommorow.
Anonymous
I accept that its an offense, but the paramedics and police said I wasnt capable of giving breath, which is why I wasnt charged with that offense,


you were charged with failing to provide

not providing a roadside sample can be mitigated by injury or inability to carry out the roadside sample


to then refuse me treatment to drag me off to the policestation,


you state you were seen by Ambulanceservice personnel at scene , they were obviously happy enough for you to be arrested ...


in the back of a police ford transit van, driving so badly I slipped of the seat, and couldnt get back up again, resulting in immense pain and a panic attack due to constriction of breath,


right, Ok , so how many officers were sat on you while you were in the prone position ? that is positional asphyxia ...



all to get me to take a blood test whilst still refusing me treatment,


you had state you had bee nseen and assessed by ambulance staff at scene

therefore you had not been refused treatment

the attitude you displayed towards custody staff and the doctor may have affected the way in which you were handled at the police station.

becasue you refused to provide a roadside sample it becomes increasingly important to get an accurate evidential breath or blood sample -


I though I was making a protest especially as the 'doctor' didnt even introduce himself to me or show any concern to my injuries. He told me that he was a police doctor, and his name or anything like that was of no concern to me.


it's not of any concern to you ...


I used to work in a nightclub so had to drive home a lot late, and have been pulled over many times, and have always coperated and given breath tests, but this time I was physically and mentally distressed.

You can only fail to give blood with 'reasonable cause' be it, physically or mentally... and I plead not guilty as I thought I had a good case.


what did your brief say?


but the prosectuter managed to put words in my mouth, but the magistrates still went away for an hour and a half to decide. So It obviously wasnt as clear cut as zippy makes out. It obviously wasnt an absolute.


Failure to provide is an absolute offence, especially when it gets as far as failure to provide a blood sample , failure to provide roadside breath sample you can just aobut get away with ....

the mbench may have been away for the time they were to decide yjust how big a book they are going to throw at you, in my albeit limited experience of themagistrates court system it's rare for them not to take a reasonable time to consider both t the issues of law and the issues of fact surrounding a case - if someone enters a not guilty plea they will take take longer in their deliberations , than if someone has the guts to face up to their wrong doing and admits their guilt


which is what makes me want to appeal. On the principle that the other woman was charged for drinkdriving, she got taken to hospital and I got taken to the police station as I couldnt give breath. Totally unfair. I'm currently wondering If I can sue the police for negligence? I'll have to bring it up with my solicitor tommorow.


1. you state you were assessed at scene by 'paramedics' therefore you have not been denied the care of a registeredHhealth Professional

2. you were seen in custody by a Doctor contracted to the police service - therefore you cannot claim you were denied this

3. the fact the other party was charged for drinkdriving has no bearign what so ever on your actions, your failure to provide samples or reasonable excuse

4. the fact the CPS let it run to this point suggests that their, and the mags interpretation of the law

5. discuss this with your brief - take on board what s/he says -
Reply 17
You also seem to have shown no regard to the other people in the crash. Were you driving? If not I don't see why they wanted to take a sample unless they thought you were under the influence of ilegal drugs or somthing.
AT82
You also seem to have shown no regard to the other people in the crash. Were you driving? If not I don't see why they wanted to take a sample unless they thought you were under the influence of ilegal drugs or somthing.


it's standard practice currently to test all drivers involved in injury accidents for alcohol - normally by roadside breath test, primarily becasue only testing one driver - the one seemingly at fault could be deemed as an assumption of guilt on behalf of the attending Police officers - who aren't there to determine guilt, only protect life , limb and property and establish facts / gather evidence - also it's important to establish whether the apparent victim is under the influence of drink or drugs.

the police are not there to punish, although that has changed somewhat with fixed penalties ( although there is alsways the option to go to court and when found guilty suffer a greater penalty in many cases) but insted to uphold orde,r protect life , limb and property and collect evidence
Reply 19
becasue there is no injustice, no failures of the system


Are you joking?