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Paris I or Paris II? King's or UCL?
I'm in a bit of a dilemma and I was wondering whether anyone had any any advice for me
I recently got an offer to study the double maitrise (english law and french law in 4 yrs (2 yrs London, 2 yrs Paris) obtaining law degrees in both England and France) This is at King's and Paris I (pantheon-sorbonne)
I've also got an offer from UCL but NOT for the double maitrise,the course there comprises of 3yrs in London and one year in Paris gaining an English law degree and a certificate in French law. This would also be in Paris at Paris II (Pantheon-Assas)
Now I don't know which one to do UCL and Assas both have better reputations for law, but gaining two law degrees from two still presitigious universities is also very attractive.
I'm also unsure about the double-maitrise since there isn't much information on the king's website and it is now too late for open days since they replied so late.
Does anyone have any advice for me? There isn't much between the two so i'm really stuck
thanks
I recently got an offer to study the double maitrise (english law and french law in 4 yrs (2 yrs London, 2 yrs Paris) obtaining law degrees in both England and France) This is at King's and Paris I (pantheon-sorbonne)
I've also got an offer from UCL but NOT for the double maitrise,the course there comprises of 3yrs in London and one year in Paris gaining an English law degree and a certificate in French law. This would also be in Paris at Paris II (Pantheon-Assas)
Now I don't know which one to do
UCL and Assas both have better reputations for law, but gaining two law degrees from two still presitigious universities is also very attractive.I'm also unsure about the double-maitrise since there isn't much information on the king's website and it is now too late for open days since they replied so late.
Does anyone have any advice for me? There isn't much between the two so i'm really stuck
thanks
Saba
I'm in a bit of a dilemma and I was wondering whether anyone had any any advice for me
I recently got an offer to study the double maitrise (english law and french law in 4 yrs (2 yrs London, 2 yrs Paris) obtaining law degrees in both England and France) This is at King's and Paris I (pantheon-sorbonne)
I've also got an offer from UCL but NOT for the double maitrise,the course there comprises of 3yrs in London and one year in Paris gaining an English law degree and a certificate in French law. This would also be in Paris at Paris II (Pantheon-Assas)
Now I don't know which one to do UCL and Assas both have better reputations for law, but gaining two law degrees from two still presitigious universities is also very attractive.
I'm also unsure about the double-maitrise since there isn't much information on the king's website and it is now too late for open days since they replied so late.
Does anyone have any advice for me? There isn't much between the two so i'm really stuck
thanks
I recently got an offer to study the double maitrise (english law and french law in 4 yrs (2 yrs London, 2 yrs Paris) obtaining law degrees in both England and France) This is at King's and Paris I (pantheon-sorbonne)
I've also got an offer from UCL but NOT for the double maitrise,the course there comprises of 3yrs in London and one year in Paris gaining an English law degree and a certificate in French law. This would also be in Paris at Paris II (Pantheon-Assas)
Now I don't know which one to do
UCL and Assas both have better reputations for law, but gaining two law degrees from two still presitigious universities is also very attractive.I'm also unsure about the double-maitrise since there isn't much information on the king's website and it is now too late for open days since they replied so late.
Does anyone have any advice for me? There isn't much between the two so i'm really stuck
thanks
Hi there,
I'm at Paris I (Sorbonne) in double maitrise law/economics. I've met some peop from the double maitrise english/french law. I think it's a very very good programm and students work hard. KCL and UCL are equally well known while Sorbonne is a lot more prestigious than Assas internationally speaking. It is also true that Assas has a better reputation overall here in France. However, these 2 universities form a group on their own, like an oxbridge of law. So a degree from any of them will be regarded as being the top in France.
Moreover, if Assas only delivers a certificate, then that should be enough to make a clear decision. A certificate worth nothing here in France while the maitrise is a true law degree, the only one respected at bac+4 and the only one that gives you access to the "barro".
Let's just say that with UCL-Assas you only get only an exchange programm while with the double maitrise, you belong to 2 universities.
Hope this helps,
Cheers
Thank you very much for that, I'm glad i got the advice from someone who's doing the course. The more I think about it, the more I agree with what you say!
Thanks again!
by the way...where can I get more information about the course, the costs involved (is it as expensive as everyone says?) etc. Did you go to an open day at king's or did you receive your offer quite late like me and not get the chance? How many people are doing the course?
Thanks again!
by the way...where can I get more information about the course, the costs involved (is it as expensive as everyone says?) etc. Did you go to an open day at king's or did you receive your offer quite late like me and not get the chance? How many people are doing the course?
Saba
Thank you very much for that, I'm glad i got the advice from someone who's doing the course. The more I think about it, the more I agree with what you say!
Thanks again!
by the way...where can I get more information about the course, the costs involved (is it as expensive as everyone says?) etc. Did you go to an open day at king's or did you receive your offer quite late like me and not get the chance? How many people are doing the course?
Thanks again!
by the way...where can I get more information about the course, the costs involved (is it as expensive as everyone says?) etc. Did you go to an open day at king's or did you receive your offer quite late like me and not get the chance? How many people are doing the course?
Hey,
I'm not doing the course. I'm in the maitrise droit + maitrise économie (=double maitrise), 100% sorbonne made. The double maîtrise are like "elite" courses at sorbonne and that's how we get to meet each other. We also share a lot of common lectures (in law).
http://www.univ-paris1.fr/formation/juridique_politique/ufr07/formations/doubles_diplomes_binationaux/double_diplome_en_droits_francais_et_anglais/rubrique320.html
Sorry I can't give you much information. All I know is that they are very protected inside the university. You will have your lectures at centre Panthéon, in the heart of the quartier latin (in front of the panthéon). You may have some classes at Sorbonne itself, only 50 meters away from Panthéon. I also forgot to mention that at Assas, only 5th year students have lectures/classes at Panthéon, in the nice buildings. For the licence and the maitrise, you will be not too far (other side of the luxembourg park) but their building is not very nice and you are no longer in the quartier latin.
As for the costs, the Sorbonne is almost free (500 euros / year) and that should apply to your 2 years spent in Paris. For the first 2 years, you should be paying the usual LLB fee at King's.
Octavius85
Hi there,
I'm at Paris I (Sorbonne) in double maitrise law/economics. I've met some peop from the double maitrise english/french law. I think it's a very very good programm and students work hard. KCL and UCL are equally well known while Sorbonne is a lot more prestigious than Assas internationally speaking. It is also true that Assas has a better reputation overall here in France. However, these 2 universities form a group on their own, like an oxbridge of law. So a degree from any of them will be regarded as being the top in France.
Moreover, if Assas only delivers a certificate, then that should be enough to make a clear decision. A certificate worth nothing here in France while the maitrise is a true law degree, the only one respected at bac+4 and the only one that gives you access to the "barro".
Let's just say that with UCL-Assas you only get only an exchange programm while with the double maitrise, you belong to 2 universities.
Hope this helps,
Cheers
I'm at Paris I (Sorbonne) in double maitrise law/economics. I've met some peop from the double maitrise english/french law. I think it's a very very good programm and students work hard. KCL and UCL are equally well known while Sorbonne is a lot more prestigious than Assas internationally speaking. It is also true that Assas has a better reputation overall here in France. However, these 2 universities form a group on their own, like an oxbridge of law. So a degree from any of them will be regarded as being the top in France.
Moreover, if Assas only delivers a certificate, then that should be enough to make a clear decision. A certificate worth nothing here in France while the maitrise is a true law degree, the only one respected at bac+4 and the only one that gives you access to the "barro".
Let's just say that with UCL-Assas you only get only an exchange programm while with the double maitrise, you belong to 2 universities.
Hope this helps,
Cheers
1. UCL and KCL are "perhaps" equally well-known. But the former is definitely more prestigious--both academically and internationally--than the latter. Besides, KCL isn't a member of the so-called G5.
2. Paris I isn't exactly the orignal Sorbonne even though it shares the Sorbonne name. Paris IV is "the" Sorbonne, isn't it?
pharmakos
1. UCL and KCL are "perhaps" equally well-known. But the former is definitely more prestigious--both academically and internationally--than the latter. Besides, KCL isn't a member of the so-called G5.
2. Paris I isn't exactly the orignal Sorbonne even though it shares the Sorbonne name. Paris IV is "the" Sorbonne, isn't it?
2. Paris I isn't exactly the orignal Sorbonne even though it shares the Sorbonne name. Paris IV is "the" Sorbonne, isn't it?
KCL and UCL are both good universities. I agree UCL is better but their is no difference between them as far as international reputation is concerned. They both stand behing oxbridge and LSE which are the real internationally recognized institutions in the UK.
The "orginal sorbonne" has been split into 3 different universities since 1968.
Paris I: Panthéon-Sorbonne: specialized in economics, law, history.
Paris III: Nouvelle-Sorbonne: linguistics
Paris IV: Paris-Sorbonne: classics etc
These are 3 autonomous universities but as you can see, each tends to specialise in a determined field so that the"sorbonnes" won't compete against each other.
Paris I is 1/ the biggest 2/ the most prestigious of the 3 mainly because it holds the "traditional" subjects. If you take a look at the THES ranking, Paris I is the only one figuring, Paris III and IV have catastrophic undergraduate degrees and some good masters. Furthermore, Paris I is called "sorbonne" by students, teachers, employers etc. However, it's true that most of the amphitheaters at the historic Sorbonne building are held by Paris III or IV. However, I am at Paris I and I had courses/exams at at least half of the beautiful sorbonne amphitheaters.
Octavius85
KCL and UCL are both good universities. I agree UCL is better but their is no difference between them as far as international reputation is concerned. They both stand behing oxbridge and LSE which are the real internationally recognized institutions in the UK.
The "orginal sorbonne" has been split into 3 different universities since 1968.
Paris I: Panthéon-Sorbonne: specialized in economics, law, history.
Paris III: Nouvelle-Sorbonne: linguistics
Paris IV: Paris-Sorbonne: classics etc
These are 3 autonomous universities but as you can see, each tends to specialise in a determined field so that the"sorbonnes" won't compete against each other.
Paris I is 1/ the biggest 2/ the most prestigious of the 3 mainly because it holds the "traditional" subjects. If you take a look at the THES ranking, Paris I is the only one figuring, Paris III and IV have catastrophic undergraduate degrees and some good masters. Furthermore, Paris I is called "sorbonne" by students, teachers, employers etc. However, it's true that most of the amphitheaters at the historic Sorbonne building are held by Paris III or IV. However, I am at Paris I and I had courses/exams at at least half of the beautiful sorbonne amphitheaters.
The "orginal sorbonne" has been split into 3 different universities since 1968.
Paris I: Panthéon-Sorbonne: specialized in economics, law, history.
Paris III: Nouvelle-Sorbonne: linguistics
Paris IV: Paris-Sorbonne: classics etc
These are 3 autonomous universities but as you can see, each tends to specialise in a determined field so that the"sorbonnes" won't compete against each other.
Paris I is 1/ the biggest 2/ the most prestigious of the 3 mainly because it holds the "traditional" subjects. If you take a look at the THES ranking, Paris I is the only one figuring, Paris III and IV have catastrophic undergraduate degrees and some good masters. Furthermore, Paris I is called "sorbonne" by students, teachers, employers etc. However, it's true that most of the amphitheaters at the historic Sorbonne building are held by Paris III or IV. However, I am at Paris I and I had courses/exams at at least half of the beautiful sorbonne amphitheaters.
1. I guess you're a social sciences person, so you may be entitled to say that Oxbridge and LSE are "real" internationally recogonized unis in the UK. I'm a humanities person, so I'd say Oxbridge and UCL are realy internationally recognized unis. UCL has the Slade School of fine art and Bartlett School of architecture (I see it as a humanities subject)--which are second to none in the UK and internationally renowned--not to mention its wonderful programmes in literatures and languages.
2. Again, since I'm a humanities person, I'd put Paris IV-Sorbonne above its counterparts. Several big name scholars such as Antoine Compagnon are teaching there.
3. The THES league tables are seriously flawed. I'd never cite league tables in which several unis such as Duke can jump from outside 50 to top 15 in only one year. I'd cite the Shanghai World Unis rankings (which, I must say, are natural sciences biased): Cam (2nd), Ox (10th), IC (23rd), and UCL (26th) are truely international unis in the UK.
4. Sorry to hijack the thread.
pharmakos
1. I guess you're a social sciences person, so you may be entitled to say that Oxbridge and LSE are "real" internationally recogonized unis in the UK. I'm a humanities person, so I'd say Oxbridge and UCL are realy internationally recognized unis. UCL has the Slade School of fine art and Bartlett School of architecture (I see it as a humanities subject)--which are second to none in the UK and internationally renowned--not to mention its wonderful programmes in literatures and languages.
2. Again, since I'm a humanities person, I'd put Paris IV-Sorbonne above its counterparts. Several big name scholars such as Antoine Compagnon are teaching there.
3. The THES league tables are seriously flawed. I'd never cite league tables in which several unis such as Duke can jump from outside 50 to top 15 in only one year. I'd cite the Shanghai World Unis rankings (which, I must say, are natural sciences biased): Cam (2nd), Ox (10th), IC (23rd), and UCL (26th) are truely international unis in the UK.
4. Sorry to hijack the thread.
2. Again, since I'm a humanities person, I'd put Paris IV-Sorbonne above its counterparts. Several big name scholars such as Antoine Compagnon are teaching there.
3. The THES league tables are seriously flawed. I'd never cite league tables in which several unis such as Duke can jump from outside 50 to top 15 in only one year. I'd cite the Shanghai World Unis rankings (which, I must say, are natural sciences biased): Cam (2nd), Ox (10th), IC (23rd), and UCL (26th) are truely international unis in the UK.
4. Sorry to hijack the thread.
I thought we were talking about a law course here
.And the THES is just to give you an example of some ranking you may have seen. But every french ranking mentions Paris I as well.
Anyway, the 3 sorbonnes act as a group because if one is doing bad, it's affecting the whole brand name reputation. And so I'm glad to see someone having respect for the Sorbonne, even if it's not my sorbonne
My two cents worth...
1. For law, my understanding is that Paris II has the best reputation (regardless of overall reputations). People in the legal field with some familiarity with French universities might share that opinion (...or they might not).
2. In which jurisdiction do you want to practise? If you would like to qualify as a British lawyer (even one then hired to work in the French office of a British firm), do you need the double degree? Or do you see yourself qualifying as a lawyer in France (I've heard it's harder to get a job in law there)? Have you checked out the qualification procedures? (In my opinion, law is a profession which it is very difficult to practise in a second language, given the importance of nuances and the precise use of language. You may disagree.)
3. Similarly, would you be better off studying 3 years of UK law and 1 year of French law, or 2 years of each? To what extent would you be limited to core subjects in each jurisdiction or would you get to do optional subjects that might interest you and help you get a job? (I don't know the answer, but do pay attention to which subjects you will get to do in each course.) Of course if you plan to do a Masters after, that could allow you to do optional subjects, but do think about it.
4. Are you bilingual? Will you struggle to compete on an equal footing with French students in a top French university? I presume from your offers that your French is excellent for a British student, but is that the same as being able to cope and get good marks in a French Law School? A single year abroad would be less challenging, especially as visiting students generally get more freedom in choosing subjects. Check out what if any preparation (eg language, legal methodologies - very different- and introductions to basic principles) each course offers before going abroad and what workload and required course you are required to take in the Paris II year abroad. Also, how are your final grades worked out?
I think my main points are: what are your long term plans? and look at the detailed structure of both courses.
PS For more information, if it's not on the internet, you could trying e-mailing/phoning up (it might work) or looking at the Paris I website.
1. For law, my understanding is that Paris II has the best reputation (regardless of overall reputations). People in the legal field with some familiarity with French universities might share that opinion (...or they might not).
2. In which jurisdiction do you want to practise? If you would like to qualify as a British lawyer (even one then hired to work in the French office of a British firm), do you need the double degree? Or do you see yourself qualifying as a lawyer in France (I've heard it's harder to get a job in law there)? Have you checked out the qualification procedures? (In my opinion, law is a profession which it is very difficult to practise in a second language, given the importance of nuances and the precise use of language. You may disagree.)
3. Similarly, would you be better off studying 3 years of UK law and 1 year of French law, or 2 years of each? To what extent would you be limited to core subjects in each jurisdiction or would you get to do optional subjects that might interest you and help you get a job? (I don't know the answer, but do pay attention to which subjects you will get to do in each course.) Of course if you plan to do a Masters after, that could allow you to do optional subjects, but do think about it.
4. Are you bilingual? Will you struggle to compete on an equal footing with French students in a top French university? I presume from your offers that your French is excellent for a British student, but is that the same as being able to cope and get good marks in a French Law School? A single year abroad would be less challenging, especially as visiting students generally get more freedom in choosing subjects. Check out what if any preparation (eg language, legal methodologies - very different- and introductions to basic principles) each course offers before going abroad and what workload and required course you are required to take in the Paris II year abroad. Also, how are your final grades worked out?
I think my main points are: what are your long term plans? and look at the detailed structure of both courses.
PS For more information, if it's not on the internet, you could trying e-mailing/phoning up (it might work) or looking at the Paris I website.
Hey Chestnut,
I appreciate the points you've made, it's definitely given me some more avenues to explore, even though i'm not entirely sure yet whether I'd like to work in France or England and was hoping to make that decision once i'd started studying.
I also understand what you're saying about the difficulty of keeping up with the native French speakers when I'm over there but i'm somewhat consoled by the fact that the course has obviously been successful enough for them to run the course and if it didn't really work the course would have been discontinued, as poor results on the part of the king's or UCL students would reflect poorly on the unis.
As for more information i'm going to visit king's and try and get some answers there.
thanks
I appreciate the points you've made, it's definitely given me some more avenues to explore, even though i'm not entirely sure yet whether I'd like to work in France or England and was hoping to make that decision once i'd started studying.
I also understand what you're saying about the difficulty of keeping up with the native French speakers when I'm over there but i'm somewhat consoled by the fact that the course has obviously been successful enough for them to run the course and if it didn't really work the course would have been discontinued, as poor results on the part of the king's or UCL students would reflect poorly on the unis.
As for more information i'm going to visit king's and try and get some answers there.
thanks
I had a look on google for some French forums you could try for information in case you want to approach it from that angle...
General forum followed by specific thread.
Forum thread with Paris I/II dilemma
Assas site and forum
This is a student’s account of the double maîtrise.
Lastly, this may be relevant.
General forum followed by specific thread.
Forum thread with Paris I/II dilemma
Assas site and forum
This is a student’s account of the double maîtrise.
Lastly, this may be relevant.
Saba
Hey Chestnut!
All I have to say is wow! thanks for taking the trouble and finding all those sites, they were really helpful!
I think i'm leaning towards king's but i'm going to visit it before i make my final decision
Thanks again
All I have to say is wow! thanks for taking the trouble and finding all those sites, they were really helpful!
I think i'm leaning towards king's but i'm going to visit it before i make my final decision
Thanks again
don't mind thanking, she seems to love doing it, specially when it comes to talk about french schools or idolatrate irish unis.
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