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Racism watch

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    (Original post by Howard)
    I don't know if that's discriminating Bono. I'm not going to look up the exact definition but to me, discrimination connotes one person/group of people in a position of power discriminating against anther person/group of people on grounds of color, race, sexual orientation, religion etc.

    In the case of Edders (and this is definately the last I'll say on the matter since he's not here to defend himself) surely it's just a personal choice about the people he want's to study with, rather than discrimination.
    It is racial discrimination.
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    (Original post by bono)
    I'll pick all three, as this applies to him.

    He was discriminating against the people at Imperial due to their skin colour - This shows ignorance, close-mindedness and racism.

    I dont think it is necessarily racist. When I visited Wolverhampton uni ok I would have only gone there if I flunked my A Levels but we had a mock seminar ( we were divided into groups) and I was the only person in my group who didnt have an asian origin. To be perfectly honest the idea of being a minority put me off going there (not that I would have anyway) not because I am racist but because i feared that I would find it more difficult to make friends because I would not have the same cultural interests in common. I dont think that makes me racist maybe i was under a misapprehension but I've noticed here that whilst i get on really well with all the people on my course certain groups do stick together its not because we hate them and they hate us by any means, we do go out together but it is because people find it easier to make friends and identify with people of the same language and social origin as they tend to have similar interests.
    So it isnt necesarily racist to want to go somewhere with more of an even mix. I think that people are too eager to call people racist where no racism is intended.
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    (Original post by Howard)
    I honestly think anybody should be able to fly their national flag without interference from anybody else.
    The national flag has nothing to do with race though, and even if it did I don't feel that it should be seen as offensive. In the real sense, it has nothing to do with race therefore how on earth people could percieve the act as racially prejudiced is beyond me.
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    (Original post by piginapoke)
    Well consider this situation: why are there so many students of race X at university Y? Perhaps because some people of race X want to be among other people of race X. Is race X being racist?
    See my above post, so am I racist?
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    St George is rather more fun than most saints: He was a dishonest grocer, who became a (heretical) bishop for political reasons and got done for selling bad bacon to the Roman army.
    Even in my life racism has declined in Britain, or at least, people are more ashamed of admitting they are racist. For a really good guide, take a look at books published up to World War II for what they say about other races.
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    (Original post by bono)
    The national flag has nothing to do with race though, and even if it did I don't feel that it should be seen as offensive. In the real sense, it has nothing to do with race therefore how on earth people could percieve the act as racially prejudiced is beyond me.
    I think we're actually agreeing with one another Bono.
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    (Original post by viviki)
    I dont think it is necessarily racist. When I visited Wolverhampton uni ok I would have only gone there if I flunked my A Levels but we had a mock seminar ( we were divided into groups) and I was the only person in my group who didnt have an asian origin. To be perfectly honest the idea of being a minority put me off going there (not that I would have anyway) not because I am racist but because i feared that I would find it more difficult to make friends because I would not have the same cultural interests in common. I dont think that makes me racist maybe i was under a misapprehension but I've noticed here that whilst i get on really well with all the people on my course certain groups do stick together its not because we hate them and they hate us by any menas, we do go out together but it is because people find it easier to make friends and identify with people of the same language and social origin as they tend to have similar interests.
    So it isnt necesarily racist to want to go somewhere with more of an even mix. I think that people are too eager to call people racist where no racism is intended.
    But it is not as if imperial predominantly consists of students from various ethnic monorities only - of course there are a lot of white students as well.

    In your case you were the only one in the group of non-asian ethnicity - it is understandable that you felt isolated from the others in the group.

    In edders case, this wouldn't be true. so i don't see the need to say that there is a problem with Imperial because they have people of different ethnic minorities.

    To me, that is racial discrimination. If you think it isn't, then that is fair enough.

    But he is basically saying that if there was a black person and a white person, then he would automatically favour the white person (in terms of socializing with) due to the colour of their skin.
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    (Original post by piginapoke)
    Well consider this situation: why are there so many students of race X at university Y? Perhaps because some people of race X want to be among other people of race X. Is race X being racist?
    That's a very good point. I'm sure you could see patterns of natural gravitation to certain universities along racial lines. Who could blame them?
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    (Original post by bono)
    But it is not as if imperial predominantly consists of students from various ethnic monorities only - of course there are a lot of white students as well.

    In your case you were the only one in the group of non-asian ethnicity - it is understandable that you felt isolated from the others in the group.

    In edders case, this wouldn't be true. so i don't see the need to say that there is a problem with Imperial because they have people of different ethnic minorities.

    To me, that is racial discrimination. If you think it isn't, then that is fair enough.

    But he is basically saying that if there was a black person and a white person, then he would automatically favour the black person (in terms of socializing with) due to the colour of their skin.

    Really does anyone have stats for the ethnicity split at imperial? Pencil Queen would know where has she got to. Because I heard that it has a very high proportion of foreign students and as such I could understand his position, I personally wouldnt see that as racism.
    My Chinese flatmate as far as I can tell only has chinese friends does that make her racist? I dont think so.
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    (Original post by bono)
    But it is not as if imperial predominantly consists of students from various ethnic monorities only - of course there are a lot of white students as well.

    In your case you were the only one in the group of non-asian ethnicity - it is understandable that you felt isolated from the others in the group.

    In edders case, this wouldn't be true. so i don't see the need to say that there is a problem with Imperial because they have people of different ethnic minorities.

    To me, that is racial discrimination. If you think it isn't, then that is fair enough.

    But he is basically saying that if there was a black person and a white person, then he would automatically favour the black person (in terms of socializing with) due to the colour of their skin.
    But that's "just life" I think Bono. When I was at college the asians socialized more amongst themselves than with whites and visa-versa. It's not really racist, it's more a matter of being comfortable of your surroundings.

    At my old college there were quite a lot of muslim students. They had a huge Islamic club and did their own thing. By contrast the white students made enormous use of the SU bar and mixed predominantly amongst one another.

    It wasn't a fact that the asian muslim students weren't welcome to get drunk in the SU bar, or that the whites weren't welcome to join in with the Islamic club's activities. That's just the way it happenned. Not racism....human nature.

    As you know, I live in the US. Know who most of my friends are? Fellow English and continental european immigrants to this country. I love Americans but there is no point denying a natural gravitational pull towards the familiar.
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    (Original post by Howard)
    But that's "just life" I think Bono. When I was at college the asians socialized more amongst themselves than with whites and visa-versa. It's not really racist, it's more a matter of being comfortable of your surroundings.

    At my old college there were quite a lot of muslim students. They had a huge Islamic club and did their own thing. By contrast the white students made enormous use of the SU bar and mixed predominantly amongst one another.

    It wasn't a fact that the asian muslim students weren't welcome to get drunk in the SU bar, or that the whites weren't welcome to join in with the Islamic club's activities. That's just the way it happenned. Not racism....human nature.

    As you know, I live in the US. Know who most of my friends are? Fellow English and continental european immigrants to this country. I love Americans but there is no point denying a natural gravitational pull towards the familiar.
    Yes but there are lots of white students at imperial though, it seems like having some students from a different ethnic group is too much for him to bear.

    You didn't exactly say "I'm not going to go to the college as there are some asian students, even though there are lots of white students, a few asian students is just too much for me to bear."
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    (Original post by bono)
    You didn't exactly say "I'm not going to go to the college as there are some asian students, even though there are lots of white students, a few asian students is just too much for me to bear."
    I didn't say anything at all Bono! I thought we were talking about someone else!
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    (Original post by Howard)
    I didn't say anything at all Bono! I thought we were talking about someone else!
    I think that was a reply to me.
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    If the ethnic make-up of a university is such a big issue to you, and you decide *not* to go somewhere as prestigious as Imperial, UCL or LSE simply because the ethnic diversity is not to your liking or even Oxford and Cambridge simply because of the ethnic diversity (or lack of) in those areas, then you are not only racist, but you probably don't deserve to go to those unis if you cannot see past skin colour.

    I really can't believe people would pass up great opportunities to go to a great university simply based on the ethnic make-up of the place - there are people that would die to have that place!
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    (Original post by viviki)
    I think that was a reply to me.
    Sorry.....touch of water on the brain today I'm afraid.
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    (Original post by dazmanultra)
    If the ethnic make-up of a university is such a big issue to you, and you decide *not* to go somewhere as prestigious as Imperial, UCL or LSE simply because the ethnic diversity is not to your liking or even Oxford and Cambridge simply because of the ethnic diversity (or lack of) in those areas, then you are not only racist, but you probably don't deserve to go to those unis if you cannot see past skin colour.

    I really can't believe people would pass up great opportunities to go to a great university simply based on the ethnic make-up of the place - there are people that would die to have that place!

    I wouldnt go to uni somewhere where I wasnt sure that I would be unhappy. If I got offered a place at Oxford and it had the same mix as that seminar in Wolverhampton I wouldnt take the place. Theres more to life than academia that doesnt make someone racist.
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    (Original post by viviki)
    I wouldnt go to uni somewhere where I wasnt sure that I would be unhappy. If I got offered a place at Oxford and it had the same mix as that seminar in Wolverhampton I wouldnt take the place. Theres more to life than academia that doesnt make someone racist.
    Well if you chose not to go to Oxford simply because of the racial make-up, that would make you racist.

    It's funny how you're trying to rationalise your point of view, though, keep it coming!
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    (Original post by dazmanultra)
    Well if you chose not to go to Oxford simply because of the racial make-up, that would make you racist.

    It's funny how you're trying to rationalise your point of view, though, keep it coming!
    thats just complete rubbish its as legitimate a reason as not liking the town. Does disliking the town make me anti oxford people (whatever the word is for that) I think not, you dont have a go at people for rejecting a uni because of the social class make-up, why shouldnt you make that decision. if i had two identical unis in quality and location and one had say 50% foreign based students and one had 99% I would choose the one with 50% because I'd feel that I would be more likely to make friends and have common interests with people and I would imagine that it would be a better mix. I really dont see how that is racist. It doesnt mean that I dislike foreign students in any way or would not regard them as friends.
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    Now you're showing your inability to read, as well as your ignorance.

    If you choose, or don't choose somewhere, simply because of the racial make-up, it means you are discriminating based upon race. Hence, you could be described as "racist".

    thats just complete rubbish its as legitimate a reason as not liking the town
    Sure, you can choose whatever university you like - it's your life, your choice and your opinion. That doesn't make your opinion correct.

    I'd feel that I would be more likely to make friends and have common interests with people and I would imagine that it would be a better mix. I really dont see how that is racist. It doesnt mean that I dislike foreign students in any way or would not regard them as friends.
    Yes it does - you're judging people before you've even met them. This is called "prejudice".

    you dont have a go at people for rejecting a uni because of the social class make-up
    Sure I might. If someone rejected a move to Cambridge because they assumed that everyone was all of a different class to themselves - i.e. they assume everyone would be rich and posh then that again would be prejudice. You (and others like you) are judging and generalising people you've never even met.
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    (Original post by dazmanultra)
    Now you're showing your inability to read, as well as your ignorance.

    If you choose, or don't choose somewhere, simply because of the racial make-up, it means you are discriminating based upon race. Hence, you could be described as "racist".



    Sure, you can choose whatever university you like - it's your life, your choice and your opinion. That doesn't make your opinion correct.



    Yes it does - you're judging people before you've even met them. This is called "prejudice".



    Sure I might. If someone rejected a move to Cambridge because they assumed that everyone was all of a different class to themselves - i.e. they assume everyone would be rich and posh then that again would be prejudice. You (and others like you) are judging and generalising people you've never even met.

    Well I think that you have a different definition to racism I would equate it with racial hatred. I dont hate anyone because of their race, I appreciate that not everyone shares the same things in common with me. We are all guilty of prejudging people we judge on our previous experiences, everyone judges on past experience we learn from our mistakes etc, governments look at the past to determine the best path in the future.

    In my experience for example the chinese people I have lived with over my years as a student (and there have been several so I am not judging on a single instance) although being absolutely lovely people who I have had a good laugh with and become excellent friends with, have not always being interested in the same things as me on a social level. They have in general been more studious (not really a bad thing) and whilst I would want to be out at the pub they wouldnt really like to go on a week of binge drinking (there have been a few exceptions to this on both sides but the majority havent been particularly interested they have been off with their own chinese friends who share the same interests and speak chinese, and you find that home students have more of a pub/drinking culture thing going on I would say this is the general trend everywhere from what I have heard).

    Therefore I would like not to be just with chinese people i would like to have some other people around with whom i can go out on the piss when i want who will enjoy it, so I get the best of both worlds. It doesnt mean that I dont want chinese people as my friend or that i would decide not to like them on the basis of them being chinese because that in my opinion would be racist bullsh*t, it also doesnt mean that I wouldnt like them out with me but that I would and have normally asked them but they always havent wanted to come out. So in which case I would like some friends from a mix. I still dont see how that is racist (or at least my definition of racist) its human nature. Therefore I would go for the uni with the best ethnic mix if there was nothing else to choose between them because i would feel that I would be more likely to meet more people with whom I would be able to share interests in common. If that is prejudiced then I think it is a natural prejudice that is not just limited to me or my race. I dont see race in terms of colour but in terms of interests and i think our interests are quite often based largely around and influenced by our cultures and the way in which we were bought up. I dont hate anyone for their beliefs and interests but I appreciate that their interests will probably be different than mine. It isnt always the case that you have more in common with someone of your own race but I think that it is often the case.
 
 
 
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