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Ethereal
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#1
Report Thread starter 13 years ago
#1
I've noticed on reading the bills, you do not use the standard enactment clause. Is this intentional?

Technically the Bill cannot become law without the correct enactment clause. Just wondered if you'd modified it for TSR or if it's a mistake.

If it is a mistake, there's going to be a lot of Bills need revoting to become law.
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Daragh
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#2
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Hmmm, hopefully Beekeeper will be able to address this issue, as he set down the guidlines.
Looking at the guidlines we use the Enacting words, but do not include an Enacting clause, meaning the Act would come into effect as soon as it was passed into law.
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Ethereal
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#3
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#3
the formula used is incorrect though
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Ethereal
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#4
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The correct wording should be ....

"BE IT ENACTED by the Queen's most Excellent Majesty, by and with the advice and consent of the Lords Spiritual and Temporal, and Commons, in this present Parliament assembled, and by the authority of the same, as follows:- "
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Ethereal
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#5
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#5
Another question ....

(Original post by guidelines)
A majority vote is required for a Bill to be enacted, and it will set a precedent for future Bills in the Commons to follow, so it is important that the Authors think carefully about the possible consequences it could have on future legislation"
In English law parliament is sovereign, and therefore cannot bind a futre parliament. All parliaments have the absolute right ot overturn previous legislation.
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Daragh
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#6
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Right, so this doesnt get lost in the threads Im going to sticky this thread.
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Beekeeper
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#7
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Can I just remind people that the Guidelines were set up in a way which would benefit the TSR Parliament and utilise best the forums we have and our own abilities.

The Guidelines were modelled on the proper Parliamentary procedure, but were created for the TSR Parliament in accordance to our own needs.
If you look more you'll probably notice a few other 'faults', but they are inconsequential and irrelevant technicalities that have no affect on the way our Bills are passed, and do not harm the environment or aims in setting up this Parliament originally.

I'm pretty sure I made it clear when I started that our procedures will not be identical to those of the Commons.
If deej wants to edit the guidelines then thats his choice; when deej took over he was not obliged to use my guidelines, in the same way that I wasn't obliged to use those mae by Dexnell. This is purely the job of the Speaker in this Commons as far as i'm aware, and it is his choice to make.
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Ethereal
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#8
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#8
I just wasn't sure is all
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martynwilliams
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#9
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(Original post by Ethereal)
Another question ....



In English law parliament is sovereign, and therefore cannot bind a futre parliament. All parliaments have the absolute right ot overturn previous legislation.
Yeah, that's correct.

Also, a Bill as a whole, or clauses within a bill, are commenced by commencement orders and I dont think you can specify in the text of a bill when a certain clause (or the whole bill in some cases) will come into force....

Worth a look I think..
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Ethereal
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#10
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#10
Here's how it works ...

A bil MUST contain the prescrined text of the enactment clause ie "BE IT ENACTED by the Queen's most Excellent Majesty, by and with the advice and consent of the Lords Spiritual and Temporal, and Commons, in this present Parliament assembled, and by the authority of the same, as follows:- "

With regards commencement clause that depends on the Bill. The basic principle is such :
- a bill becomes law upon receiving royal assent.
- if no commencement provision is included it comes in to force as soon as assent is given.
- if, however, a commencement provision is included the law takes effect once commencement has been done ie after a certain date or when a staturoty instrument is passed commencing said law.

I do, however, take on board beekeepers point that the TSR parliament is not the westminster one.

I was just unsure how realistic the procedures were supposed to be.
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Daragh
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#11
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Right, glad that was cleared up.

I am in no hurry to change the guidlines, I voted in favour of them when they were instituted.
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RK
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#12
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(Original post by Ethereal)
Another question ....



In English law parliament is sovereign, and therefore cannot bind a future parliament. All parliaments have the absolute right ot overturn previous legislation.
Isn't the sentence which you quoted more of a reminder that once a Bill has been passed it is a law and any future Bill in our Parliament along a similar topic should take note of past passed Bills on that topic and not be based on what actually is the case in real life.

For example, say we passed Bill here totally scrapping GCSEs in favour of some other qualification at age 16, future Bills dealing with 14-16 education would need to follow on from the previous Bill. They would have to modify what new system we put in place: ie we could then introduce a Bill to make all GCSE exams modular as GCSEs wouldn't exist in our world. We could however first have the Bill re-introduce GCSEs and them make then all modular.

I don't think that line was saying once something is law it is fixed and cannot be undone
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L i b
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#13
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Are you referring to this?

"BE IT ENACTED by The Queen's most Excellent Majesty, by and with the advice and consent of the Commons in this present Parliament assembled, in accordance with the provisions of the Parliament Acts 1911 and 1949, and by the authority of the same, as follows:-"

Because if so you will find, unsurprisingly, that it is the correct enacting formula for a bill passed under the Parliament Acts (s.4 of the 1911 Act, I believe). And since we have no TSR House of Lords I imagine that's what was seen as suitable.

For a recent example of its use, I suggest having a look at the Hunting Act 2004.

(Original post by Ethereal)
Another question ....
In English law parliament is sovereign, and therefore cannot bind a futre parliament. All parliaments have the absolute right ot overturn previous legislation.
Well, that's open to debate... and one that's far too tiresome to have here, so I really ought to have kept my mouth shut.
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Ethereal
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#14
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#14
LOL the good old "parliamentry soveriegnty" debate of public law tutorials. Will you agree with me in saying YAWN! ? lol
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L i b
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#15
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Heh, indeed. One that I've had to put up with one time too many.

Although it does slightly irritate me that most commentators in England completely ignore the position under the Act of Union...

*resists urge to go into it*
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Ethereal
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#16
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#16
LOL, have a pint
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L i b
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#17
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#17
Christ I just realised you're male...
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Ethereal
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#18
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#18
What difference does that make?

I assume you don't talk constitutional law to flirt ?? :rolleyes:


By the way, PM me with the info bout Act of Union. Being on an English law degree means we were taught English constitutional law and the wider aspects of the UK were somewhat peripheral. Am genuinely interested to know, as public law is one of my areas.
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L i b
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#19
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#19
Well there have been occasions...

Anyway, PM will be en route sometime soon.
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