Hey there! Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free

The Manchester United Thread X Watch

Announcements
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by River85)
    I'm in broad agreement. It is important to realise that the young players, who are showing great promise and maturity, will only continue to mature. Kagawa, who's had quality moments this season (and we know how good he is from Dortmund) will have hopefully settled further. However, I'm still eager for one major midfield signing, but will say no more for now as I don't feel this is the time for such analysis and talk.

    This talk of being so poor in "big games", and needing wholesale changes to a title winning squad, is ludicrous.

    All that has really been disappointing is the form of, and injuries to, wingers. Valencia in particular being a shadow of his former self. But even this isn't strictly a "negative", as despite this we've still put in some excellent performances, as with the acquisition of RvP and Kagawa and perhaps change in how we play, poor wing play hasn't been damaging.
    I think this is exactly how Ferguson will see it as well. The giant hole in central midfield that has dominated discussion for the past two summers (remember the Sneijder saga etc) may actually be solved now, but we can't be sure until the end of next season. Tom (Cleverley) and Shinji have the potential to become the most creative midfielders in the Premier League. Phil Jones has looked solid when he's played there, Rooney is a natural fit for the role as he matures into the second half of his career (a la Paul Scholes). I think we'll give it a year, see what we really have in what we've got now, and then judge whether it needs any adjusting.

    My one hope for next season is that we start to use the cup competitions to give more exposure to the quality players from the U21 team again and seeing what we have there too. It seems like the last couple of years we've been getting players like Owen, Anderson and Giggs whilst I was clamouring for the likes of Pogba and Morrison, both of whom have moved on now. We need to get away from this mentality that those on the fringe of the squad - the ones not good enough for the starting spots normally - need game time because it's hurting the youth system. The class of '11 should've been the next class of '92 but we've done our best to drive them away. Let's get Januzaj, Petrucci, Keane, Tunners, Lingard etc in there and give them a real shot.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by IanDangerously)
    Well 06 was just the squad not being good enough, but last years debacle was totally a Fergie thing. There seems to be this thing at United that you can't criticise Fergie even when he gets it wrong, but the planning of that campaign was horrendous. The team was on fire in the league so he rests 6 or 7 of the starting 11 for the first two CL games a month after the start of the season when they were still fresh. Drew the first two then realised we needed the big guns out against Galati so he rested Rooney, Chico and Nani against LIVERPOOL (FFS!) and we dropped points. Got the win in Romania but then lost 6-1 to City that weekend and the season was as good as over.

    Sometimes the squads we've had have been good enough to do it in Europe in spite of the tactical system, but there's not been many times that Ferguson has got it spot on tactically in Europe. For some reason in the 90s we slow our game down and try to play the continental way in Europe, playing right into the oppositions hands whereas if we went with our swashbuckling forward surging style of play we use in England we'd have ripped them apart. Bad planning over two leg ties too, like when we play away 1st leg we go too defensive then wonder why we've either conceeded on the break or gone out on away goals.





    We beat Chelsea and City away, Arsenal at home, and Liverpool home and away. We're performing well in the big games, today doesn't count because the league has already been won. Everyone cites 07/08 as a classic season but we lost both Manchester derbies and Chelsea away that year - our record in the top draw games there was no better than this season.
    I think it's fair to say that in Europe fergie has made a lot of mistakes and something he resents himself. I think since phelan has become assistant we haven't combated European and Spanish styles particularly well, querioz was a great tactician and whilst I didn't necessarily enjoy the way we played under his tenure we were very effective in Europe IMO

    I think it's clear to see that united aren't caring at the moment and I can't imagine fergie is letting that become acceptable even in his old age and calmed down. I just feel sorry for people who went to the match today, I have no problem losing to a better team and Chelsea deserved a result today but to play with no real care about the result is irritating especially to the fans who,have made the effort.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by IanDangerously)
    I think this is exactly how Ferguson will see it as well. The giant hole in central midfield that has dominated discussion for the past two summers (remember the Sneijder saga etc) may actually be solved now, but we can't be sure until the end of next season. Tom (Cleverley) and Shinji have the potential to become the most creative midfielders in the Premier League. Phil Jones has looked solid when he's played there, Rooney is a natural fit for the role as he matures into the second half of his career (a la Paul Scholes). I think we'll give it a year, see what we really have in what we've got now, and then judge whether it needs any adjusting.

    My one hope for next season is that we start to use the cup competitions to give more exposure to the quality players from the U21 team again and seeing what we have there too. It seems like the last couple of years we've been getting players like Owen, Anderson and Giggs whilst I was clamouring for the likes of Pogba and Morrison, both of whom have moved on now. We need to get away from this mentality that those on the fringe of the squad - the ones not good enough for the starting spots normally - need game time because it's hurting the youth system. The class of '11 should've been the next class of '92 but we've done our best to drive them away. Let's get Januzaj, Petrucci, Keane, Tunners, Lingard etc in there and give them a real shot.
    Yeah that Januzaj looks quite handy, Morrison I didn't have a problem with him leaving no player is bigger than the club and I don't believe he would of bought into that mentality, but losing pogba and fryers was extremely disappointing, pogba deserved better treatment and is flourishing in a juve side where the central midfield is very well catered for. Fryers I think ended up in Belgium so spurs can get around the compensation scheme which is pretty disgusting.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by craglyboy)
    I think it's fair to say that in Europe fergie has made a lot of mistakes and something he resents himself. I think since phelan has become assistant we haven't combated European and Spanish styles particularly well, querioz was a great tactician and whilst I didn't necessarily enjoy the way we played under his tenure we were very effective in Europe IMO

    I think it's clear to see that united aren't caring at the moment and I can't imagine fergie is letting that become acceptable even in his old age and calmed down. I just feel sorry for people who went to the match today, I have no problem losing to a better team and Chelsea deserved a result today but to play with no real care about the result is irritating especially to the fans who,have made the effort.
    Yeah we definitely miss Quieroz. I didn't really realise how much he contributed tactically until I realised how negatively we played at times in the seasons afterwards, the season after he left we antifootballed to the title with all those 1-0s. We played much better football in the Quieroz years at times. Fergie's reaction (or rather lack of public reaction) after the Real Madrid game was very telling, I think he knows his last great chance at the European Cup has slipped away.

    It's certainly irritating for the fans but I don't think Fergie really takes that into account. In one respect he has always been very good with the fans but at the end of the day its him that fields these weakened lineups to begin with - especially in the cups where ST holders are forced to pay full price to see the likes of Macheda and Bebe. That's even more frustrating imo than what's happening at the moment.

    (Original post by craglyboy)
    Yeah that Januzaj looks quite handy, Morrison I didn't have a problem with him leaving no player is bigger than the club and I don't believe he would of bought into that mentality, but losing pogba and fryers was extremely disappointing, pogba deserved better treatment and is flourishing in a juve side where the central midfield is very well catered for. Fryers I think ended up in Belgium so spurs can get around the compensation scheme which is pretty disgusting.
    I was upset when Morrison went to an extent because he was one of the best youth players I'd seen. However he also went AWOL from training and got himself suspended. He stole from other players on a couple of occasions as well although I don't know if he was caught or if that was a reason for his departure. I know he was never offered a new contract though. I'm glad Pogba is doing well, he was a beast of a player in the reserves. T

    The Fryers situation is a little strange, he basically disappeared off the radar and never gave the club a straight answer about his contract. Showed no respect to United on the way out at all. I don't know if it was Spurs's idea for him to go to Belgium or not to get around the compensation or if it just happened that way? I forgot he was at Spurs until you mentioned it actually ... that's how much he's done for them since he went there. So much for wanting a move away from United so he could get more first team action!!
    Offline

    17
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by IanDangerously)
    I think this is exactly how Ferguson will see it as well. The giant hole in central midfield that has dominated discussion for the past two summers (remember the Sneijder saga etc) may actually be solved now, but we can't be sure until the end of next season. Tom (Cleverley) and Shinji have the potential to become the most creative midfielders in the Premier League. Phil Jones has looked solid when he's played there, Rooney is a natural fit for the role as he matures into the second half of his career (a la Paul Scholes). I think we'll give it a year, see what we really have in what we've got now, and then judge whether it needs any adjusting.
    shot.
    Cleverley is nearly 24, and is pretty average tbh
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    Shirt number:

    Strip Valencia off 7, he's not even worth it. Give it back to C.Ronaldo. Sell Valencia to whoever, idk, he's so poor now.

    Strip Rooney off 10, give it to RVP. Sell Rooney to PSG.

    Give Kagawa number 13. Just like Park Ji Sung had, the Asian number. Should also boost shirt sales.
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    I still don't get how fergie managed to do the 'english barcelona' thing back in the 90's. Bayern are doing a similar thing at the moment, maybe this decade is bayerns, last decade was barca, decade before was united in this respect.
    (Original post by UnknownGuy)
    Shirt number:

    Strip Valencia off 7, he's not even worth it. Give it back to C.Ronaldo. Sell Valencia to whoever, idk, he's so poor now.

    Strip Rooney off 10, give it to RVP. Sell Rooney to PSG.

    Give Kagawa number 13. Just like Park Ji Sung had, the Asian number. Should also boost shirt sales.
    Agree with first.
    Don't agree with second unless you think kagawa>rooney
    number 13 is what I like to be the sub keeper number or 25(yes I got this from spanish football)
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    With Fergie saying a big signing could be made but not necessarily midfield it could mean Bale, Falcao or the mighty Ronaldo coming in this summer, if Bale wants to leave how likely is it he'll want to come here and Spurs will want to rather sell him to us. Ronaldo is the perfect signing but the fee will be huge unless he forces a move, Falcao will cost the least most probably (not by much) and is some player, him coming to a top team like us could make him and us even better, potential Ballon D'or winner for us but doesn't make much sense in the fact we have RVP already. Cannot see any other big name signings away from midfield.
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    http://a.yfrog.com/img849/1896/wunan...hpdrsmzhut.mp4

    Finally found the Ramires incident. Kicking out at Jones, twice.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Tommyjw)
    http://a.yfrog.com/img849/1896/wunan...hpdrsmzhut.mp4

    Finally found the Ramires incident. Kicking out at Jones, twice.
    Yeah I noticed that as well. He was lucky to away with that, I know jones was a proffessional foul, but still there isn't any reason to kick out like that bet Ramirez has done that to people plenty of times to break up play.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by jam277)
    So, one person says they don't like carrick, means he's not good...
    Ok then. Carrick has been quality, can you tell me a bit in his game that is clearly lacking for his position that makes him so overrated?
    Think he weak defensively and his passing is overrated for me he isn't exactly paul scholes in his prime. There is a reason the guy doesn't have that many caps for england so I cant be the only one who doesn't rate him, hes decent but still think hes not good enough for united.
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by craglyboy)
    Yeah I noticed that as well. He was lucky to away with that, I know jones was a proffessional foul, but still there isn't any reason to kick out like that bet Ramirez has done that to people plenty of times to break up play.
    Should have forced someone to run around waving an imaginary card like Oscar, maybe he would have got booked then.
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by yaboy)
    Think he weak defensively and his passing is overrated for me he isn't exactly paul scholes in his prime. There is a reason the guy doesn't have that many caps for england so I cant be the only one who doesn't rate him, hes decent but still think hes not good enough for united.
    Un****ing believable, Since Carrick has played for Man Utd, we have only lost the premier league on 2 occassions. Once on goal difference and once by a single point.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by mdajoka)
    Un****ing believable, Since Carrick has played for Man Utd, we have only lost the premier league on 2 occassions. Once on goal difference and once by a single point.
    So???

    steven gerrard has never won the premiere league does that make carrick better than him?

    Just because you play for a good team does not make you a good player does it...
    Offline

    17
    ReputationRep:
    I actually rate Carrick alot, but it is interesting that he's never really been picked for England. Granted he's been up against some world class players like Gerrard/Lampard but when others like Barry/Parker/Hargreaves have been given the nod over him, its confusing.

    England for the WC should set up with Carrick, Wilshere and Gerrard imo. :coma:
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by diggy)

    Our inability to beat top teams highlights our weaknesses in the CL

    Like this season we've flopped against the top 4 imagine what would happen if we played a team like barca let alone bayern Munich

    Posted from TSR Mobile
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by yaboy)
    Think he weak defensively and his passing is overrated for me he isn't exactly paul scholes in his prime. There is a reason the guy doesn't have that many caps for england so I cant be the only one who doesn't rate him, hes decent but still think hes not good enough for united.
    You're an Arsenal fan, you probably think Arteta is the new Scholes :mmm:
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Zürich)
    I actually rate Carrick alot, but it is interesting that he's never really been picked for England. Granted he's been up against some world class players like Gerrard/Lampard but when others like Barry/Parker/Hargreaves have been given the nod over him, its confusing.

    England for the WC should set up with Carrick, Wilshere and Gerrard imo. :coma:
    Tbf even Scholes got shifted out of position for Lampard and Gerrard.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by manchesterunited15)
    You're an Arsenal fan, you probably think Arteta is the new Scholes :mmm:
    No Arteta belongs in the championship...

    scholes has probably been englands only world class player from 2000. His passing ability is up there with the likes of xavi and pirlo. I dont think gerrard is as good and lampard certainly isn't from a technical point of view
    Offline

    17
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by manchesterunited15)
    Tbf even Scholes got shifted out of position for Lampard and Gerrard.
    but for Barry to have twice as many England caps at roughly the same age? :confused: even scott parker is nearly ahead
 
 
 
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • Poll
    Will you be richer or poorer than your parents?
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

    Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

    Quick reply
    Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.