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    (Original post by Idle)
    I wouldn't sell him for anything less than £55 million, if Torres (in reasonable form) is £50mil and Carroll is £35mil then £40mil is laughable.
    People always say things like this during potential transfers, but I think comparing him to two of the most overvalued players in recent history who had different situations, isn't really fair or relevant.
    To put it another way, it would be like me saying Rooney is less effective then Van Persie, therefore Man Utd should definitely sell him if they get 24 million or above.

    Saying that I can't see Utd selling him anytime soon, as he isn't really replaceable, you don't need the money and he doesn't seem like he wants to move (right now).
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    Can't believe you guys are even contemplating that United would sell Rooney. Baffling.

    There is no way on earth he would be sold, unless we were in financial difficulty or he wanted to leave.
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    @nickcoppack
    BREAKING: Ryan Giggs agrees new one-year deal, keeping him at OT until June 2014. http://bit.ly/ZGmzZh

    Great news, especially the way he's been playing in the last 2 months. Can't believe it might be his 1000th senior game tomorrow. What a player.
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    Fantastic news :manutd:
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    Omg, this guy ain't gonna stop is he? Wonder when zanettis going to retire? Reckon giggs will retire first.
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    Nice to see Giggs sign up. Wouldnt be the same without him would it?
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    Randomly looking at that stuff, with Giggs and Zannetti being 2/3 of the oldest CL scorers ever. Noticed this gem of a stat.

    Marouane Chamakh is the only player to score in six consecutive Champions League games:
    For Bordeaux in a 2–1 win against Olympiacos on 17 March 2010
    For Bordeaux in a 1–3 loss against Lyon on 30 March 2010
    For Bordeaux in a 1–0 win against Lyon on 7 April 2010
    For Arsenal in a 6–0 win against Braga on 15 September 2010
    For Arsenal in a 3–1 win against Partizan on 28 September 2010
    For Arsenal in a 5–1 win against Shakhtar Donetsk on 19 October 2010
    He's better than Messi :rofl2:
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    (Original post by doggyfizzel)
    Randomly looking at that stuff, with Giggs and Zannetti being 2/3 of the oldest CL scorers ever. Noticed this gem of a stat.



    He's better than Messi :rofl2:
    beast!

    Chamakh's not a bad player tbf..
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      (Original post by doggyfizzel)
      Randomly looking at that stuff, with Giggs and Zannetti being 2/3 of the oldest CL scorers ever. Noticed this gem of a stat.



      He's better than Messi :rofl2:
      That's brilliant. :lol:

      (Wrong thread, though. :ninja:)
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      That's good news, especially with the way he's playing recently. Slightly confused about SAF's comments though. Namely when he said, "What can I say about Ryan that hasn't already been said? He is a marvellous player and an exceptional human being."

      What he should have said, "What can I say about Ryan that hasn't already been said? He is a marvellous player."

      You can't really call someone who cheated on his wife by sleeping with his own brother's wife for 8 years "an exceptional human being".

      But I totally agree with SAF saying he's a marvellous player. That's definitely true. He's been going on for so long and he really is quality on the pitch.
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      (Original post by qasidb)
      You can't really call someone who cheated on his wife by sleeping with his own brother's wife for 8 years "an exceptional human being".
      We all make the mistakes. No one is perfect. We don't know the circumstances.
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      (Original post by River85)
      We all make the mistakes. No one is perfect. We don't know the circumstances.
      Yes, you are right, we all make mistakes, but a mistake is usually when a person doesn't know what they're doing and it was unintentional.
      If he did what he did as a one off thing, then yes, we can call that mistake. But he was doing it for 8 years so it cannot be classed as a 'mistake'. Over that period of time he full well knew what he was doing and so it can't be unintentional.

      Ever since then I've never thought as highly about Giggs as I used to. My perception of him as a footballer is still the same - brilliant, but as a person, he sickens me.

      Other people (like you) might not think the same as me which is totally fine and they're entitled to their own opinion, as am I.
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      I kind of agree, we all make mistakes but certain mistakes cannot be just brushed off, and something like that is pretty bad mistake to make. I certainly think something like that removes you from the exceptional human being club, arguably you would be lucky to remain in the decent person club.

      As has been said 8 years is not a momentary lapse in judgement, its pretty fair to assess someones character over that length of time.
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      (Original post by qasidb)
      Ever since then I've never thought as highly about Giggs as I used to. My perception of him as a footballer is still the same - brilliant, but as a person, he sickens me.
      Same. Especially as since I got in to football, Giggs has always been up there in my list of heroes. The day an "unnamed" footballer got accused of all this was gutting for the child inside me.

      Still, seeing him score in yet another season of premier league football and seeing his 1000th game come round still fills me with pride for one of my all-time favourite players.
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      (Original post by qasidb)
      Yes, you are right, we all make mistakes, but a mistake is usually when a person doesn't know what they're doing and it was unintentional.
      No it's not. What is meant by mistake depends on context and has a variety of meanings or interpretations.

      Here I mean an error. When translated from Latin this means "straying" or "wandering". In short I mean to use mistake as meaning an error based on a fault - that being misjudgement or behaviour that could be untypical or out of the ordinary. It is an act that is not necessarily typical of a person.

      If he did what he did as a one off thing, then yes, we can call that mistake. But he was doing it for 8 years so it cannot be classed as a 'mistake'. Over that period of time he full well knew what he was doing and so it can't be unintentional.
      Undoubtedly he did know what he was doing. He did use free will. There are exceptions to this, such as people with bipolar disorder who are in a manic phase, but I have no reason to suspect these are applicable to Giggs.

      However, do you know what his personal life was like? What his relationship with his brother was like? His feelings toward his sister-in-law?

      These things happen far easier than you probably think.

      I actually don't think the length of the affair, or the fact that it was with his brother's wife, is of any importance. An affair is an affair. But just because someone has had an affair, it does not make them a "bad" person.

      Ever since then I've never thought as highly about Giggs as I used to. My perception of him as a footballer is still the same - brilliant, but as a person, he sickens me.
      Well, I don't know what he's like a person, so he doesn't sicken me. At the same time I'm not going to idolise him either. He could be one of the most awesome people around, or he could be an absolute ****. I don't care. He's been a great footballer. That's all I care about.

      Perhaps there wasn't any need for SAF to bring his character into this. Perhaps he did it to defend/emphasise what his otherwise his good character, perhaps he didn't actually mean anything by it and was just referring to Giggs commitment (to the club and his career), how he has handled himself in his public and private life (affair being an exception), and how he behaves at the club. The inspiration and support he provides younger players.

      Let's not forget that SAF knows Ryan Giggs, the footballer and the person, far better than any of us do.

      But do you think it's right to judge someone when you do not know them, or have little knowledge of the situation?

      Other people (like you) might not think the same as me which is totally fine and they're entitled to their own opinion, as am I.
      Indeed, and although I don't know if you have any experience of extra-marital affairs (especially through members of your own family) but I most certainly have. Just because someone has had an affair doesn't mean that they aren't a loving, caring father, husband and person.

      (Original post by doggyfizzel)
      I kind of agree, we all make mistakes but certain mistakes cannot be just brushed off, and something like that is pretty bad mistake to make. I certainly think something like that removes you from the exceptional human being club, arguably you would be lucky to remain in the decent person club.
      I'm certainly not saying it should be "brushed off". But nor should it really define a person. There are many other things that Giggs has done in his life.

      I've done things I am not proud of during my life. I will continue to do things I am not proud of. I am not perfect.

      Let he who is without sin....

      As has been said 8 years is not a momentary lapse in judgement, its pretty fair to assess someones character over that length of time.
      Hmmm....I'd much rather assess a person's character over their lifetime, to be fair, and not over eight years.
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      (Original post by River85)
      No it's not. What is meant by mistake depends on context and has a variety of meanings or interpretations.

      Here I mean an error. When translated from Latin this means "straying" or "wandering". In short I mean to use mistake as meaning an error based on a fault - that being misjudgement or behaviour that could be untypical or out of the ordinary. It is an act that is not necessarily typical of a person.



      Undoubtedly he did know what he was doing. He did use free will. There are exceptions to this, such as people with bipolar disorder who are in a manic phase, but I have no reason to suspect these are applicable to Giggs.

      However, do you know what his personal life was like? What his relationship with his brother was like? His feelings toward his sister-in-law?

      These things happen far easier than you probably think.

      I actually don't think the length of the affair, or the fact that it was with his brother's wife, is of any importance. An affair is an affair. But just because someone has had an affair, it does not make them a "bad" person.



      Well, I don't know what he's like a person, so he doesn't sicken me. At the same time I'm not going to idolise him either. He could be one of the most awesome people around, or he could be an absolute ****. I don't care. He's been a great footballer. That's all I care about.

      Perhaps there wasn't any need for SAF to bring his character into this. Perhaps he did it to defend/emphasise what his otherwise his good character, perhaps he didn't actually mean anything by it and was just referring to Giggs commitment (to the club and his career), how he has handled himself in his public and private life (affair being an exception), and how he behaves at the club. The inspiration and support he provides younger players.

      Let's not forget that SAF knows Ryan Giggs, the footballer and the person, far better than any of us do.

      But do you think it's right to judge someone when you do not know them, or have little knowledge of the situation?



      Indeed, and although I don't know if you have any experience of extra-marital affairs (especially through members of your own family) but I most certainly have. Just because someone has had an affair doesn't mean that they aren't a loving, caring father, husband and person.



      I'm certainly not saying it should be "brushed off". But nor should it really define a person. There are many other things that Giggs has done in his life.

      I've done things I am not proud of during my life. I will continue to do things I am not proud of. I am not perfect.

      Let he who is without sin....



      Hmmm....I'd much rather assess a person's character over their lifetime, to be fair, and not over eight years.
      :rofl: Come on dude, we may be United fans, and Ryan Giggs is one of the best players to grace the game, but as a person he is clearly a *****.
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      (Original post by River85)
      No it's not. What is meant by mistake depends on context and has a variety of meanings or interpretations.

      Here I mean an error. When translated from Latin this means "straying" or "wandering". In short I mean to use mistake as meaning an error based on a fault - that being misjudgement or behaviour that could be untypical or out of the ordinary. It is an act that is not necessarily typical of a person.



      Undoubtedly he did know what he was doing. He did use free will. There are exceptions to this, such as people with bipolar disorder who are in a manic phase, but I have no reason to suspect these are applicable to Giggs.

      However, do you know what his personal life was like? What his relationship with his brother was like? His feelings toward his sister-in-law?

      These things happen far easier than you probably think.

      I actually don't think the length of the affair, or the fact that it was with his brother's wife, is of any importance. An affair is an affair. But just because someone has had an affair, it does not make them a "bad" person.



      Well, I don't know what he's like a person, so he doesn't sicken me. At the same time I'm not going to idolise him either. He could be one of the most awesome people around, or he could be an absolute ****. I don't care. He's been a great footballer. That's all I care about.

      Perhaps there wasn't any need for SAF to bring his character into this. Perhaps he did it to defend/emphasise what his otherwise his good character, perhaps he didn't actually mean anything by it and was just referring to Giggs commitment (to the club and his career), how he has handled himself in his public and private life (affair being an exception), and how he behaves at the club. The inspiration and support he provides younger players.

      Let's not forget that SAF knows Ryan Giggs, the footballer and the person, far better than any of us do.

      But do you think it's right to judge someone when you do not know them, or have little knowledge of the situation?



      Indeed, and although I don't know if you have any experience of extra-marital affairs (especially through members of your own family) but I most certainly have. Just because someone has had an affair doesn't mean that they aren't a loving, caring father, husband and person.



      I'm certainly not saying it should be "brushed off". But nor should it really define a person. There are many other things that Giggs has done in his life.

      I've done things I am not proud of during my life. I will continue to do things I am not proud of. I am not perfect.

      Let he who is without sin....



      Hmmm....I'd much rather assess a person's character over their lifetime, to be fair, and not over eight years.
      I'm sorry but he cheated on his brother's wife for 8 years. Thats all there is to say.
      Fantastic player, but his little adventure does not put him in the excellent human being category.
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      (Original post by Akkuz)
      Can't believe you guys are even contemplating that United would sell Rooney. Baffling.

      There is no way on earth he would be sold, unless we were in financial difficulty or he wanted to leave.
      Because he's never shown any incl...oh.
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      (Original post by cheetahs56)
      :rofl: Come on dude, we may be United fans, and Ryan Giggs is one of the best players to grace the game, but as a person he is clearly a *****.
      My reason for not saying he's a ****** isn't because of who I support, it's because I genuinely don't give a damn about his, or anyone's, personal life. It is personal. We can't really comment on it.

      Moreover affairs, including extra-marital affairs, are a lot more complex than some here seem to realise.

      (Original post by jakemittle)
      I'm sorry but he cheated on his brother's wife for 8 years. Thats all there is to say.
      An affair is an affair. Why should it matter whether it's with his brother wife and the length? It can be just as hurtful to those affected by the affair whether it's two months or two decades.

      Fantastic player, but his little adventure does not put him in the excellent human being category.
      Do you know how he feels about the affair? Perhaps he deeply regrets it to this day and it tears him up. Are you aware of how he has behaved, and things he has done, before, during and after the affair?

      Again, we all do things we are not proud of. I'm not a Christian, but think there's a lot to be said for "let he is without sin cast the first stone". If people weren't so quick to judge, and if we could just work together as human beings aware that we ALL have faults, the world would be a better place.

      Anyway, I'll stop now as it's dragging the thread off topic. Back to football talk.
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      So accoring to here.. http://www.squawka.com/teams/manchester-united/stats

      This is an image of our chances created

     
     
     
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