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    Why don't people just take ecstacy ffs. You don't get into this **** state when you're on it.
    I admittedly was piss faced on new years, spent the day recuperating and I can genuinely say that I'm not drinking much again. I'll drink for the taste of a beer(because I like beer and guiness) and that's it. Getting drunk is too long. Doesn't even feel that good tbh when you're drunk either and is a waste of money.

    Like people buy a £50 bottle of champers they don't even like because it's cool to celebrate with champers.
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    (Original post by py0alb)
    The fact you asked this question actually reveals significantly more about your country than ours.
    In my country this behaviour doesn't exist(extremely low) nor does rape.
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    (Original post by Jam')
    I hate this attitude. I absolutely hate it.

    So what if a woman wants to show her legs off? Why should she be in fear of getting raped just because of her outfit?

    If, just because a person sees a woman in a short outfit, they feel the need to forcibly do their dirty deed, they are 100%, not the person getting raped.
    What you're saying has no relevance to what he meant by that. He meant that women getting drunk to the point that they are pretty much immobile, vulnerable and having to get lifts home from strangers isn't doing themselves any favour.

    He wasn't talking about women wearing short skirts being deserving of rape. He's saying that certain women don't help themselves by being vulnerable to strangers, which they're not doing, they're piss faced and immobile. Anyone could do anything to them and they would be unable to defend themselves.
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    (Original post by lisia)
    In my country this behaviour doesn't exist(extremely low) nor does rape.

    Imagine all the people, living life in peace, oh oh ooooh oooooh ooooh.
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    Looks a quality night out.
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    A woman raises her hands to sing Happy New Year in Swansea last night
    Oh my ****ing god, do MI5 know about this!?
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    (Original post by medbh4805)
    I don't care what most people believe. That doesn't have any bearing on whether you're correct or not. Classic logical fallacy called argumentum ad populum

    I'm afraid you're the one who's thinking entirely the wrong way about rape. Rape is something that happens regardless of the cirumstances, and this whole thing about 'taking precautions' just gives people a false sense of security. Rapists go after people over whom they can exert power, and to most of them it doesn't really matter what they're wearing, or even how attractive they are, because their sexuality doesn't function the same way that the average male sexuality functions. Rape is a problem, and people like you look at the victim as a way of trying to prevent the problem, because rape is inevitable. But if rape is inevitable, why do some countries have lower rates of sexual violence than others? Why do certain communities have lower rates of sexual violence than others? A lot has to do with attitudes towards consent and women's sexual autonomy. Perhaps if we as a society started seeing rape as the responsibility of the rapist not to do it rather than the woman's to prevent it we might start to see it become less common
    Generally what most people believe when it comes to something like this is the right attitude. Most people think murdering, paedophilia and rape is wrong, I tend to agree with most people on this. In fact I get the feeling you just said it to throw in a bit of Latin to look smart.

    You say I am thinking the wrong way about rape then you go on to talk about something I hadn't said at all. Nobody is saying every time someone is raped the victim was in the wrong, that's a sick thing to say, I've known victims of rape and what it does to them is awful. It's a sickening crime and I think prison for a few years is far too lenient.

    You have fallen victim to entering a discussion without properly reading through posts, making assumptions, then giving us a stupid reply that doesn't address the point. Why don't you read back and try again.
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    (Original post by Rybee)
    People shouldn't rob, steal or kill either. But it happens.

    Walk around with a wad of notes in your back pocket, higher chance of being robbed.
    Leave your car unlocked whilst you're away from it, higher chance of being stolen.
    Put yourself in the wrong situations with the wrong people, higher chance of being killed.

    Go out dressed like a stripper and consume so much alcohol that your judgement is so impaired you can no longer string together a proper sentence, higher chance of being raped.

    It's common sense. Go out looking for sexual attention and make yourself vulnerable and you're going to get the wrong kind of sexual attention. I have no sympathy for anybody who gets raped whilst they're so intoxicated they can't walk. If you don't respect yourself enough to safeguard yourself, you run the very real risk of being sexually assaulted or raped.

    No sympathy.
    As someone else has pointed out, if two gay people kiss in public, that could be provocative to homophobes. If they are then attacked is that their fault? Do you have no sympathy for them either? If a man drinks himself unconscious, winds up passed out on the street, and a psychopath spots a vulnerable target and decides to stab him, do you feel no sympathy for him either?

    Besides, statistically the vast majority of rapes are committed by men the female victim already knows, and even when it is committed by a stranger, in most of the cases I've heard of the woman had not been drinking. Of course, with this being the case, it's understandable that women feel that they should be safe from this if it's their choice to drink that much. It's not a choice I condone, but it's certainly not one I will punish them for if they suffer a rape - that's punishment enough.

    I suppose we don't have to agree but I find it uncomfortable that someone with that much apathy may end up a lawyer and part of the reason girls who suffer such a terrible ordeal do not come forward to report it. Bear in mind that up to 95% of rapes are never reported to the police.
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    (Original post by medbh4805)
    Interesting. Could you provide a link? Is this available on JSTOR?

    I don't really think their conclusion could follow from their methodology however. All they did was show some photographs to people, and "female targets who wore revealing clothing were rated as more sexy and seductive than those wearing nonrevealing clothing". Well, isn't this obvious?

    It doesn't actually seem to have proved a link between coming across as sexy and being raped (this is simply assumed, which is quite a logical jump), only a link between wearing revealing clothing and appearing 'sexy and seductive' to men.

    One could just as easily argue that a woman who attracts attention is less likely to be raped, because a rapist wouldn't want to draw attention to himself by going after her, especially if other men appear to also be interested in her...

    Since you stated your opinion was 'fact', I don't think it's unreasonable to request evidence...
    Here you go mate: http://skeptics.stackexchange.com/qu...y-to-get-raped.

    Sure there might be some other men interested in a particular female, but unless they are also fellow rapists, I don't think the solitary rapist will have any problems leading her off into a dark, secluded place to do the deed. If the female is alone, a rapist is going to take the opportunity despite others looking her way. I guess it depends on who she gets approached by first.

    There are people who will think, "wow she's pretty hot" and others who will potentially think, "she's off her face, she's hot, why not?". Whoever she is approached by however... it's a matter of luck.
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    (Original post by lisia)
    I am not British not live in Britain.
    --
    Spoiler:
    Show

    I was checking out the daily mail and stumbled into this:
    Welcome to 2013: Shameful scenes of booze-fuelled New Year's chaos in cities across Britain (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...s-Britain.html)

    And got me to wonder.
    - Has this happened to any of you girls/guys?

    If a girl is passed out like this, wouldn't she be easily raped? Or a man take her to her bed and next day she doesn't remember what happened?

    [Can post Anonymous so please tell us your story or anecdote]

    IMAGES:












    Well this is what happens when most family homes are broken, job prospects are poor, people lie all the time, and are depressed. Welcome to the new UK :facepalm:
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    (Original post by SuziieB)
    I am a girl and I completely agree.

    I get really pissed when people try to say, 'well the man should know better.' Seriously? Sure. In an ideal world! If you dress like a slut and are so drunk you cannot even speak, whose fault is it that some scum picks you off the street and rapes you?

    If you leave your car unlocked with the key in the ignition, would you say that the robber should know better?

    People need to stop being naive and stupid. Women should also start taking more responsibility for their actions.

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    "If you leave your car unlocked with the key in the ignition, would you say that the robber should know better?"

    Forgive me if I'm right (which I am), but isn't someone stealing a car (an object) a bit different to a man raping a woman (a living, breathing, autonomous human being with thoughts and feelings)?
    That is a very dangerous attitude to have towards women who are the victims of gender-based violence. You are essentially blaming the victims and not the perpetrators of these horrific crimes. It is attitudes like this that stop women from coming forward and reporting crimes, as they may not think that anyone will believe them or it is their fault because they were drunk or on drugs, leading to a despicable 6% conviction rate for rape crimes and allows these men to continue raping and sexually assaulting women in vulnerable situations.
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    (Original post by Rybee)
    People shouldn't rob, steal or kill either. But it happens.

    Walk around with a wad of notes in your back pocket, higher chance of being robbed.
    Leave your car unlocked whilst you're away from it, higher chance of being stolen.
    Put yourself in the wrong situations with the wrong people, higher chance of being killed.

    Go out dressed like a stripper and consume so much alcohol that your judgement is so impaired you can no longer string together a proper sentence, higher chance of being raped.

    It's common sense. Go out looking for sexual attention and make yourself vulnerable and you're going to get the wrong kind of sexual attention. I have no sympathy for anybody who gets raped whilst they're so intoxicated they can't walk. If you don't respect yourself enough to safeguard yourself, you run the very real risk of being sexually assaulted or raped.

    No sympathy.
    Bearing in mind that rape is about power not sexual attraction, and by having this viewpoint you contribute to the stigma of rape, and make women less likely to come forward as they feel shame. Don't blame the victim; just because a woman is drinking, does not mean that she was asking to be raped. The daily mail as usual is shaming women; where are all the drunk men in the article? Also rape is not the 'wrong sort of attraction' that view is simply pig ignorant. I suggest you go to this website to educate yourself. http://www.thisisnotaninvitationtora...ng/#impact_tab I also hope that in your life that you do not have anything of value- as you're asking for it to be stolen. I hope that you're not gay-you'd be asking to be beaten up by homophobes. I hope that your children are not mixed race- don't attract attention fro the racists. Your logic is as moronic as the above statements.
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    (Original post by limey94)
    ?

    "If you leave your car unlocked with the key in the ignition, would you say that the robber should know better?"

    Forgive me if I'm right (which I am), but isn't someone stealing a car (an object) a bit different to a man raping a woman (a living, breathing, autonomous human being with thoughts and feelings)?

    That is a very dangerous attitude to have towards women who are the victims of gender-based violence. You are essentially blaming the victims and not the perpetrators of these horrific crimes. It is attitudes like this that stop women from coming forward and reporting crimes, as they may not think that anyone will believe them or it is their fault because they were drunk or on drugs, leading to a despicable 6% conviction rate for rape crimes and allows these men to continue raping and sexually assaulting women in vulnerable situations.
    They are different crimes, of course, but if you consider the rape example to be victim-blaming, then you should also consider the theft example to be victim-blaming, if you are being consistent in your reasoning.
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    (Original post by SuziieB)
    it really only takes anyone with common sense and a sense of precaution to figure out how to prevent being raped.

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    So wrong on so many levels. You can be sober, dressed in jeans and a t-shirt, but if a rapist decides they are going to rape you, and they're stronger than you, you don't have much of a chance. It's a fallacy that most rapes happen to drunk, skimpily clad girls. Statistically, they're usually carried out by a man the girl already knows. Usually, for a rapist the rape is about exerting power. It's not going to feel that powerful raping a girl who is so out of it that she doesn't even know you're there.

    Reasoning like that suggests that every rape victim in history could have prevented it happening. That's dangerous thinking.
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    (Original post by Evangelica)
    I think it's incredibly stupid to feel this way and still go out and get really wasted. :unimpressed:
    Who said I did? I mentioned that no where in my post.

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    (Original post by Evangelica)
    So wrong on so many levels. You can be sober, dressed in jeans and a t-shirt, but if a rapist decides they are going to rape you, and they're stronger than you, you don't have much of a chance. It's a fallacy that most rapes happen to drunk, skimpily clad girls. Statistically, they're usually carried out by a man the girl already knows. Usually, for a rapist the rape is about exerting power. It's not going to feel that powerful raping a girl who is so out of it that she doesn't even know you're there.

    Reasoning like that suggests that every rape victim in history could have prevented it happening. That's dangerous thinking.
    Omg, NO ONE is listening to me. I DID NOT say that rape was preventable by simply dressing properly and I did not imply in any way that they deserve it. I just said that to DECREASE THE CHANCE of being raped, it is common sense to not make yourself vulnerable to strangers by taking precautions. Why are people simply twisting my words? I don't get people on this thread. Where in ANY of my posts did I say that rape victims could have prevented it? I simply said that there are precautionary measures that can be taken to DECREASE the likelihood.

    Of course if a rapist is going to rape someone on a night out, he could do so to anyone. But, do you not think someone so drunk, they are completely unaware of their surroundings and lying on the pavement, then dressed in an outfit that covers almost nothing would be an easier target than someone fully dressed, conscious and simply on her way?

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    (Original post by jam277)
    What you're saying has no relevance to what he meant by that. He meant that women getting drunk to the point that they are pretty much immobile, vulnerable and having to get lifts home from strangers isn't doing themselves any favour.

    He wasn't talking about women wearing short skirts being deserving of rape. He's saying that certain women don't help themselves by being vulnerable to strangers, which they're not doing, they're piss faced and immobile. Anyone could do anything to them and they would be unable to defend themselves.
    This ^^^.

    (Original post by Evangelica)
    As someone else has pointed out, if two gay people kiss in public, that could be provocative to homophobes. If they are then attacked is that their fault? Do you have no sympathy for them either?
    No I don't. If a gay couple took the decision to kiss in a public place that they know may cause offense to others, and are therefore aware of the risks associated with it, then I have no sympathy whatsoever. They knew of the risks yet chose to ignore them and put themselves in that vulnerable position.

    (Original post by Evangelica)
    If a man drinks himself unconscious, winds up passed out on the street, and a psychopath spots a vulnerable target and decides to stab him, do you feel no sympathy for him either?
    No I don't. If a man took the decision to drink himself unconscious in a public place that he knows he may be taken advantage of, and is therefore aware of the risks associated with it, then I have no sympathy whatsoever. He knew of the risks yet chose to ignore them and put himself in that vulnerable position.

    (Original post by Evangelica)
    Besides, statistically the vast majority of rapes are committed by men the female victim already knows, and even when it is committed by a stranger, in most of the cases I've heard of the woman had not been drinking.
    That's not got anything to do with this particular instance.

    (Original post by Evangelica)
    I suppose we don't have to agree but I find it uncomfortable that someone with that much apathy may end up a lawyer and part of the reason girls who suffer such a terrible ordeal do not come forward to report it. Bear in mind that up to 95% of rapes are never reported to the police.
    This has been taken so much out of context of the original point which was that; if a young female is so intoxicated and thus so cognitively impaired that she cannot walk, talk or think for herself, she is going to put herself in a more vulnerable position. That's a fact.

    If SHE has put HERSELF in that vulnerable position by making a conscious choice to intoxicate herself to that level, then my sympathy for her well being dissolves rapidly. She should have had a little more self respect not to be so stupid.

    That's all I'm saying. If someone knows of a risk that will make them more vulnerable, yet takes it anyway, I cannot sympathise with them as much as I can with someone that has looked after themselves and taken precautions to avoid risk of harm.

    (Original post by poiuy)
    Bearing in mind that rape is about power not sexual attraction, and by having this viewpoint you contribute to the stigma of rape, and make women less likely to come forward as they feel shame. Don't blame the victim; just because a woman is drinking, does not mean that she was asking to be raped. The daily mail as usual is shaming women; where are all the drunk men in the article? Also rape is not the 'wrong sort of attraction' that view is simply pig ignorant. I suggest you go to this website to educate yourself. http://www.thisisnotaninvitationtora...ng/#impact_tab I also hope that in your life that you do not have anything of value- as you're asking for it to be stolen. I hope that you're not gay-you'd be asking to be beaten up by homophobes. I hope that your children are not mixed race- don't attract attention fro the racists. Your logic is as moronic as the above statements.
    This has absolutely nothing to do with the original argument and you've taken it completely out of context just to have a whinge. Your point means nothing to me.
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    I'm not sure anyone would want to rape the ones in the last pic, OP.
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    If I was a mod, I would take this thread down. So many opinions have been blown out of context and words have been twisted....people just randomly commenting are not even aware of the original situation which was debated at the beginning of the thread. They see a random post and just criticise everything without understanding the context...

    Unsubscribing.

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    (Original post by SuziieB)
    Who said I did? I mentioned that no where in my post.

    __________________________
    Save time. See it my way.
    My own fault and apologies for misinterpreting your post. I just thought the sentence I read had really poor syntax structure, punctuation and grammar. I'm used to reading 'I get really pissed' as I get really drunk and 'I get really pissed off' as annoyed. Makes far more sense now.

    (Original post by SuziieB)
    Omg, NO ONE is listening to me. I DID NOT say that rape was preventable by simply dressing properly and I did not imply in any way that they deserve it.
    "it really only takes anyone with common sense and a sense of precaution to figure out how to prevent being raped" - considering the content of your previous posts the implication is strongly there. If this isn't what you were suggesting, please enlighten the female sex on how the amazing common sense and sense of precaution you speak of can 100% ensure that they will never be raped.
 
 
 
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