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UKIP force Labour to the right... Watch

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    http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode...ty_06_03_2013/

    So with Labour back to coping the tories and now pandering to the UKIP vote, can we really trust Miliband and Balls on such disparate issues?
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    (Original post by dj1015)
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode...ty_06_03_2013/

    So with Labour back to coping the tories and now pandering to the UKIP vote, can we really trust Miliband and Balls on such disparate issues?
    Could we really trust Labour as far as we could throw them ever.


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    Worried about immigration? Vote Labour!

    Hahahahahaahahaha!
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    OMG I'm in tears laughing, that blocked nose knob head speaking. Labour have utterly destroyed Britain because of their past mistakes.
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    Labour have no policies therefore they stand for nothing. They have no consistent opinions, they are just opurtunists.

    **** labour.
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    Anything you say Ed, I suppose next up you'll be telling us how Labour are going to eliminate the deficit.
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    Maximum transitional controls
    Properly enforcing minimum wage
    Proper training of natives - apprentiships
    Clamping down on discriminatory recruitment agencies
    Teach immigrants English

    These are the policies in the broadcast. I'm not sure why you consider these a move to the right?
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    You mean, public opinion has forced the labour party to the right.

    Opinion polls always showed this country never wanted immigration at the levels its at, labour have only just realised, or probably only just started caring. Opportunistic scum.


    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...r-adviser.html

    Never forget that. "rub the Right's nose in diversity" at the cost of our prosperity. I will never trust them.
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    It's not really a move to the right. That's what's already been going on for the past 30 years.
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    (Original post by anarchism101)
    It's not really a move to the right. That's what's already been going on for the past 30 years.
    If the country is so right-wing why is the state so large and why are there so many immigrants?
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    (Original post by chefdave)
    If the country is so right-wing why is the state so large and why are there so many immigrants?
    A lot of Thatcher's policies have continued i.e unions been kept in check generally (apart from London underground)
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    Damned if they do, damned if they don't.

    Immigration isn't necessarily "left wing"; a lot of immigration is to do with giving businesses the cheapest possible labour without considering the social consequences, which if anything sounds more like neoliberalism to me.

    Anyway that broadcast was really cheesy. I completely expected it to be, but man.
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    (Original post by chefdave)
    If the country is so right-wing why is the state so large and why are there so many immigrants?
    Define a 'large state' and large compared to what?

    The state's a mode of social organisation, it doesn't have a 'size'.

    There are more immigrants because of increased technology which makes it easier to move around. Same reason people are able to move around the UK more. And because we're in the neoliberal EU.

    If you compare the UK now to say, the 1960s, we have lower taxes, less nationalised industry, tougher union laws, more inequality, etc.
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    Am I the only one who enjoyed the 'now, I know that we've been calling anyone who mentioned immigration a racist, but it turns out that we want to talk about it, as there might be some votes there. As such people who mention immigration are not in fact racist. (except UKIP, who totally are, honest).' part of the broadcast?
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    (Original post by anarchism101)
    Define a 'large state' and large compared to what?

    The state's a mode of social organisation, it doesn't have a 'size'.

    There are more immigrants because of increased technology which makes it easier to move around. Same reason people are able to move around the UK more. And because we're in the neoliberal EU.

    If you compare the UK now to say, the 1960s, we have lower taxes, less nationalised industry, tougher union laws, more inequality, etc.
    50% of the workforce employed in the public sector bigger than the European average.

    is that big enough for you?

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ork-state.html


    things are more equal than the 60s. No dogs, Irish or blacks isn't seen in windows anymore and it's no longer acceptable to pay women less. We're able to lower taxes because we have less nationalised loss making industry and the unions screwed themselves over and are less relevant as we have more workers rights and companies are going human centric now.

    you need to stop looking back with rose tinted spectacles to the time when the uk took a turn for the worse.
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    (Original post by chrisawhitmore)
    Am I the only one who enjoyed the 'now, I know that we've been calling anyone who mentioned immigration a racist, but it turns out that we want to talk about it, as there might be some votes there. As such people who mention immigration are not in fact racist. (except UKIP, who totally are, honest).' part of the broadcast?
    Read up on Enoch Powell. Ignore the media frenzy about his rivers of blood speech as he was seriously mis quoted in that one, and ted Heath used it as a reason to get rid of his biggest threat to his leadership. I especially liked his warning about the European Union. There's a great debate on you tube with him and Michael foot finding so much common ground
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    (Original post by MatureStudent36)
    50% of the workforce employed in the public sector bigger than the European average.

    is that big enough for you?

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ork-state.html


    things are more equal than the 60s. No dogs, Irish or blacks isn't seen in windows anymore and it's no longer acceptable to pay women less. We're able to lower taxes because we have less nationalised loss making industry and the unions screwed themselves over and are less relevant as we have more workers rights and companies are going human centric now.

    you need to stop looking back with rose tinted spectacles to the time when the uk took a turn for the worse.
    Your correct that the public sector makes up around 50% of the economy (though that's because of huge pension pots) however you have misunderstood the employment figure which is separate, 6 million people is actually about 20% of total employment (around 30 million).
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    (Original post by Super Cicero)
    Worried about immigration? Vote Labour!

    Hahahahahaahahaha!
    Thanks, now I need more coffee....that was just too funny.
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    (Original post by MatureStudent36)
    50% of the workforce employed in the public sector bigger than the European average.

    is that big enough for you?

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ork-state.html
    Well, I'd argue that in a state society the distinction between being employed by the state or by someone else is purely to a difference of directness, but I'll set that aside for now.

    Nowhere in that article does it say anything about the proportion of the workforce in the public sector. It's about how much the government spends relative to GDP, which is not the same thing. And another thing that should be noted is the main thing that the UK overspends on relative to other European countries is the military.


    things are more equal than the 60s. No dogs, Irish or blacks isn't seen in windows anymore and it's no longer acceptable to pay women less.
    Less discrimination does not necessarily mean more equality. What you're discussing amounts to the aforementioned minorities getting a bigger share of a smaller pie. I was talking about inequality between rich and poor.

    We're able to lower taxes because we have less nationalised loss making industry and the unions screwed themselves over and are less relevant as we have more workers rights and companies are going human centric now.
    I wasn't debating the merits or downsides of doing it, that's a separate debate, I was simply saying that the fact these processes happened represents a move to the right.
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    (Original post by anarchism101)
    Define a 'large state' and large compared to what?

    The state's a mode of social organisation, it doesn't have a 'size'.

    There are more immigrants because of increased technology which makes it easier to move around. Same reason people are able to move around the UK more. And because we're in the neoliberal EU.

    If you compare the UK now to say, the 1960s, we have lower taxes, less nationalised industry, tougher union laws, more inequality, etc.
    I would say the state is oversized because it has to borrow ~£500 million per day just to keep ticking over, if that's not an 'organisation' spiralling out of control I don't what is. If you take any measure: public debt, borrowing, the amount of tax it collects in relation to GDP or the amount of legislation we have to abide by they all increased enormously under New Labour: and the coalition picked up exactly where they left off.

    The reason immigration is so high is because we've allowed it to open, the invention of planes doesn't trump the government's right to determine who gets to stay in the country, mass uncontrolled immigration then is a political decision. One that wasn't legitimised by the people.
 
 
 
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