Join TSR now to have your say on this topicSign up now

On benefits already? No more money for extra children Watch

  • View Poll Results: Should people already on benefits receive more benefit money if they have more kids?
    No, if you are on benefits you should not be asking the state for more handouts
    46
    83.64%
    Yes, those already on benefits should receive more money if they have more kids.
    9
    16.36%

    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by madders94)
    Why is it fine to say it when we're talking about this country, but the second you suggest that poor people in Africa shouldn't have kids, it's "their human right" and they need to do it to make sure they have people to care for them. My parents are completely dependent on benefits, although they had jobs when I was born, because my dad has a severe mental illness and also a physical disability (and before you ask, no, it's not just a "bad back") - and my mom isn't well either, and I care for them. Why is it wrong in the UK to have kids who can care for you, thus saving the NHS money - but in Africa, it's all fine and good?
    Most poor people in Africa want to work.....
    We are talking about the work shy women who just want to sit at home watch daytime tv, smoke **** and breed like rats and expect others to go out to work and pay.
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by ssxx)
    Most poor people in Africa want to work.....
    We are talking about the work shy women who just want to sit at home watch daytime tv, smoke **** and breed like rats and expect others to go out to work and pay.
    Want to work and is working are two different things.
    You could say that the women you're talking about want to work, but they can't find the right job for them.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by madders94)
    Want to work and is working are two different things.
    You could say that the women you're talking about want to work, but they can't find the right job for them.
    So that gives them a licence to stay at home and breed because they can't find the work they want.

    Most working people, if they can't afford to have kids, they don't breed.

    The rules should be the same.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by 1on4)
    It's a shame you have such a negative view of those bettering themselves through education. Sometimes you have to speculate to accumulate.

    What do you suggest happens to those who have children at Uni? If you withdraw financial support they will almost certainly leave the course. That is much more of a waste of resources than giving someone £10k for 12 months. You don't have children do you? They are hard work. They cost a lot of money and are a constant drain on your time and energy.

    For someone who hasn't yet paid into the system but has taken a fair bit from it, you sure have a lot of views of how tax payers money should be spent.

    Your dad will have been entitled to conts based JSA for 6 months as per the current law. Next year your bursary assessment will reflect his drop in income. Concentrate on your own studies and get rid of that chip on your shoulder. Life isn't fair, no one ever said it would be.
    I worked for 4 full years before I started this course. So yes i've paid into the system and I still am paying into the system as I have to work. I do have better views have the money should be spent because the system was intended to help the unemployed not the teenagers who can't close their legs and pop out 4 kids before they're 21. The people who actually want to study on this course suffer. Try working 40 hours on placement then having to work, having a kid is apparently a huge time consumer? Please tell me how they find the time to go out and get drunk every weekend while I have to work to actually attend university? Seems fair to me.
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by madders94)
    Why is it fine to say it when we're talking about this country, but the second you suggest that poor people in Africa shouldn't have kids, it's "their human right" and they need to do it to make sure they have people to care for them. My parents are completely dependent on benefits, although they had jobs when I was born, because my dad has a severe mental illness and also a physical disability (and before you ask, no, it's not just a "bad back") - and my mom isn't well either, and I care for them. Why is it wrong in the UK to have kids who can care for you, thus saving the NHS money - but in Africa, it's all fine and good?
    I think it's different in Africa because the women tend to have lots of children because of lack of access to contraception and a lack of education on it. Also, the cultural attitudes to having kids is different from the cultural attitudes of the UK.
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Dee Leigh)
    I think it's different in Africa because the women tend to have lots of children because of lack of access to contraception and a lack of education on it. Also, the cultural attitudes to having kids is different from the cultural attitudes of the UK.
    But the mere mention of educating them more about contraception rather than just throwing money at projects that seem not to have helped at all, seems to stir up the human rights brigade - but apparently that doesn't apply to poor people in the UK.
    Online

    13
    ReputationRep:
    I have always thought that giving those on jsa more money when they have kids is wrong. We are effectively paying them to breed. And the kids are likely to go on to be benefit scroungers themselves.
    When you are on jsa, you shouldn't get more benefits (other than child benefit that everyone gets). If you have a jobs and you have a baby, you don't go up to your boss and say 'I've had a baby, so I need a pay rise' so why should it be different for the unemployed?
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by The Socktor)
    They're going to have them anyway. It's just a choice between them being incredibly poor scumbags or not so incredibly poor scumbags.
    No they aren't going to have them anyway- they have them because there is no deterrent to having kids they cant afford (we give them more money)....

    Create a deterrent and you'd see less births to scumbags.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by madders94)
    But the mere mention of educating them more about contraception rather than just throwing money at projects that seem not to have helped at all, seems to stir up the human rights brigade - but apparently that doesn't apply to poor people in the UK.
    I don't follow?

    You're saying people are against educating Africans about contraception? We talking about those Catholics?
    Offline

    12
    ReputationRep:
    The simple fact of the matter is that if you choose to have a child that is your choice, not the states. The state should never have to pay for your poor decision making. You want a child? You should be able to afford it.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by ssxx)
    Most poor people in Africa want to work.....
    We are talking about the work shy women who just want to sit at home watch daytime tv, smoke **** and breed like rats and expect others to go out to work and pay.
    Think you'll find most people in this country want to work. This media driven lie about everyone on benefits being work shy and lazy is a great way to divert attention from the fact there aren't enough jobs being created to get everyone into work.

    Sure there are SOME scum who leach of society but it's by no means a majority.

    Having grown up for a number of years in a family who relied on benefits due to both parents having serious disability's. I for one am very grateful for the help off the state.

    They both worked and paid taxes before they fell ill and me, there son has since i was 16 (nearly 5 year)... so not work shy scroungers but without welfare we wouldn't have been able to cope. Is looking after those in need such a bad thing?
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by billydisco)
    I don't follow?

    You're saying people are against educating Africans about contraception? We talking about those Catholics?
    Nope, on the Comic Relief thread the other night when it was suggested that maybe we should educate them about contraception rather than throwing money at them and allowing them to multiply like rabbits, the reaction was an instant "that's against their human rights".
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Iron Lady)
    Don't have a child(ren) unless you can be responsible.
    Yes. But why should the children be punished for their irresponsibility?
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by madders94)
    Nope, on the Comic Relief thread the other night when it was suggested that maybe we should educate them about contraception rather than throwing money at them and allowing them to multiply like rabbits, the reaction was an instant "that's against their human rights".
    Their human rights to what- being uneducated? :confused:
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by The Socktor)
    Yes. But why should the children be punished for their irresponsibility?
    Of course they shouldn't. But, steps need to be taken so children aren't born when parents are on welfare with no intention of working. (By "steps" I just mean refusing benefits after a certain date, e.g. 2015).
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by billydisco)
    Their human rights to what- being uneducated? :confused:
    Yeah, it's a good old excuse for them.
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by billydisco)
    Their human rights to what- being uneducated? :confused:
    To have as many children as they want apparently.
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    A woman can have as many children as she wants - I consider that a right.
    The benefits surrounding such children are not a right.
    If you can't afford to have something under benefits, whether that be a car, child or a new kitchenette, then don't have it.
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by madders94)
    But the mere mention of educating them more about contraception rather than just throwing money at projects that seem not to have helped at all, seems to stir up the human rights brigade - but apparently that doesn't apply to poor people in the UK.
    To be fair there are projects in Africa which are helping women in terms of contraception, but I don't get the human rights brigade. I've never heard of it. Like you said, kids are a choice, not a right, and I agree with that.

    And like I said, the UK culture is different. Having loads of kids in the UK is frowned upon whereas in Africa you are expected to have loads of children regardless of whether you can afford them or not. In the UK we have better access to contraception than in Africa so it's almost like we have no excuse not to constantly keep on having kids.
    Offline

    15
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by billydisco)
    I don't follow?

    You're saying people are against educating Africans about contraception? We talking about those Catholics?
    Some people are. One of the reason why contraception is an issue in Africa is because a lot of African cultures oppose contraception because they believe it goes against religion ("Go forth a multiply; children are the fruits of labour/the world...")
 
 
 
Poll
Should MenACWY vaccination be compulsory at uni?
General election 2017 on TSR
Register to vote

Registering to vote?

Check out our guide for everything you need to know

Manifesto snapshots

Manifesto Snapshots

All you need to know about the 2017 party manifestos

Party Leader questions

Party Leader Q&A

Ask political party leaders your questions

Groups associated with this forum:

View associated groups

The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

Quick reply
Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.