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We SHOULD cut welfare spending! Watch

  • View Poll Results: Should we cut welfare spending?
    Yes
    210
    56.30%
    Leave it as it is
    82
    21.98%
    No-increase welfare spending
    81
    21.72%

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    (Original post by euphful)
    Oh because then how would you maintain your smug sense of social duty and hold it over everyone if you didn't pay tax?


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    I said "reduce" tax- I didn't say eradicate it....
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    (Original post by billydisco)
    Leave the thread (and UK Politics forum) then??
    And let people like you win, I don't think so
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    (Original post by DWConde)
    Unfortunately in England, the government decided that you were an added extra that they could cut.

    Devolved governments see a bit more sense thankfully.
    Looool they get special funding that England doesn't get as it doesn't have it's own governement

    You guys get a better deal in so many ways
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    (Original post by DWConde)
    Simple soloution... create more jobs.
    What is the difference between creating a non-job simply because some people aren't good enough to find a real one and the Government handing our benefit money to that person?

    (besides the benefit payment option would be much cheaper... )
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    (Original post by DWConde)
    In fairness buddy.... those who chose not to work are actually not the root of the problem...

    Surprisingly enough, there are very few people like that.

    The real root of the issues come into full view when the economy is not able to provide the jobs for those that want to work, but because there isn't a job available... are stuck claiming benefits until there's something out there...

    Simple soloution... create more jobs.
    Reducing welfare to the 'scroungers' and using it to fund tax cuts to increase demand and hence jobs would be a good way of doing that
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    (Original post by Morgsie)
    And let people like you win, I don't think so
    You think someone who believes in renaming "mental retardation" to "developmental delay" can ever be a winner? Ok...
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    (Original post by DWConde)
    In fairness buddy.... those who chose not to work are actually not the root of the problem...

    Surprisingly enough, there are very few people like that.

    The real root of the issues come into full view when the economy is not able to provide the jobs for those that want to work, but because there isn't a job available... are stuck claiming benefits until there's something out there...

    Simple soloution... create more jobs.
    :congrats:
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    (Original post by billydisco)
    1) I couldn't give a crap what term you use for it- especially when the terms you use don't even describe the people I am referring to. I am referring to people who are PROPERLY disabled, as in "mentally retarded". I am not referring to the person in my classroom at primary school who struggled a little bit educationally!

    2) If the establishment are sooooo nice as to change the term to make them feel good, isn't it possible this "fluffyness" increased to the extent that people who are able to work have been classed as "disabled"?



    Where did I say we should remove benefits for disabled people who genuinely cannot work? All the arguing has been due to these BS terms being applied which don't even compare with mental retardation. Fine if there's another term (although complete fluff) but I am not talking about "learning difficulties"- I am talking about people who are completely mentally retarded- not far off being brain dead! Those are the people who obviously cannot work and need financial support.
    As someone who works in this sector every day, I'm fully aware of what they are called... the fact that you could be physically disabled still includes special education needs.

    What you fail to realise is that these phrases are wide reaching now.

    Those that are actual able to work and don't ( or as you called them... 'disabled' is actually not down to how you class people, but how they get processed through the ATOS system... which needs looking at because it allows for fraud... but can penalise people who genuinely need the help. ( You should look at the test.... it'd be educational for you.
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    (Original post by billydisco)
    You think someone who believes in renaming "mental retardation" to "developmental delay" can ever be a winner? Ok...
    Stop twisting everything I say.
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    (Original post by a729)
    For me it's clear that welfare is a huge detriment to our society. Welfare doesn't motivate people at all and it gives people the incentive to do nothing. To make things worse -- paying for welfare requires us to punish success. We basically take money away from successful people and redistribute it to the unsuccessful.

    Drop out of high-school to do drugs? No problem! We'll just take money away from the kids who actually do the right thing and give it to you!

    Does that seem right to anyone?

    Working hard and smart creates an obligation for you to support other people. That to me is just insanity.

    Also, redistributing wealth creates a huge system of dependency. People that are dependent on other people are clearly less free. Welfare gives more power to the wealthy in our society because it establishes a system in where the poor are indebted to the wealthy.

    There are many people better off on welfare than working

    We need less welfare and not more.

    Welfare is a PRIVILEGE not a RIGHT
    It should be a safety net NOT a lifestyle choice

    Benefit claimants should do some community service to contribute to society. This would help end the something for nothing culture
    Discuss.
    Welfare does need cutting, and scroungers are scum....but they are not the real problem.

    The real problem are the whores who have 4 kids before they are 22 and get given a house which gets bigger with every kid, huge tax breaks, increased benefits with every kid, and all their items for free and brand new eg. buggies are all brand new.
    Now imagine if you went to your boss and said "Hey, my wife is pregnant again, give me a raise! I want a bigger house and more new things for this kid". You would be laughed at and possibly fired for being retarded. But apparently, when the unemployed do it, the people with NO income....it's fine :facepalm2:

    That is an utterly ****ing retarded system.
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    (Original post by Izzyeviel)
    :congrats:
    Can you also tell me how creating fake Governmental jobs is any different to giving people benefit money?

    Stealing from Paul to give to Peter doesn't increase the combined wealth of Paul and Peter...
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    (Original post by a729)
    Looool they get special funding that England doesn't get as it doesn't have it's own governement

    You guys get a better deal in so many ways
    Actually in terms of overall spending, it's better to be a student in England... per pupil you get a lot more funding than in Wales....

    Same applies in Health too !

    It's not because you don't have your own government either... most MP's not from England abstained in the vote.
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    (Original post by billydisco)
    You think someone who believes in renaming "mental retardation" to "developmental delay" can ever be a winner? Ok...
    Well alot of people did put forth better arguments then you did by using something called 'facts'
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    (Original post by Jimbo1234)
    That is an utterly ****ing retarded system.
    You can't use that word mate, you can say:

    "That is an utterly ****king developmentally delayed system"

    or

    "That is an utterly ****king learning difficulty system"


    Trust me on this one!
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    (Original post by billydisco)
    What is the difference between creating a non-job simply because some people aren't good enough to find a real one and the Government handing our benefit money to that person?

    (besides the benefit payment option would be much cheaper... )
    If a person is actually doing something that even slightly improves productivity... then that's not a non-job.

    When there are more unemployed people than jobs... then you have an issue where you have a work force surplus...

    You either kill them off... ship them away..
    or do the right thing and invest in the economy and create more jobs.

    Benefits are actually more expensive when you conisdder the admin behind it all.
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    (Original post by Jimbo1234)
    Welfare does need cutting, and scroungers are scum....but they are not the real problem.

    The real problem are the whores who have 4 kids before they are 22 and get given a house which gets bigger with every kid, huge tax breaks, increased benefits with every kid, and all their items for free and brand new eg. buggies are all brand new.
    Now imagine if you went to your boss and said "Hey, my wife is pregnant again, give me a raise! I want a bigger house and more new things for this kid". You would be laughed at and possibly fired for being retarded. But apparently, when the unemployed do it, the people with NO income....it's fine :facepalm2:

    That is an utterly ****ing retarded system.
    Those people you mentioned are scroungers..I would refrain from using such strong words but I know what you mean
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    (Original post by Izzyeviel)
    Well alot of people did put forth better arguments then you did by using something called 'facts'
    1) and I'm going to listen to someone who says "create fake Governmental jobs will sort out the benefit system"?

    2) I think you'll find I'm the one providing logical arguments...

    3) Bet you won't reply to my Paul and Peter question in my other message....
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    (Original post by DWConde)
    In fairness buddy.... those who chose not to work are actually not the root of the problem...

    Surprisingly enough, there are very few people like that.

    The real root of the issues come into full view when the economy is not able to provide the jobs for those that want to work, but because there isn't a job available... are stuck claiming benefits until there's something out there...

    Simple soloution... create more jobs.
    This.
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    (Original post by a729)
    Reducing welfare to the 'scroungers' and using it to fund tax cuts to increase demand and hence jobs would be a good way of doing that
    Again, there are very few scroungers.. and most attempts to whittle the system down to target scroungers usually hurt the most vulnerable people anyhow..

    It's non-discriminatory when it's not on a personal basis..... it's like Chemotherapy.. it don't give a ****.. it's gonna whittle down until it can't any more.
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    (Original post by billydisco)
    Can you also tell me how creating fake Governmental jobs is any different to giving people benefit money?

    Stealing from Paul to give to Peter doesn't increase the combined wealth of Paul and Peter...
    :confused:

    No-one said anything about creating 'fake governmental jobs' that's something you've imagined.
 
 
 
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