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We SHOULD cut welfare spending! Watch

  • View Poll Results: Should we cut welfare spending?
    Yes
    210
    56.30%
    Leave it as it is
    82
    21.98%
    No-increase welfare spending
    81
    21.72%

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    (Original post by euphful)
    Who says it should? You? As far as I knew, NIC is mainly spent on pensions, with unemployment, incapacity and maternity benefits included, with an element of it going towards the NHS, which is also funded through general taxation.

    Your idea wouldn't really target those who never work because they'll never be in a position to pay it back, which will mean that the vast majority of people who use unemployment benefits (a relatively small proportion of the welfare and benefits budget) as a means to survive whilst they find work will be paying twice.




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    Ok, ok

    Maybe benefits should reduce slightly the longer an able bodied person continues to not work
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    (Original post by Bhumbauze)
    Or again, demanding a living wage.

    But that won't happen.
    I agree with raising the NMW but it would have to be accompanied by measures such as slashing VAT,employers NI contributions and fuel duty to help offset inflation and to avoid increasing unemployment.

    As well as reducing welfare accordingly!
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    (Original post by a729)
    I agree with raising the NMW but it would have to be accompanied by measures such as slashing VAT,employers NI contributions and fuel duty to help offset inflation and to avoid increasing unemployment.

    As well as reducing welfare accordingly!
    I don't think inflation is a huge problem at the minute; indeed, billions of pounds worth of quantitative easing hasn't really negatively affected. If anything we should be more worried about the opposite!


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    I don't believe welfare should be cut, but it most certainly needs reformed.
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    (Original post by euphful)
    I don't think inflation is a huge problem at the minute; indeed, billions of pounds worth of quantitative easing hasn't really negatively affected. If anything we should be more worried about the opposite!


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    Inflation is a major problem for many pensioner's, savers and the majority of the working class whose wages have failed to rise at the same time as prices.

    Especially if you were to raise the NMW - giving businesses yet another reason to raise prices!

    Arguably a (small) dose of deflation could do some good - especially with London's famously overpriced housing!
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    (Original post by a729)
    For me it's clear that welfare is a huge detriment to our society. Welfare doesn't motivate people at all and it gives people the incentive to do nothing. To make things worse -- paying for welfare requires us to punish success. We basically take money away from successful people and redistribute it to the unsuccessful.

    Drop out of high-school to do drugs? No problem! We'll just take money away from the kids who actually do the right thing and give it to you!
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...it-broods.html
    Does that seem right to anyone?

    Working hard and smart creates an obligation for you to support other people. That to me is just insanity.

    It punishes the working class when you're richer on benefits than working (after tax/NI )

    Also, redistributing wealth creates a huge system of dependency. People that are dependent on other people are clearly less free. Welfare gives more power to the wealthy in our society because it establishes a system in where the poor are indebted to the wealthy.

    There are many people better off on welfare than working

    We need less welfare and not more.

    Welfare is a PRIVILEGE not a RIGHT
    It should be a safety net NOT a lifestyle choice
    This should also accompany moves to cut tax evasion and benefit fraud
    Benefit claimants should do some community service to contribute to society. This would help end the something for nothing culture

    Welfare should only cover the GENUINE needy i.e disabled people
    Discuss.
    How many people have you shopped to the DWP faud investigation team?
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    (Original post by Quady)
    How many people have you shopped to the DWP faud investigation team?
    No one lool!
    You?
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    (Original post by Enavor)
    I don't believe welfare should be cut, but it most certainly needs reformed.
    Ok but I'm glad the public at large agrees that the welfare state is somewhat dysfunctional at the moment.
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    (Original post by ~Duke)
    Who are the other vulnerable people?
    The workshy probably
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    (Original post by a729)
    For me it's clear that welfare is a huge detriment to our society. Welfare doesn't motivate people at all and it gives people the incentive to do nothing. To make things worse -- paying for welfare requires us to punish success. We basically take money away from successful people and redistribute it to the unsuccessful.

    Drop out of high-school to do drugs? No problem! We'll just take money away from the kids who actually do the right thing and give it to you!
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...it-broods.html
    Does that seem right to anyone?

    Working hard and smart creates an obligation for you to support other people. That to me is just insanity.

    It punishes the working class when you're richer on benefits than working (after tax/NI )

    Also, redistributing wealth creates a huge system of dependency. People that are dependent on other people are clearly less free. Welfare gives more power to the wealthy in our society because it establishes a system in where the poor are indebted to the wealthy.

    There are many people better off on welfare than working

    We need less welfare and not more.

    Welfare is a PRIVILEGE not a RIGHT
    It should be a safety net NOT a lifestyle choice
    This should also accompany moves to cut tax evasion and benefit fraud
    Benefit claimants should do some community service to contribute to society. This would help end the something for nothing culture

    Welfare should only cover the GENUINE needy i.e disabled people
    Discuss.
    You may wish to do some more research other than a single Daily Mail article. I bet you enjoyed writing that up from the comfort of your dorm paid for by gov grants and loans?

    Do you have any actual facts/figures to backup your assertation that:

    "There are many people better off on welfare than working"

    You should also clarify precisely what you mean by "welfare" as welfare covers an umbrella of working & pension schemes yet you appear to focus on JSA which accounts for less than 5% of the welfare budget ironically around the same as Council Tax Rebates which you as a student qualify for and likely use, should we cut this too? Pensions accounting for 75% of the welfare budget and growing. But targeting pensioners would be extremely unpopular it's far easier to convince the public that everyone on JSA is just a work-shy scrounger?

    Source: http://www.dwp.gov.uk/publications/c.../#annualreport
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    (Original post by a729)
    No one lool!
    You?
    You're the one complaining about all the fraud not me.

    I would have thought you might have reported some of the cases you know about thats all.

    Might be more productive than posting on TSR.
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    (Original post by Quady)
    You're the one complaining about all the fraud not me.

    I would have thought you might have reported some of the cases you know about thats all.

    Might be more productive than posting on TSR.
    Bit difficult to report something he's only heard about from his mother's great aunt's first cousin-in-law's friend from Australia who lived here in the 60s who had a boyfriend once who lived in a council house next door to someone who swore to him that his sister's daughter once had a job where she knew a man who married someone who was the fourth cousin eighteen times removed of a lass who claimed JSA when she was working for Peter Bone MP when he paid people 87p an hour in 1995 and boasted about it...
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    A huge chuck of welfare benefits are going out with a huge number of people misusing it eg. that lady who kept making babies with different men to get divorce + child benefits. This reduces some of the more deserved people from getting the rewards!
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    (Original post by a729)
    For me it's clear that welfare is a huge detriment to our society. Welfare doesn't motivate people at all and it gives people the incentive to do nothing. To make things worse -- paying for welfare requires us to punish success. We basically take money away from successful people and redistribute it to the unsuccessful.

    Drop out of high-school to do drugs? No problem! We'll just take money away from the kids who actually do the right thing and give it to you!
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...it-broods.html
    Does that seem right to anyone?

    Working hard and smart creates an obligation for you to support other people. That to me is just insanity.

    It punishes the working class when you're richer on benefits than working (after tax/NI )

    Also, redistributing wealth creates a huge system of dependency. People that are dependent on other people are clearly less free. Welfare gives more power to the wealthy in our society because it establishes a system in where the poor are indebted to the wealthy.

    There are many people better off on welfare than working

    We need less welfare and not more.

    Welfare is a PRIVILEGE not a RIGHT
    It should be a safety net NOT a lifestyle choice
    This should also accompany moves to cut tax evasion and benefit fraud
    Benefit claimants should do some community service to contribute to society. This would help end the something for nothing culture

    Welfare should only cover the GENUINE needy i.e disabled people
    Discuss.
    Yes you are correct in stating that there are scroungers and all, but you have to look at the whole situation in perspective to realize that actually, only 17% of total Government spending goes to welfare. So realistically, more of the taxpayers money goes towards pensions and healthcare.
    Here's a diagram to be able to see the Government's total spending for 2013 so far: http://www.economicshelp.org/blog/14...-its-money-on/
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    I started reading this topic with a slight prejudice which I admit was wrong. However when I read into the thread I was more than disappointed at what I had read.

    I live alone with my dad who is now retired with health problems. My mother died when I was young, and My dad has done everything he could to make sure I kept on with my studies and got myself through into college, and now looking at possibly going to university.

    Up until now, we have lived on approximately £100 a week, Which has barely been enough to keep the electric meter topped up, paid bills, and left us just enough money to pay for other essentials such as food, and clothing. The government now tell us that we are going to have to get by on £58 a week. For the love of god will someone please explain to me, How cutting benefits, and welfare for people who are already poor, and literally living on the breadline, is going to help our economy in the slightest?

    When all the while, we have a House of Lords, who we cannot elect as a nation, and whose expenses are hidden from us, and when we have a house of Commons who appears to be open, but tries to avoid allowing us to see their expenses. Why in God's name, are we as human beings allowing our own government to treat us in this way. I feel like my sense of national pride is diminishing every single time day. Our income is being cut, while our spending is increasing.

    Our internet bills have increasing by at least £2 quarterly for several years now, Taxes are set to increase soon, and a wonderful bedroom tax to add to it. While Rich pricks like Mr Cameron, sit on their lazy backsides in the houses of parliament living off the holes in our pockets while hurling insults left and right at each other.

    I for one am sick and tired of living in a country that literally steals from the poorest to give to the rich. We need a real life Robin Hood, who increases Taxes for people who have a very large net worth, and forcing companies to pay taxes properly (Cough Cough "Starbucks"). Maybe then, this country could move forward.

    We cannot go on in this way, or we may find that we have plenty of redundancies, and people start losing their own homes.

    I for one can't wait to finish University, as when I have my degree, I will work as hard and as fast as I can to leave this country for good, before it truly is a 3rd world.

    The Truth is, we have had a series of successive governments, who have delighted in making the gap between rich and poor, wider, and wider.

    As a final note, because I'm unsure, but I think I have a good guess at the answer: How much of those pensions do you think go to ex Politicians, who have now retired, or ex Police Commissioners?

    Why don't they take one for the team, and reduce their own pay and pensions to suit the rest of the country? Maybe then Welfare might not be such a big deal.
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    (Original post by Skilled)
    A huge chuck of welfare benefits are going out with a huge number of people misusing it eg. that lady who kept making babies with different men to get divorce + child benefits. This reduces some of the more deserved people from getting the rewards!
    Exactly!
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    (Original post by JCheung95)
    Yes you are correct in stating that there are scroungers and all, but you have to look at the whole situation in perspective to realize that actually, only 17% of total Government spending goes to welfare. So realistically, more of the taxpayers money goes towards pensions and healthcare.
    Here's a diagram to be able to see the Government's total spending for 2013 so far: http://www.economicshelp.org/blog/14...-its-money-on/
    But it's easier to cut welfare by getting people into work or to work more hours than to take money from pensioners*

    * unless you means test all like the Winter fuel allowance
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    The welfare system is something that has to be there, we can't ignore the people who genuinely need help, but the issue i have is with people who have a claim/benefit culture. People who moan "how can we live off £58 per week", when they are perfectly able to spend money on drugs, alcohol and also perfectly capable to work.

    It is the people who misuse the welfare system that are causing problems who legitimately use it as a safety net, they are the reason why it is getting changed so dramatically.
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    http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer...-movement.html
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    (Original post by -Sense)
    I live alone with my dad who is now retired with health problems. My mother died when I was young, and My dad has done everything he could to make sure I kept on with my studies and got myself through into college, and now looking at possibly going to university.

    Up until now, we have lived on approximately £100 a week, Which has barely been enough to keep the electric meter topped up, paid bills, and left us just enough money to pay for other essentials such as food, and clothing. The government now tell us that we are going to have to get by on £58 a week. For the love of god will someone please explain to me, How cutting benefits, and welfare for people who are already poor, and literally living on the breadline, is going to help our economy in the slightest?
    No-one knows your personal circumstances. Is your father of pensionable age? You say he retired due to ill health - does he receive ESA? What strand?

    I mean really, you've not provided enough information there. Anyway, welfare reform is designed to do two main things: stop the inflating welfare budget at a time when we'd be better off spending money in other places and, secondly, to end the perversities of the system which encouraged worklessness. Worklessness is not only a scourge on our economy, but also causes major harm to the people who have effectively been tossed on the ****-heap.

    Our internet bills have increasing by at least £2 quarterly for several years now, Taxes are set to increase soon, and a wonderful bedroom tax to add to it.
    You have a spare room? I work full time and I realistically couldn't afford a spare bedroom. I can't say I've got much sympathy if that's where you choose to spend your money.

    While Rich pricks like Mr Cameron, sit on their lazy backsides in the houses of parliament living off the holes in our pockets while hurling insults left and right at each other.
    David Cameron, like all prime ministers, works extremely hard and gets paid relatively poorly for it. Show some bloody respect.

    I for one am sick and tired of living in a country that literally steals from the poorest to give to the rich.
    This is the sort of entitlement complex that pisses people off. It is not literally stealing anything. The state is supporting you - and indeed it seems that support is being spent on a few luxuries into the bargain. You are benefiting from other people and from the policies of the Government, but yet you want to throw it back in our faces and claim that a reduction in benefits is theft from you? Go to hell.

    I for one can't wait to finish University, as when I have my degree, I will work as hard and as fast as I can to leave this country for good, before it truly is a 3rd world.
    Great, so we not only support you, educate you and pay for your degree, you're then going to up and leave to spite the country that it seems has provided you with everything?

    Why don't they take one for the team, and reduce their own pay and pensions to suit the rest of the country? Maybe then Welfare might not be such a big deal.
    They did. Ministerial salaries were cut under the current government. Not that you've even bothered to notice. However, here's a key point: they work hard for their salary. They could be earning far more in the private sector, yet have to put up with endless bull-**** from the likes of you. They work out of a sense of civic duty and for the good of this country - something that it seems you have absolutely no conception of.

    Those politicians that you complain about are twice the man you are.
 
 
 
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