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    I'm not sure Djoko was off his game so much as he let silly things annoy him, especially during the second and third sets when he was getting increasingly irate with the umpire. I thought Murray was pretty good though - and very impressed both in the semis and the finals where he had the emotional strength to not go to pieces when things didn't go his way.

    I thought there was some great points throughout the match and the way the flow of the game kept changing with the breaks of serve made it tense. A good final, not just because our boy Andy made it. Massive congrats to him and thoroughly well deserved. I wonder how well he would've done at RG if it weren't for his back...
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    (Original post by Xotol)
    Disagree strongly. Djokovic is still easily one of the most mentally tough of all time - you don't lose that. He just lost today to a better competitor and he was off his game. He won in the Aussie Open this year though, that doesn't count?

    Talk about over reaction. I'm sure he's sorry he can't win three slams and win 42 straight games every year in the toughest era of tennis. :rolleyes:

    Still best player in the world.
    It's just a trend that I've noticed in the past six months. It's hardly an over-reaction, firstly because I didn't suggest that he was no longer the best player in the world (currently), and secondly because I didn't state that the observed trend was irreversible. As for 2011, that was in reference to the standard of his performance rather than the results per se (which probably wouldn't be reproduced regardless).
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    Pinnacle, hero, just thrilled for the man.

    Icing on the cake: doing Nadal next year on Court Philippe Chatrier. In the final, of course.
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    (Original post by rockrunride)
    Pinnacle, hero, just thrilled for the man.

    Icing on the cake: doing Nadal next year on Court Philippe Chatrier. In the final, of course.
    Never will we see that, at least until Nadal hits 32.
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    (Original post by Ashnard)
    The weird thing is that he used to be considered one of the most mentally tough players of all time, but now he seems to throw away leads in the most pathetic fashion (e.g. RG 2013, Wimbledon 2013). That 2011 year is beginning to feel increasingly like an anomaly.

    He also lost earlier this year to a geriatric, a baby, and a pigeon.
    Let me guess what two of those are : baby-nadal, pigeon-murray
    Geriatric is left for federer I suppose
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    (Original post by Xotol)
    Disagree strongly. Djokovic is still easily one of the most mentally tough of all time - you don't lose that. He just lost today to a better competitor and he was off his game. He won in the Aussie Open this year though, that doesn't count?

    Talk about over reaction. I'm sure he's sorry he can't win three slams and win 42 straight games every year in the toughest era of tennis. :rolleyes:

    Still best player in the world.



    Novak will be out for revenge and really hungry for it. Think he'll take it over Murray, although it's so incredibly close, especially with Del Potro back in the mix.
    I know some will disagree with me but djokovic is still better than murray. He was the superior one in the rallies today. But it just wasn't his day. I think it is unfair on nadal, federer and djokovic to think murray is ahead of them. Skill wise these players are way more superior. At 26, mur has only won 2 grand slams. I am pretty sure this number wouldn't increase by more than 4 in the future. There will be too many obstacles in the form of players for him
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    (Original post by Ashnard)
    It's just a trend that I've noticed in the past six months. It's hardly an over-reaction, firstly because I didn't suggest that he was no longer the best player in the world (currently), and secondly because I didn't state that the observed trend was irreversible. As for 2011, that was in reference to the standard of his performance rather than the results per se (which probably wouldn't be reproduced regardless).
    I actually think Novak is playing close to the level he was in 2011, maybe even on par. It's just that his opponents have generally gotten better and he's no longer meeting Rafa in the finals of non-clay surface, who he's got a vice grip on.

    Murray has improved massively since 2011 and is pretty much on Novak's level right now. You can't count out Federer either who is really good against Djokovic even at his advancing age.

    Results since his supposed decline in 2012:

    AO: W over Nadal
    FO: F loss to Nadal
    W: SF loss to Federer
    UO: F loss to Murray

    AO: W over Murray
    FO: SF loss to Nadal (might as well have been the final)
    W: F loss to Murray

    So, yeah, he's still very consistent, has won 5/11 slams since the beginning of 2011, reached 3 more finals, and 3 more SFs. Not to mention the tour finals win in 2012 as well as many other ATP wins.

    All his losses in the GS come to the other top 4 giants. The competition is just ridiculous right now, but we shall see in the US Open.
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    (Original post by MJK91)
    Never will we see that, at least until Nadal hits 32.
    Nadal is the iron man. He cannot lose to a player of only 2 grand slams at 26.
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    (Original post by MJK91)
    Never will we see that, at least until Nadal hits 32.
    Would be nice though. Someone has to topple the clay king.
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    (Original post by nothepreacher)
    I know some will disagree with me but djokovic is still better than murray. He was the superior one in the rallies today. But it just wasn't his day. I think it is unfair on nadal, federer and djokovic to think murray is ahead of them. Skill wise these players are way more superior. At 26, mur has only won 2 grand slams. I am pretty sure this number wouldn't increase by more than 4 in the future. There will be too many obstacles in the form of players for him
    Murray is quite clearly superior to Nadal and Federer right now (overall) and it's a toss up as to who's the best in the world between Murray and Djokovic IMO. Very close. The thing that's going for Novak is that he's performed far better on clay recently and is the only one that has pushed Nadal quite close. I'd still fancy him on hard courts overall too, but Murray is clearly better on grass.

    All time? Yeah, no question, Murray is still a long way behind those three, but he's still got time to stamp his name high on the all time list.
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    (Original post by nothepreacher)
    Nadal is the iron man. He cannot lose to a player of only 2 grand slams at 26.
    Murray will never ever in his wildest dreams beat Nadal at French Open but he can surely have a great chance when Nadals retired and Djoker injured.
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    (Original post by Ultimate1)
    Yep very strong era this, when you have top 20 players mugging out in first round of grand slams or the 3 rd ranked pkayer in the world getting ***** slapped all the time in the semis of grand slams. Yes it's a very strong era when the same players make the semis/finals time and time again. There's more to tennis than just the top players, the strength in depth of the tennis field is severely lacking outside of the top 5.

    I know instantly whenever makes the "zomg strongest era everzzz" claim that they have probably not watched tennis before 2011 and more than likely only ever watch the slams, no masters, 500, 250 and probably don't even know that challengers exist.
    That is just a ridiculous insult to the likes of Tsonga, del Potro and Berdych who are all capable of beating the top guys. In fact, on his current form del Potro is one of the top guys, especially now the tour is going onto the North American hard courts.
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    (Original post by Xotol)
    Murray is quite clearly superior to Nadal and Federer right now (overall) and it's a toss up as to who's the best in the world between Murray and Djokovic IMO. Very close. The thing that's going for Novak is that he's performed far better on clay recently and is the only one that has pushed Nadal quite close. I'd still fancy him on hard courts overall too, but Murray is clearly better on grass.

    All time? Yeah, no question, Murray is still a long way behind those three, but he's still got time to stamp his name high on the all time list.
    How is Murray Superior to Nadal loool ridiculous statement :eek:
    In 2012 Murray's peak Murray won Olympics and US open and this year he has one Miami masters and Wimbledon compared to Nadal since 2012 who has won 2012 French Open and 2013 there level with 2 slams each where as Nadal's been injured and still won more trophies in 2012 he 2 Masters and 2013 he won 3 Masters so that 5 Masters vs 1 and 2slams vs 2slams. Nadal beat Nole who is more Superior Murray on clay. Since Murray's peak Nadal has won more Trophies.Murray has a long way to go before you can include him in a conversation with Rafa.
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    (Original post by Xotol)
    Murray is quite clearly superior to Nadal and Federer right now (overall) and it's a toss up as to who's the best in the world between Murray and Djokovic IMO. Very close. The thing that's going for Novak is that he's performed far better on clay recently and is the only one that has pushed Nadal quite close. I'd still fancy him on hard courts overall too, but Murray is clearly better on grass.

    All time? Yeah, no question, Murray is still a long way behind those three, but he's still got time to stamp his name high on the all time list.
    I'm not sure if he's superior to Nadal at the moment. It remains to be seen if Nadal can finally sort out his knee problems, but other than the Roland Garros, he did win three Masters titles (one of which was on hard court) in his short time on tour this season so far.
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    For the US Open it would have to be:

    Murray
    Djokovic
    del Potro
    Everyone else

    Of course, we'll have a much better understanding of where everyone is at in a month or so but right now it is between those three for me.
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    (Original post by ubi1)
    Murray will never ever in his wildest dreams beat Nadal at French Open but he can surely have a great chance when Nadals retired and Djoker injured.
    There is definitely a chance of him beating Nadal at the French Open, he just needs to get his tactics right on clay, and play out of his skin. Obviously though, the chance of beating him isn't very great. Why does Djokovic have to be injured for Murray to have a great chance? They're both roughly as good as each other overall (Djokovic probably slightly better), so we can see some pretty close games, especially at Roland Garros. Murray's become a better player over the last year, especially on grass, so there's no reason why he can't do the same on clay? He has the full package IMO.
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    Djokovic came so close to beating Nadal at the French, so i don't know why Nadal is still considered this unbeatable force who'll continue to sweep all before him at RG. It's going to be getting harder to defend it each year, with the strain he puts on himself and his constant injuries now. I wouldn't be surprised if he only won 1 more RG and that was the end of his slam winning..
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    Still Rafa is winning more trophies in Murray's prime. Sure this is Murray's moment but hes still got a lot to do. On a positive note Last person to do the Queens and Wimby Double was Nadal, Murray has joined him.
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    Murray wins Wimbledon!

    Happy he's done and it was fully deserved. First full match seen of his this Wimbledon and he showed great determinaton to win it from ball one. Djokovic was a tad disappointing, expected more from him although he had alot of unforced errors that knocked his concentration. Maybe that semi final knocked the stuffing out of him for today, especially playing in hot conditions but both guys had a day off, up to them to use it wisely.

    Two Slams for Murray and he could win many more. Winning on clay will be extremely tough as long as Nadal's around but he's got a shot at the Australian Open.
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    (Original post by Mastermind2)
    There is definitely a chance of him beating Nadal at the French Open, he just needs to get his tactics right on clay, and play out of his skin. Obviously though, the chance of beating him isn't very great. Why does Djokovic have to be injured for Murray to have a great chance? They're both roughly as good as each other overall (Djokovic probably slightly better), so we can see some pretty close games, especially at Roland Garros. Murray's become a better player over the last year, especially on grass, so there's no reason why he can't do the same on clay? He has the full package IMO.
    Are you crazy Murray can never beat Nadal on Clay when I mean Never I mean never. And Djokovic is far better than Murray on clay Murray maybe better than Nole on Grass but not Clay.

    Bro ONE simply doesn't beat Rafael in best of 5 set match on Clay law of RG and Clay.
 
 
 
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