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What makes Tobacco or Alcohol better than other drugs? Watch

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    Hi,

    Firstly-Marijuana

    I just wondered whether you think Marijuana should or shouldn't be legalised. I guess the benefits of it are that it is a relaxant and a painkiller and long term effects are no worse than alcohol. From personal experience with others, it seems to effect memory to varying degrees, I asked a guy when his birthday was an he says 'I dunno' and I asked another guy who his kid's mom was and he also says 'I dunno'. Maybe from a productivity standpoint that's bad if a salesperson,marketer or accountant says 'dunno' (one of my good friends drives over 90mph and he smokes marijuana so it's a bit of a scary experience)!!!!

    How is it marijuana is legal in some states in the USA but banned federally? I thought federal law supercedes state?

    Secondly-Cancer causers
    If I recall correctly, smoking has some health benefits including preventing parkinsons disease but at the expense of cancer. Why is it smoking and asbestos are the only confirmed causes of cancer yet there's no definitive answer on marijuana,anabolic/androgenic steroids, some artificial sweetners (saccharin is confirmed in rats I believe and asparatame's had no conclusion), soya,beetlenut and burnt foods.

    Thirdly-other drugs
    If marijuana were to be legalised for being a relaxant and painkiller, couldn't cocaine and speed be used as alternatives to caffeine? I actually don't know the difference between cocaine and speed. You could also legalise heroine as it's an opiod. Couldn't the argument against legalising drugs be that safer alternatives already exist?
    Alcohol and tobacco are legal so marijuana could also be but as I stated earlier, people are stoned earlier in the day and for longer when smoking marijuana :/ Couldn't (or shouldn't) alchohol and tobacco be banned from public places (including restaurants and parties for the former[not everyone who goes to parties drinks]) and for marijuana couldn't bars be set up. Heck, I guess you could also say the same for crack bars.

    Finally, opiods (from experience not only with celebrities but with familiy members) are highly addictive painkillers and seem to have terrible side effects (they make people delirious and stop them breathing for good ) Shouldn't a safer alternative to opiods be researched as from experience with family members, they keep wanting more and saying they are in pain but if they don't have it they scream in pain. Even with smaller doses by syringe it didn't work and a family member died in their sleep


    and yes I posted this thread a long time ago
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    nothing, they're ****e and they're all we're allowed. **** the both of them. There are far better substances out there, and better for you too.
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    Media, propaganda, advertising, in short society's perception of them which then infiltrates into individual's minds.
    I suppose scientifically we know that if you smoke one cigarette, you'll likely have no effects from it but if you take a dodgy pill your body can react badly and it can be fatal.
    If you drink a glass of wine a day, again likely no effect-but if you have a bad trip on acid and react badly to it, you can end up dead.
    In short, drug use and drug ABUSE are too different things altogether, and all drugs are harmful when abused.
    *Disclaimer, I'm no expert-I drink far too much alcohol and have smoked in the past, but I've never taken anything else.
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    (Original post by sugarmouse)
    Media, propaganda, advertising, in short society's perception of them which then infiltrates into individual's minds.
    I suppose scientifically we know that if you smoke one cigarette, you'll likely have no effects from it but if you take a dodgy pill your body can react badly and it can be fatal.
    If you drink a glass of wine a day, again likely no effect-but if you have a bad trip on acid and react badly to it, you can end up dead.
    In short, drug use and drug ABUSE are too different things altogether, and all drugs are harmful when abused.
    *Disclaimer, I'm no expert-I drink far too much alcohol and have smoked in the past, but I've never taken anything else.
    But why did they choose those two things as opposed to other drugs? Even when people say Marijuana should be legalised due to not having drawbacks (which it does) you could argue other drugs like speed and cocaine have benefits too.
    Plus why is smoking the only confirmed cancer causer? Asbestos too I guess but there are plenty of other things claimed to cause caner.

    Btw-i've also smoked a couple of times (Shisha) and drank but have given both things up in pursuit of a studly physique and wanting to be good at martial arts (including MMA if I ever get good at individual styles)!!!!!
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    I'd mostly think it is because weaker drugs tend to lead to harder, more dangerous ones. Now although many drugs do not have a large death rate, they affect your mentality (schizophrenia in young people has been linked to marijuana) and cause slow decay. I know that partially through the press (which you could fairly argue is bias) but also because of the "not-so-nice" area I come from, I know a lot of people, personally, that have become addicted to drugs and it has ruined their lives.

    University prospects, to dropping out of college onto benefits in just months. Smoking and alcohol TENDS (not always) to not affect social/work/educational life so much, and so are deemed not as bad, I believe?
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    It doesn't cause long term damage if you stop using it, unlike a lot of other drugs.

    That's the only plausible reason I can think of, although out being so widely used is probably another.
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    (Original post by ronki23)
    But why did they choose those two things as opposed to other drugs? Even when people say Marijuana should be legalised due to not having drawbacks (which it does) you could argue other drugs like speed and cocaine have benefits too.
    Plus why is smoking the only confirmed cancer causer? Asbestos too I guess but there are plenty of other things claimed to cause caner.

    Btw-i've also smoked a couple of times (Shisha) and drank but have given both things up in pursuit of a studly physique and wanting to be good at martial arts (including MMA if I ever get good at individual styles)!!!!!
    That sir, I cannot answer!But It's a very good question and one I'd love to find the answer to as well.I can only think it's something to do with money.Also, because smoking is such a simple 'substance to lungs' thing isn't it..If you're putting something into the organs that help you breathe.... It's going to be researched-and with it being legal and a common activity -more people smoke than (will admit to) take other drugs, so it's going to be better researched and financed and documented.
    I only ever smoked whilst I was drinking alcohol. I switched to a vapouriser recently and feel much better for it, but then there's been health scares around those, too.
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    they are not, no one is saying they are... but both are an ingrained part of society... there would be a fuore if they were "banned"... it wouldn't word. look at prohibition. the reason they are legal and others are not is practicality. just because they may be equal to or worse than other illegal substances does not mean we should just allow EVERYTHING.

    personally i am only against heroin (and drugs of similar nastiness) being illegal and drug DEALING, not posession.

    weed i don't care they can deal that if they want as long as it's monitored and handled properly, nothing dodgy.
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    They're the biggest killers out there, so nothing. Possession of all drugs should be decriminalized, and anything that is provably safer than/on par with alcohol - weed, MDMA/ecstasy, LSD, psilocybin, ket, maybe coke - should be made legal and readily available, although controlled, in order to curb alcohol use and reduce the number of deaths caused by said poison.
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    The statistics that prove alcohol and smoking kills are as concrete than other drugs do not: very, very shaky. It is only safe to assume that everything in the world is bad for you, with the exception of asparagus.


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    (Original post by Suetonius)
    They're the biggest killers out there, so nothing. Possession of all drugs should be decriminalized, and anything that is provably safer than/on par with alcohol - weed, MDMA/ecstasy, LSD, psilocybin, ket, maybe coke - should be made legal and readily available, although controlled, in order to curb alcohol use and reduce the number of deaths caused by said poison.
    But even controlling the amount still leads to problem- example is the sheer number of drunks in the UK every Friday and Saturday night! I'm sure if legalising it would not end the illegal trade of it if people try to avoid duties and taxes.

    But yes, i'm more interested why smoking has only been confirmed to cause cancer. You could argue marijuana was around at the same time as tobacco and alcohol when it was grown in South America and India. You could also argue the same for Opiods and the growth of Poppies??
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    Quick thought: perhaps more research has gone into finding things "bad" about cigarettes? Would be a good deterrent to stop people using them. Far less widespread drugs would be less of an issue, so research would not be focused there?

    Not confirming anything there, just an idea


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    Popular =/= better. Justin Bieber is popular, popular opinion should be ignored.

    Everyone prefers different drugs. If I had to rank my favourites I would go with Opiates as the best. MDMA in a close second, third would be acid, fourth would be certain RC's (2cp, 2ci, 25i etc) and fifth would be marijuana. I smoke tobacco but it doesnt do anything for me and I dont really care for alchohol.

    The only argument you need for legalisation/decriminalisation is pretty simple. Prohibition does not work, it never has and never will.

    Legalisation would probably decrease usage overtime of the harder stuff if we use Portugal as an example (although I think they have only decriminalized).

    The vast majority of the really bad stuff associated with drug use (gang warfare, overdoses, petty theft, etc.) is directly caused by prohibition. If you could buy good quality heroin OTC it would be really ****ing difficult to overdose with it. It would also be really ****ing cheap so petty theft wouldnt be as much of an issue, funding an addiction would probaly be cheaper than cigarettes (in the UK at least, I reckon you would be able to get a heroin prescription like in the 50s/60s). And cartels? Dont you mean South American Drugs Inc.

    I've gone off on a bit of a tangent but the whole bull**** legalisation debate is really annoying me now. Prohibition does not work. End of discussion. Sure some people will be a bit silly and might become addicts or die but that already happens. Honest drug education would be a better solution than prohibition.
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    (Original post by TheJoshwha)
    The statistics that prove alcohol and smoking kills are as concrete than other drugs do not: very, very shaky. It is only safe to assume that everything in the world is bad for you, with the exception of asparagus.


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    Ah but asparagus produces foul smelling urine, so we can conclude that indeed everything is bad for you in the world.
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    If alcohol was invented today there's no way it would be legal...
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    (Original post by ed-)
    If alcohol was invented today there's no way it would be legal...
    It's a brilliant recrystalisation solvent though =P
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    (Original post by Zubby77)
    Ah but asparagus produces foul smelling urine, so we can conclude that indeed everything is bad for you in the world.
    Not for everyone...

    http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...0928111231.htm

    Asparagus is perfectly safe for some of us.

    Those of us with non-foul-smelling urine after eating asparagus will not let those smelly-wee individuals defame such a beautiful vegetable.
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    Nothing. People are just stupid and believe everything they get told by the media and society. For example:

    "Drugs are bad, but it's totally acceptable to get pissed every weekend until you fall on the floor."
    "Drugs are bad, that's why they're illegal."
    "They said on TV that weed makes you lazy and stupid, it must apply to every single stoner."

    I could go on about this forever but there's no point. Stupid people are gonna be stupid, if you enjoy drugs just do them and ignore those *****.
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    There is nothing that ought to make us think that alcohol and tobacco are in any way 'better' (except from the point of view of individual preference) - in fact, by almost any objective measure of social utility, cannabis would come out on top of these two. The reason we hold different attitudes to these drugs is almost totally down to tradition. Alcohol and tobacco are culturally accepted, whereas cannabis and others are not.

    My personal view on drug law is that we should totally end the prohibition of all recreational drugs. If we are legitimately concerned for the people whom they harm, then let's respect them and offer them services to help them, respect their right to autonomy of self, and recognise that continued prohibition does absolutely more harm than good to a far greater number of people than the ones whom we're trying to protect. All we accomplish with prohibition is the fuelling of violence, profit for organised crime and danger from the various 'legal highs'. Continued prohibition is not only immoral, but also impractical.
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    (Original post by DankJ)
    Popular =/= better. Justin Bieber is popular, popular opinion should be ignored.

    Everyone prefers different drugs. If I had to rank my favourites I would go with Opiates as the best. MDMA in a close second, third would be acid, fourth would be certain RC's (2cp, 2ci, 25i etc) and fifth would be marijuana. I smoke tobacco but it doesnt do anything for me and I dont really care for alchohol.

    The only argument you need for legalisation/decriminalisation is pretty simple. Prohibition does not work, it never has and never will.

    Legalisation would probably decrease usage overtime of the harder stuff if we use Portugal as an example (although I think they have only decriminalized).

    The vast majority of the really bad stuff associated with drug use (gang warfare, overdoses, petty theft, etc.) is directly caused by prohibition. If you could buy good quality heroin OTC it would be really ****ing difficult to overdose with it. It would also be really ****ing cheap so petty theft wouldnt be as much of an issue, funding an addiction would probaly be cheaper than cigarettes (in the UK at least, I reckon you would be able to get a heroin prescription like in the 50s/60s). And cartels? Dont you mean South American Drugs Inc.

    I've gone off on a bit of a tangent but the whole bull**** legalisation debate is really annoying me now. Prohibition does not work. End of discussion. Sure some people will be a bit silly and might become addicts or die but that already happens. Honest drug education would be a better solution than prohibition.
    You could argue that legal alcohol is still bad though; thousands of people get pissed daily and hundreds cause the countries' A and E problems?

    Though i'm interested in why one can't OD on good quality heroin
 
 
 
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