Why isn't Britain 'leading' the EU?
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Original post by theoracle01
Hello all,
This is mainly due to my lack of historical context in relation to this subject. After reading several articles about the recent Cypriot crisis, I've noticed a lot of anti-German sentiment throughout all of the financially-troubled countires, such as Italy, Portugal, Greece and so forth. However, this simply made me think... why isn't Britain itself leading the EU? I realise we as a country have been very much 'towing the line', trying to reap the benefits of being in the EU, without having to fully commit, but why is Germany, in comparison a relatively 'new' state, taking charge instead of us, or even France? With us being a former Empire and (arguable) superpower, does it not make more sense that we would want to take the reigns of a potential for a United Europe?
This is mainly due to my lack of historical context in relation to this subject. After reading several articles about the recent Cypriot crisis, I've noticed a lot of anti-German sentiment throughout all of the financially-troubled countires, such as Italy, Portugal, Greece and so forth. However, this simply made me think... why isn't Britain itself leading the EU? I realise we as a country have been very much 'towing the line', trying to reap the benefits of being in the EU, without having to fully commit, but why is Germany, in comparison a relatively 'new' state, taking charge instead of us, or even France? With us being a former Empire and (arguable) superpower, does it not make more sense that we would want to take the reigns of a potential for a United Europe?
Who is in the Eurozone?
Hi, Why would we want to lead an insitution whose currency destroys countries.
That costs billions and billions to bail out countries that are 0.2 percent of the EU's GDP? (Cyprus)
That costs billions and billions to bail out countries that are 0.2 percent of the EU's GDP? (Cyprus)
Original post by Londonburger
Nahhhh, when it comes to the EU issues on our far eastern medias, Germany is always referred to the a solute leader, France is usually a follower of Germany, while Britain is constantly described as a witness...
Posted from TSR Mobile
Posted from TSR Mobile
Hmmm.. Sure, Germany is the leader from the only reasons because it gives the most bailouts to Greece and other countries in emergency. + Germany is the greatest economy in Europe (Prussian discipline).
Although you underestimate the British power within the EU, the UK should do the same as Germany but better. Beside that, it would be a good think if the UK be more good toward Eastern Europeans. They can be very faithful allies.
Original post by theoracle01
Hello all,
This is mainly due to my lack of historical context in relation to this subject. After reading several articles about the recent Cypriot crisis, I've noticed a lot of anti-German sentiment throughout all of the financially-troubled countires, such as Italy, Portugal, Greece and so forth. However, this simply made me think... why isn't Britain itself leading the EU? I realise we as a country have been very much 'towing the line', trying to reap the benefits of being in the EU, without having to fully commit, but why is Germany, in comparison a relatively 'new' state, taking charge instead of us, or even France? With us being a former Empire and (arguable) superpower, does it not make more sense that we would want to take the reigns of a potential for a United Europe?
This is mainly due to my lack of historical context in relation to this subject. After reading several articles about the recent Cypriot crisis, I've noticed a lot of anti-German sentiment throughout all of the financially-troubled countires, such as Italy, Portugal, Greece and so forth. However, this simply made me think... why isn't Britain itself leading the EU? I realise we as a country have been very much 'towing the line', trying to reap the benefits of being in the EU, without having to fully commit, but why is Germany, in comparison a relatively 'new' state, taking charge instead of us, or even France? With us being a former Empire and (arguable) superpower, does it not make more sense that we would want to take the reigns of a potential for a United Europe?
Quite simply because we are prats, we are constantly given the chance to exercise power and we shy away. Before WW2 there was a movement to create an Imperial Federation, it never happened and we had a pretty mess to the end of the empire. After Suez it now turns out that France wanted "union" with us (again a great opportunity) but we turned it down. After this France then took a German focus and we see the development of the EU with the UK a late entry. Since then we have being an onlooker, always having the potential to act but rarely doing so in a massive way.
It's a missed opportunity in hindsight because our population size and economy would grant us major leverage in Europe, especially since the UK and German share a broadly similar ethos. In one way i'm glad because the EU and Eurozone are half measures but then perhaps we'd have had a different way of doing things.
Original post by Black Cat
Britain doesn't want to be part of the EU that's the reason and as stated above.
Germany and france have already established leadership
Germany and france have already established leadership
Britain is the part of the EU since 1973.
Original post by theoracle01
Hello all,
This is mainly due to my lack of historical context in relation to this subject. After reading several articles about the recent Cypriot crisis, I've noticed a lot of anti-German sentiment throughout all of the financially-troubled countires, such as Italy, Portugal, Greece and so forth. However, this simply made me think... why isn't Britain itself leading the EU? I realise we as a country have been very much 'towing the line', trying to reap the benefits of being in the EU, without having to fully commit, but why is Germany, in comparison a relatively 'new' state, taking charge instead of us, or even France? With us being a former Empire and (arguable) superpower, does it not make more sense that we would want to take the reigns of a potential for a United Europe?
This is mainly due to my lack of historical context in relation to this subject. After reading several articles about the recent Cypriot crisis, I've noticed a lot of anti-German sentiment throughout all of the financially-troubled countires, such as Italy, Portugal, Greece and so forth. However, this simply made me think... why isn't Britain itself leading the EU? I realise we as a country have been very much 'towing the line', trying to reap the benefits of being in the EU, without having to fully commit, but why is Germany, in comparison a relatively 'new' state, taking charge instead of us, or even France? With us being a former Empire and (arguable) superpower, does it not make more sense that we would want to take the reigns of a potential for a United Europe?
Britain is totally dependent to USA
If Britain will be the leader of the EU all Europe will dependent
on Britain -> USA
France and Germany laid the founding stones for the EU, and have been the de facto leaders ever since.
Britain only started to get involved in the 70's/80's. They see us as only being in the EU for the benefits, and trying to avoid any consequences (such as bailing out Greece/ect.).
Britain is seen as one of the key nations in the EU. Just not as key as France and Germany.
Also, not a good precedence for the leaders of the EU to have a large population that doesn't want to be in the EU.
Britain only started to get involved in the 70's/80's. They see us as only being in the EU for the benefits, and trying to avoid any consequences (such as bailing out Greece/ect.).
Britain is seen as one of the key nations in the EU. Just not as key as France and Germany.
Also, not a good precedence for the leaders of the EU to have a large population that doesn't want to be in the EU.
(edited 11 years ago)
Because our government is weaker than a baby deer.
Original post by theoracle01
Hello all,
This is mainly due to my lack of historical context in relation to this subject. After reading several articles about the recent Cypriot crisis, I've noticed a lot of anti-German sentiment throughout all of the financially-troubled countires, such as Italy, Portugal, Greece and so forth. However, this simply made me think... why isn't Britain itself leading the EU? I realise we as a country have been very much 'towing the line', trying to reap the benefits of being in the EU, without having to fully commit, but why is Germany, in comparison a relatively 'new' state, taking charge instead of us, or even France? With us being a former Empire and (arguable) superpower, does it not make more sense that we would want to take the reigns of a potential for a United Europe?
This is mainly due to my lack of historical context in relation to this subject. After reading several articles about the recent Cypriot crisis, I've noticed a lot of anti-German sentiment throughout all of the financially-troubled countires, such as Italy, Portugal, Greece and so forth. However, this simply made me think... why isn't Britain itself leading the EU? I realise we as a country have been very much 'towing the line', trying to reap the benefits of being in the EU, without having to fully commit, but why is Germany, in comparison a relatively 'new' state, taking charge instead of us, or even France? With us being a former Empire and (arguable) superpower, does it not make more sense that we would want to take the reigns of a potential for a United Europe?
you just blew my mind.
It's because we have a fairly different identity to other European countries. Compare us with Germany, we're still revelling in our by-gone glory days of the Empire, obsessed with our complicated political system and trying to make it seem like we are best and most important friend of the USA. Germany however, has looked to the future ever since the end of WWI, but since 1945 the sentiment has been especially to integrate into Europe so as not to become alienated through its defeat in WWII. All the money that went into the country immediately after rebuilt the economy basically overnight ( the Germans often talk about their postwar economic miracle, which was never heard of in the UK), in addition the political system is one of the most stable in the world and limits the ability of extremists to take power. Therefore, Germany is a country of stability and prosperity that other European countries now look up to. Furthermore, German is actually the most widely spoken language in Europe - so the European identity in that way aligns itself with Germany. It's through this that Germany has essentially taken the reigns of control of the EU
This was posted from The Student Room's iPhone/iPad App
This was posted from The Student Room's iPhone/iPad App
EU was set up primarily by France and Germany, they wouldn't let the UK have a serious stake in the organization to effect control.
Nickth, your attitude does the UK a disservice. We revel in the days of empire? Firstly, we just don't but secondly that tone shows a massive ignorance of the British empire to begin with.
The British empire can almost be described as 'the reluctant empire'. The UK (like many of the European players) were interested in industry and trade. We were good at it. That is why it went from being a peripheral continental state to knocking France off of it's rise to superiority and becoming the dominant global power militarily, and trade wise.
A side effect of this was that it had the technological and financial base to just sort of acquire territories in it's bid to secure sources of trade and income, and protect their interests from other European competitors.
The topic of empire is complex and to shrug it off in an attempt to belittle a country for having a history involving it is concerning. The Roman empire was a more traditional empire, very much more in the market for subjugating peoples and territories, and yet no-one bemoans (aside from maybe Celtic nationalists/romanticists) the fact the Roman brought roads, organization, technologies and other trappings of civilization to places that previously lacked them.
Empires are a fact of history, they occurred the world over and they had as much benefits as they did detriments.
Thus I would like to think people will stop resorting to the intellectually self-harming attitudes of 'little Britain and her nostalgia for empire' every time someone wants to insultingly shrug off Britain or why it doesn't feel like being bent over a railing and sodomised by some foreign interest that week.
Germans have national interests, France has national interests, the UK has national interests. If the EU is proving so unpalatable to a member country perhaps the whole bloc should be asking itself what it's doing wrong rather than blaming the country in question.
Nickth, your attitude does the UK a disservice. We revel in the days of empire? Firstly, we just don't but secondly that tone shows a massive ignorance of the British empire to begin with.
The British empire can almost be described as 'the reluctant empire'. The UK (like many of the European players) were interested in industry and trade. We were good at it. That is why it went from being a peripheral continental state to knocking France off of it's rise to superiority and becoming the dominant global power militarily, and trade wise.
A side effect of this was that it had the technological and financial base to just sort of acquire territories in it's bid to secure sources of trade and income, and protect their interests from other European competitors.
The topic of empire is complex and to shrug it off in an attempt to belittle a country for having a history involving it is concerning. The Roman empire was a more traditional empire, very much more in the market for subjugating peoples and territories, and yet no-one bemoans (aside from maybe Celtic nationalists/romanticists) the fact the Roman brought roads, organization, technologies and other trappings of civilization to places that previously lacked them.
Empires are a fact of history, they occurred the world over and they had as much benefits as they did detriments.
Thus I would like to think people will stop resorting to the intellectually self-harming attitudes of 'little Britain and her nostalgia for empire' every time someone wants to insultingly shrug off Britain or why it doesn't feel like being bent over a railing and sodomised by some foreign interest that week.
Germans have national interests, France has national interests, the UK has national interests. If the EU is proving so unpalatable to a member country perhaps the whole bloc should be asking itself what it's doing wrong rather than blaming the country in question.
(edited 11 years ago)
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