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Should threads discussing moderation be allowed Watch

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    (Original post by Idle)
    With a handful of people complaining from over 1 million members..
    That is because they don't care. And who is to blame them, it's an internet forum after all.

    And 1 million members, how many of them have less than 10 posts and are inactive? Come up with better numbers please, that's just headline grabbing.
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    (Original post by RightSaidJames)
    That is your opinion. My personal opinion is that we've, overall, been constructive in explaining our reasons for the current situation and respectful of your views.



    If you feel that this is necessary you're perfectly welcome to do so.



    Again, this is a matter of opinion.

    As I said, can we please move on from the mod-bashing and reductio ad absurdum because it's clearly not getting us anywhere.
    That is a very typical mod response, as soon as you don't have someone who just accepts your nonsense, you run away and say stuff like "it won't do any good" or "going nowhere". I've had a mod tell me something like "this is stupid, i will never convince you" showing you guys are not open minded at all, and as I have said before AAM is there for you to justify yourself. That is all.
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    (Original post by RightSaidJames)
    I said that it was my personal opinion that threads discussing specific moderator actions or specific moderators shouldn't be allowed in order to protect our volunteers from abuse. I agree that we should continue to discuss this topic but I feel that comparisons to North Korea (or likewise our explanations of why we're not like North Korea) are not going to get us anywhere.
    Then stop abusing the users. Or better yet, accept that you are more than just volunteers if you take up the responsibility of being a mod.
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    (Original post by danny111)
    That is because they don't care. And who is to blame them, it's an internet forum after all.

    And 1 million members, how many of them have less than 10 posts and are inactive? Come up with better numbers please, that's just headline grabbing.
    + the number of duped accounts coming from users who got banned; trolls; etc.

    (Original post by danny111)
    That is a very typical mod response, as soon as you don't have someone who just accepts your nonsense, you run away and say stuff like "it won't do any good" or "going nowhere". I've had a mod tell me something like "this is stupid, i will never convince you" showing you guys are not open minded at all, and as I have said before AAM is there for you to justify yourself. That is all.
    Yup. Actually, the first few threads on this thread alone have shown this to be true. Here's another one actually:

    (Original post by Ape Gone Insane)
    Well yes, evidently, because certain users' situations can't be remedied for the reasons I have very clearly outlined above (the paragraph directed at danny111 which you omitted in your reply to me). Therefore these users come away dissatisfied. There's always going to be dissatisfied individuals wherever you look. You cannot create a perfect system even if we strive for one.
    Clearly? They are hardly clear; mostly vague generalizations.
    Then why bother reply to this thread anyway if you feel that you can't help the users.

    (Original post by danny111)
    Then stop abusing the users. Or better yet, accept that you are more than just volunteers if you take up the responsibility of being a mod.
    Nah, they will never get it that they are simply volunteers; and they can't get criticized because they are unable to be responsible with their own actions if they are being scrutinized by the public.

    (Original post by RightSaidJames)
    Would it be helpful if we were to submit some example replies (names and details removed of course) that demonstrate that we do in fact reverse warnings on a fairly regular basis? I would be happy to submit some of my own, but this obviously depends if admin can give us permission to do so.

    In any case, just to give you an example, here's a fictional reply that I might give to someone who (politely) complains about a minor spam warning in H&R:
    Haha! I've never gotten/read such "sweet" pretentious reply!
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    (Original post by danny111)
    I've seen this happen to many people, and I've seen threads closed down over nothing. I have found to be nothing but unhelpful.
    The vast majority of the time Mods get it right, sometimes they get it wrong because we are human, sometimes someone's post is taken out of context or mis-read. I don't know how much I can say about AAM but warnings do get overturned and just because you haven't had it occur or "many" people you know, however many is, doesn't mean it doesn't happen. The majority of decisions do stand by the original verdict because the majority of the time the moderator gets it right (If we were messing up the majority of warnings then it would be a serious problem.)

    I honestly don't know what you guys are trying to get out of this, I wish I could quote in people who I have given warnings and overturned them when I have realised I made a mistake but I can't. So really you can take my word for it or you can think I am lying for some reason, but this is just going around in circles now.
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    As for the number of users, you can see how many views this thread has received and then take a fairly accurate guess as to how many unique users have viewed the thread.

    Or we can easily provide stats on how many people have been online in the last 24 hours, and compare this to the number of people who are expressing concern in this thread.

    (Original post by kka25)
    Haha! I've never gotten/read such "sweet" pretentious reply!
    It's not prententious in my opinion and, well, perhaps you haven't received a reply like that in AAM. It still doesn't mean that they don't occur on a regular basis though, does it?

    I'm perfectly willing to provide some cases of where I have removed warnings, or where I've used an AAM thread to carefully and sympathetically explain the rules to a member and draw their attention to some rule breaking behaviour which I easily could have warned for, but didn't. In other words, to help demonstrate that AAM threads are not designed to "powerslam" the member but instead draw their attention to the rules as, believe it or not, we take no pleasure in warning and banning members. Far easier for us if people are aware of the rules and follow them.

    However, I'll probably need to check with admin before discussing this in any real detail.
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    (Original post by Ape Gone Insane)
    *snips*
    I appreciate your response. :hugs:

    I think you're wasting your time with the pair of them, mind, but I appreciate the time it took to write that.


    (Original post by danny111)
    I've seen this happen to many people, and I've seen threads closed down over nothing. I have found to be nothing but unhelpful.
    That's pretty damn impressive. How have you seen it happen to many people, when both warnings and AAM's are private?

    I can also only throw in my voice into the chorus stating that mods do apologise and warnings have been overturned. Unfortunately we can't provide proof, but it's true.

    And in the end, the closing of threads is down to the mod team. If someone wants a reason, they can go to AAM or the people involved will have been alerted or warned.
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    I don't reply to most of your points because I think they're simply wrong.

    And I just want to point something out, I don't really break the rules. I have quite a few for spamming, but that is honestly either because I don't consider it spamming myself or because at the time I didn't think about it. That is hardly anything malicious. Don't make me out like I'm some sort of evil person, constantly breaking the rules.

    And every thread I make basically someone says "look at your warning history". And that is why I feel that mods are not there to actually discuss anything.

    In addition, you do close threads down that you don't like even though there aren't any big insults going around etc. and the theme isn't against the rules.
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    (Original post by Hylean)
    I appreciate your response. :hugs:

    I think you're wasting your time with the pair of them, mind, but I appreciate the time it took to write that.




    That's pretty damn impressive. How have you seen it happen to many people, when both warnings and AAM's are private?

    I can also only throw in my voice into the chorus stating that mods do apologise and warnings have been overturned. Unfortunately we can't provide proof, but it's true.

    And in the end, the closing of threads is down to the mod team. If someone wants a reason, they can go to AAM or the people involved will have been alerted or warned.
    I've spoken to them, what else did you think :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by danny111)
    I've spoken to them, what else did you think :rolleyes:
    And assume their side of the story to be entirely correct while dismissing anything any moderator says in this thread?
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    (Original post by Idle)
    And assume their side of the story to be entirely correct while dismissing anything any moderator says in this thread?
    Yes. Why would they lie?
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    (Original post by danny111)
    Yes. Why would they lie?
    Because they're human.
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    (Original post by Mad Vlad)
    Because they're human.
    So are moderators.
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    (Original post by danny111)
    So are moderators.
    Moderators hold a position of authority however. So that means that, at some point; they have undergone a character test, and at that point been shown to be whatever quality the admins feel make a good moderator, which I would assume include trustworthiness.
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    (Original post by danny111)
    So are moderators.
    Right, I'm going to level with you here.

    It's clear you've got a serious chip on your shoulder about moderation on TSR. Your persistent ranting in this thread, your oh so hilarious signature... it's apparent that we're not going to agree here. The team has quite extensively answered and rebuked all the points you've made - we've collectively invested a lot of time on this and yet you still continue to berate us.

    We're all for having a constructive discussion about moderation - but you're not being constructive in the slightest. You're nit picking and making biased, false claims that you're wording in a fashion to cause upset and stir up support for your cause.

    You know as well as I do why you've started this caustic and negative campaign against the moderation team. Either engage with us in a measured, open minded way, or deal with it. You're wasting your time and you're wasting our time - time that we could be spending better by engaging with people that want to be constructive and help make TSR a great place to visit.
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    (Original post by Mad Vlad)
    Right, I'm going to level with you here.

    It's clear you've got a serious chip on your shoulder about moderation on TSR. Your persistent ranting in this thread, your oh so hilarious signature... it's apparent that we're not going to agree here. The team has quite extensively answered and rebuked all the points you've made - we've collectively invested a lot of time on this and yet you still continue to berate us.

    We're all for having a constructive discussion about moderation - but you're not being constructive in the slightest. You're nit picking and making biased, false claims that you're wording in a fashion to cause upset and stir up support for your cause.

    You know as well as I do why you've started this caustic and negative campaign against the moderation team. Either engage with us in a measured, open minded way, or deal with it. You're wasting your time and you're wasting our time - time that we could be spending better by engaging with people that want to be constructive and help make TSR a great place to visit.
    That sums you up. First time I saw you on AAM you moaned that you had to waste your time with me.

    Maybe you shouldn't volunteer if you are so annoyed at wasting your time?

    And I don't. Gofre is a nice mod. I have a thing against people who think they can get away with anything. And you haven't really rebuked anything. You have provided an argument that you think is sufficient. It's not.

    And what is it with you and my sig?
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    ENOUGH.

    This thread has gone on for long enough.
    This thread should be closed with immediate effect following it's hijacking of the idiotic abuse and false claims against the mods.

    Nothing positive can come out of this thread. It is being used as a platform to attack moderators and make idiotic and disproportionate comparisons to actual totalitarian societies.

    You are not born into TSR.
    You are not a citizen of TSR.
    You have been welcomed and granted permission to post on TSR, so long as you follow the rules.
    This thread is majorly off topic.
    You ACTIVELY choose to come onto TSR.
    It is not something that you start with and opt out of, you have opted in.

    If you wish to "express your freedom of speech" then feel free to start your own forum or website. Post on that.
    If you wish to post within the rules of TSR and are not banned, feel free to do that.
    But if you are here simply to troll, then simply, shut up.

    This thread should be closed with immediate effect. Or at the very least the irrelevant posts about attacking mods should be moved into a separate thread.
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    (Original post by there's too much love)
    ENOUGH.

    This thread has gone on for long enough.
    This thread should be closed with immediate effect following it's hijacking of the idiotic abuse and false claims against the mods.

    Nothing positive can come out of this thread. It is being used as a platform to attack moderators and make idiotic and disproportionate comparisons to actual totalitarian societies.

    You are not born into TSR.
    You are not a citizen of TSR.
    You have been welcomed and granted permission to post on TSR, so long as you follow the rules.
    This thread is majorly off topic.
    You ACTIVELY choose to come onto TSR.
    It is not something that you start with and opt out of, you have opted in.

    If you wish to "express your freedom of speech" then feel free to start your own forum or website. Post on that.
    If you wish to post within the rules of TSR and are not banned, feel free to do that.
    But if you are here simply to troll, then simply, shut up.

    This thread should be closed with immediate effect. Or at the very least the irrelevant posts about attacking mods should be moved into a separate thread.
    That is all very well and true, but just because this is something I choose to do, does not mean that I shouldn't try to change it for the better (as I see it). People have to go to school, there is even less choice than coming here, and yet there is a student body that discusses issues with teachers.
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    (Original post by danny111)
    That is all very well and true, but just because this is something I choose to do, does not mean that I shouldn't try to change it for the better (as I see it). People have to go to school, there is even less choice than coming here, and yet there is a student body that discusses issues with teachers.
    I haven't seen a single post of yours on this thread that has been constructive. Don't try and pull the wool with some absurd claim that you're trying to make things better, you're trying to express anger at the mods and that's all you're trying to do.
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    (Original post by there's too much love)
    I haven't seen a single post of yours on this thread that has been constructive. Don't try and pull the wool with some absurd claim that you're trying to make things better, you're trying to express anger at the mods and that's all you're trying to do.
    Arguing with them from my experience does not work. So, yes, I am being exaggerating on purpose. You can't change anything for the better if they don't even acknowledge that something is wrong.
 
 
 
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