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Doctor Who - Discussion Thread III (no untagged future spoilers) Watch

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    I liked this episode but then I have some reservations mainly because I lobes john simms as the master and for me this new actress doesn't do the character justice. Yet, I did enjoy the episode and for the first time this season cannot wait for next weeks episode. I loved capaldi in this episode he was really good and as far as the whole danny/clara story goes, logic would suggest he comes back since him and clara obviously start a family together as we've met one of their future descendants in listen. But, even still danny will in some way find a way back I think, but I hope that they don't kill the master off in the next episode after a while season of trying to figure out the character I would liske to see more of her - but I would love it if she regenerated into some different and more eccentric and crazy like the masters before her!

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    (Original post by lucaf)
    If it were a guy people might have guessed he was the master, more surprising this way
    People still did guess though, the master was one of the common theories of who she would be. Besides there would be other, better ways to keep the master reveal as a surprise. We have to wait until next week for the full explanation but it came across more "surprise, wasn't that a clever trick?" than good story telling.

    I'm not against changing the gender and the actress was clearly capable (the script was a bit dodgy for her though) but I would want the decision to be story based. Make it a clever story that explains a good female master and I would be supportive. So far I am getting general flirty female character who is the master because shock twist.

    Also another thing was the cybermen. I was hoping this story would do them justice but so far they are afterthoughts. Hope next week is better for them.
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    That was actually a pretty good episode. Almost makes up for the rest of the series. Here's hoping the second part is just as good!


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    Well that was another terrible episode.

    - Moffat creates female character as a flirty idiot who wants to kiss the doctor and call him her boyfriend
    - Moffat keeps dropping 'hints' at the end of practically every episode to something that almost everyone worked out in the first episode.
    - Similar to the River situation, Moffat thought he was being cleverer than everyone else but everyone had worked it out straight away
    - Cybermen were obvious from the off and ****ing boring
    - Doctor doesn't think to just turn the NavCom on when they get to the place to see what was happening
    - Doctor can open and close the TARDIS by clicking his fingers anyway :dontknow:
    - Clara thinking that destroying 'access' to the TARDIS was a reasonable way of saving Danny :dontknow:
    - An entire ****ing series wasted on Clara and the wet blanket of Danny Pink
    - Acting pretty poor all round

    The entire episode barely kept my attention it was so poor and telegraphed.
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    It's a shame that they'd revealed the Cybermen prior to the episode as that massively softened the impact of revealing them to be the skeletons which would have been great but very, very similar to the end of Army of Ghosts.
    I thought Michelle Gomez and Chris Addison were terrific in their roles but I was hoping that Missy would be either a Miss Hartigan kind of character (i.e. a new character) or another Time Lord other than the Master. Capaldi was excellent too.
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    Anybody else think they should have left Danny out of this episode and just generally went looking for the afterlife. They should have also kept the Cybermen out too. In the next episode you'd then have the Cybermen reveal and at the Christmas episode if Clara really is leaving then you could kill Danny and have the volcano dream as a pretty much final act where he's betrayed and leaves her or something.
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    This episode cemented something I have been thinking for a very long time: the previews/trailers for Doctor Who should be completely re-thought. Time after time there are suspenseful moments built up in the show, but then ruined because the solution has already been revealed in a trailer. The fact that cybermen were in the trailer meant we were all looking for them, which made it obvious who/what they were. If the cybermen had been omitted from the trailer, then a few may have guessed from the exoskeleton comments but it would have been much more of a surprise. If you go to the trouble of making a show with a moment that is supposed to pull the rug from under your feet, don't give it away in the previews. :grumble:

    I no longer watch the trailers at the end of the episodes (unless I'm at a friend's or something) but the trailers during the week are hard to avoid unless you just turn off all BBC channels and don't like or follow DW/BBC on any social media...!
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    Random Theory: Could the monsters in 'Flatline' have been Timelords trying to escape from the 2D Gallifrey that they got trapped in by the Doctors?
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    (Original post by leemer)
    Random Theory: Could the monsters in 'Flatline' have been Timelords trying to escape from the 2D Gallifrey that they got trapped in by the Doctors?
    I don't think so. Otherwise they would have said so when the Doctor was trying to communicate with them.
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    (Original post by Feefifofum)
    This episode cemented something I have been thinking for a very long time: the previews/trailers for Doctor Who should be completely re-thought. Time after time there are suspenseful moments built up in the show, but then ruined because the solution has already been revealed in a trailer. The fact that cybermen were in the trailer meant we were all looking for them, which made it obvious who/what they were. If the cybermen had been omitted from the trailer, then a few may have guessed from the exoskeleton comments but it would have been much more of a surprise. If you go to the trouble of making a show with a moment that is supposed to pull the rug from under your feet, don't give it away in the previews. :grumble:

    I no longer watch the trailers at the end of the episodes (unless I'm at a friend's or something) but the trailers during the week are hard to avoid unless you just turn off all BBC channels and don't like or follow DW/BBC on any social media...!
    This is what I do :yep: luckily I have the benefit of being a student so watching most of my TV online so not getting adverts between shows.
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    (Original post by GCSEsitter)
    Pretty sure they even played the old cybermen theme tune when they focused in on the 'cyber'doors
    Yeah they did, that little trumpet chord.

    I didn't watch the trailer but my god, it was horrifically obvious the corpses were Cybermen. I liked Missy's acting, she plays the crazy well, but she seems a bit of a John Simm-lite. I've kinda gotten over the "omg missy is master, master iz gurl" thing but the episode just seemed a bit cheap. What's worse is that the great potential the Master storyline has is going to be wasted by entwining it with the cheap, nonsensical Danny storyline. The phone call scene where he kept saying "I love you" and Clara's reaction, cringed so much. I don't think I've ever hated a "good" TV or Movie character before but Clara is strolling into that territory
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    Wasn't all that interesting. Even though I saw the cybermen in the thumbnail (great job BBC) it was a surprise to see that logo of their eye thing appear when they closed the door. Then it ruined the moment by putting the Russell T Davis cyberman music in.

    Also, unless they're lying about people being concious while dead, that concept makes no sense. People feel pain because of their nervous system. If their nerves have rotted, decomposed or disconnected due to the body being dead, then how does someone feel pain? Also how are the people in the matrix thing able to maintain a connection to their bodies? I know Doctor Who uses fictional and/or questionable concepts and actions but this just sounds incredibly retarded.

    Oh and it's in London present day at the end as well. Wow. And no-one cares about anything. I liked how she was just sat on the floor and he didn't do anything. You could try subduing her or something?

    This felt so ... lame. It was hilarious how it finished with just six cybermen walking and no-one of the public cared at all. I knew that secondary 'twist' was coming and I was so disappointed I was hoping they'd either use an actual Time Lady or do something new which could add to the whole Galifrey story, but when she revealed her identity, so disappointing.

    I really dislike the idea that people can change genders when regenerating because it's never happened in Doctor Who other than for satirical purposes in that Rowan Atkinson comic relief show. If they have as much change of changing gender, or race if someone wants to randomly force that on the scenario in the future, then explain why the Doctor has stayed male and white the entire show. My interpretation is that he can only stay the one race and the one gender his whole life. Please don't **** about with that.

    There wasn't a lot of weight to her anyway, I found her to be a lame 'villain' and seeing her before at the end of all those other episodes they threw her in so they can technically call this a 'series arch', she came across as just some random contrived villain who espouses quirky dialogue like 'lol you're in heaven now'. There wasn't a sense of mysteriousness about it, more like 'ok Steven Moffat just get it over with'. I never once cared about those random scenes they threw in, usually I'd care about what certain things mean.

    I feel my brain became stupid enough to not warrant emotions just by watching this.


    (Original post by Jean-Luc Picard)
    As for the shows history? They had female time lords/ladies in the classic series! Why do you hate the idea of a female master so much? Would you be outraged it the master was gay or black?

    That's not even what anyone is complaining about. They clearly stated that changing from a man to a woman is retarded because the Doctor has been so consistently white and male throughout the show, and so has the Master. And even if he wanted a sex change like real life human transgendered people, neither character would wait 900 years or whatever to get that procedure done just to feel like they're in the right body.
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    (Original post by Snagprophet)
    Wasn't all that interesting. Even though I saw the cybermen in the thumbnail (great job BBC) it was a surprise to see that logo of their eye thing appear when they closed the door. Then it ruined the moment by putting the Russell T Davis cyberman music in.

    Also, unless they're lying about people being concious while dead, that concept makes no sense. People feel pain because of their nervous system. If their nerves have rotted, decomposed or disconnected due to the body being dead, then how does someone feel pain? Also how are the people in the matrix thing able to maintain a connection to their bodies? I know Doctor Who uses fictional and/or questionable concepts and actions but this just sounds incredibly retarded.

    Oh and it's in London present day at the end as well. Wow. And no-one cares about anything. I liked how she was just sat on the floor and he didn't do anything. You could try subduing her or something?

    This felt so ... lame. It was hilarious how it finished with just six cybermen walking and no-one of the public cared at all. I knew that secondary 'twist' was coming and I was so disappointed I was hoping they'd either use an actual Time Lady or do something new which could add to the whole Galifrey story, but when she revealed her identity, so disappointing.

    I really dislike the idea that people can change genders when regenerating because it's never happened in Doctor Who other than for satirical purposes in that Rowan Atkinson comic relief show. If they have as much change of changing gender, or race if someone wants to randomly force that on the scenario in the future, then explain why the Doctor has stayed male and white the entire show. My interpretation is that he can only stay the one race and the one gender his whole life. Please don't **** about with that.

    There wasn't a lot of weight to her anyway, I found her to be a lame 'villain' and seeing her before at the end of all those other episodes they threw her in so they can technically call this a 'series arch', she came across as just some random contrived villain who espouses quirky dialogue like 'lol you're in heaven now'. There wasn't a sense of mysteriousness about it, more like 'ok Steven Moffat just get it over with'. I never once cared about those random scenes they threw in, usually I'd care about what certain things mean.

    I feel my brain became stupid enough to not warrant emotions just by watching this.
    The Cybermen just strolling out and the public not blinking an eye was just insane. It gets worse. There are pictures of the next episode online and on one of them members of the public are taking selfies with Cybermen!!
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    (Original post by Snagprophet)
    Wasn't all that interesting. Even though I saw the cybermen in the thumbnail (great job BBC) it was a surprise to see that logo of their eye thing appear when they closed the door. Then it ruined the moment by putting the Russell T Davis cyberman music in.

    Also, unless they're lying about people being concious while dead, that concept makes no sense. People feel pain because of their nervous system. If their nerves have rotted, decomposed or disconnected due to the body being dead, then how does someone feel pain? Also how are the people in the matrix thing able to maintain a connection to their bodies? I know Doctor Who uses fictional and/or questionable concepts and actions but this just sounds incredibly retarded.

    Oh and it's in London present day at the end as well. Wow. And no-one cares about anything. I liked how she was just sat on the floor and he didn't do anything. You could try subduing her or something?

    This felt so ... lame. It was hilarious how it finished with just six cybermen walking and no-one of the public cared at all. I knew that secondary 'twist' was coming and I was so disappointed I was hoping they'd either use an actual Time Lady or do something new which could add to the whole Galifrey story, but when she revealed her identity, so disappointing.

    I really dislike the idea that people can change genders when regenerating because it's never happened in Doctor Who other than for satirical purposes in that Rowan Atkinson comic relief show. If they have as much change of changing gender, or race if someone wants to randomly force that on the scenario in the future, then explain why the Doctor has stayed male and white the entire show. My interpretation is that he can only stay the one race and the one gender his whole life. Please don't **** about with that.

    There wasn't a lot of weight to her anyway, I found her to be a lame 'villain' and seeing her before at the end of all those other episodes they threw her in so they can technically call this a 'series arch', she came across as just some random contrived villain who espouses quirky dialogue like 'lol you're in heaven now'. There wasn't a sense of mysteriousness about it, more like 'ok Steven Moffat just get it over with'. I never once cared about those random scenes they threw in, usually I'd care about what certain things mean.

    I feel my brain became stupid enough to not warrant emotions just by watching this.





    That's not even what anyone is complaining about. They clearly stated that changing from a man to a woman is retarded because the Doctor has been so consistently white and male throughout the show, and so has the Master. And even if he wanted a sex change like real life human transgendered people, neither character would wait 900 years or whatever to get that procedure done just to feel like they're in the right body.
    Quantum Entanglement look it up its improbable but quantum entanglement can cause two particles to experience the same thing due to a quantum connection, after the mind has been connected up to the body for so long it is plausible but improbable that they could be quantum entangled and thus the person's mind would be able to feel the pain in the person's body the nerves are still intact but disconnected physically but not necessarily quantumly from the mind, perhaps the nerves could be destroyed so that cremation wouldn't hurt if the mind remained conscious and connected to the body.This is all extremely mad Physics but its Doctor Who and what the show is about.
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    (Original post by somemightsay888)
    The Cybermen just strolling out and the public not blinking an eye was just insane. It gets worse. There are pictures of the next episode online *snip*
    That's a spoiler. PLEASE put it in spoiler tags. It may be only a small plot point but the policy in this thread is pretty freaking clear.
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    (Original post by Feefifofum)
    That's a spoiler. PLEASE put it in spoiler tags. It may be only a small plot point but the policy in this thread is pretty freaking clear.
    Yeah I don't think the bit you snipped is part of the narrative, just literally people meeting the cast and taking selfies during the film shoot. At least I hope so, because that would be a bloody awful episode if it involved taking selfies with cybermen.
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    I thought that was absolutely awesome, one of my favourite episodes or Doctor Who since the reboot! Luckily I completely forgot about the cybermen so their big reveal was not lost on me. And I spent the whole episode trying to work out whether Missy was Jenny or River, delighted that I was way-off. Congrats to anyone who worked it out.

    Danny is a rubbish character and is acted poorly, and I must say I was a bit pleased when he died. Worked well with Clara too, I think this was her strongest episode of the season. The volcano scene was as intense as anything in Who and I'm almost disappointed they used it as a dream-sequence as opposed to a clash between the two of them to end a series. I'd like to see the companion turning into nemesis dynamic explored with Clara's successor, whenever that might be.

    Lastly, Capaldi was fantastic. He was fierce, funny and he was the Doctor - the way he didn't let Clara's betrayal in the dream get to him puts to bet the 'am I a good man?' question.

    Something tells me next week is going to be a let down, but for me this is the first 10/10 episode since The Waters of Mars.
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    (Original post by somemightsay888)
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    The Cybermen just strolling out and the public not blinking an eye was just insane. It gets worse. There are pictures of the next episode online and on one of them members of the public are taking selfies with Cybermen!!
    The public have no idea what the cybermen are, they obviously think they're harmless. And if this happened in real life, people would start taking selfies.
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    (Original post by tomtjl)
    The public have no idea what the cybermen are, they obviously think they're harmless. And if this happened in real life, people would start taking selfies.
    I don't think they would. I don't think people would run away but taking selfies with em? nah.
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    (Original post by Snagprophet)
    That's not even what anyone is complaining about. They clearly stated that changing from a man to a woman is retarded because the Doctor has been so consistently white and male throughout the show, and so has the Master. And even if he wanted a sex change like real life human transgendered people, neither character would wait 900 years or whatever to get that procedure done just to feel like they're in the right body.
    well for a kick off, "retarded" is ableist language so please don't use it. for another they've hinted that time lords can change gender before so I don't see the big deal, it's regeneration as a concept as well, no reason they would HAVE to always be the same gender/ethnicity/etc. well that's not necessarily true either, some transgender people do wait a long time before transitioning, so really the only reason to get upset about this that I can see of is some kind of insecurities of your own about the idea of a female master, which is just sad really on the part of those that have it imho.
 
 
 
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