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Doctor Who - Discussion Thread III (no untagged future spoilers) Watch

  • View Poll Results: What did you think about the first storyline of series 9?
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    (Original post by Hype en Ecosse)
    I thought this episode made a lot of sense, except for the unanswered questions (which were left unanswered on purpose). Only thing that I felt didn't make sense was: why did Clara only see 11 faces+John Hurt?

    If the identity of who John Hurt plays (apparently confirmed in an interview) isn't a spoiler, then I don't know what is...
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    We don't know how it works yet. The "Ending the Time War" occurred between the 1994 film and then Eccleston's revive. The 1994 film ends with Paul McGann still alive and well, so somewhere along the line, he regenerated into Eccleston.

    From what I gathered of the final scene - John Hurt is a Doctor who revealed his name to the universe. How that plays into our original timeline, we have no idea!
    I don't think we know John Hurt's Doctor actually revealed his name to the universe.

    All Matt said was whatever John Hurt's Doctor did was "not in the name of the Doctor".

    In a past episode, the Master said to the Doctor (when talking about their names):

    Master: As you chose yours; "the man who makes people better", how sanctimonious is that?

    So from this, I think Matt just meant Hurt's Doctor betrayed the meaning and "promise" of his name - to make people better.
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    (Original post by Kagutsuchi)
    John Hurt Spoilers

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    I don't think we know John Hurt's Doctor actually revealed his name to the universe.

    All Matt said was whatever John Hurt's Doctor did was "not in the name of the Doctor".

    In a past episode, the Master said to the Doctor (when talking about their names):

    Master: As you chose yours; "the man who makes people better", how sanctimonious is that?

    So from this, I think Matt just meant Hurt's Doctor betrayed the meaning and "promise" of his name - to make people better.

    That's speculation not a spoiler, :mad:
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    (Original post by Llewellyn)
    What part of it didn't make sense?

    The Great intelligence forced the Doctor into going to his own grave by taking his friends hostages. The Doctor opens his own grave. Inside is a link to his entire life. The Great Intelligence enters this and begins rewriting it, turning his victories into defeats. This kills him. To stop him (or what he's trying to do), Clara enters and saves the doctor (across his timeline). Then the Doctor goes in after Clara to rescue her and he does.

    There have been far more confusing episodes than that.
    River opened the tomb.
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    What happened to that evil guy after he entered the timeline?
    Clara and the Doctor were fine but he mysteriously vanished after the others got there.
    How exactly did Clara going into it stop the paradox? Surely it would mean both she and that evil dude would be everywhere so surely that would alter the timeline still?


    I have no idea about that old guy at the end though
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    (Original post by The Mad Dog)
    That's speculation not a spoiler, :mad:
    My speculation is associated with a spoiler.

    The spoiler is to do with John Hurt

    Spoiler:
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    John Hurt being the 9th Doctor


    Better safe than sorry.
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    (Original post by Kagutsuchi)
    John Hurt speculation

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    I don't think we know John Hurt's Doctor actually revealed his name to the universe.

    All Matt said was whatever John Hurt's Doctor did was "not in the name of the Doctor".

    In a past episode, the Master said to the Doctor (when talking about their names):

    Master: As you chose yours; "the man who makes people better", how sanctimonious is that?

    So from this, I think Matt just meant Hurt's Doctor betrayed the meaning and "promise" of his name - to make people better.

    That's a really interesting interpretation of it!

    It wasn't a spoiler because the speculation didn't use any info that wasn't in this episode.
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    What if the Doctor was someone else prior the Doctor years? What if John Hurt was "the Doctor's name," did something terrible and then he became the Doctor - one regeneration gone which is why Clara didn't see him in the timeline!

    My thoughts anyway


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    (Original post by Farmerboy521)
    What if the Doctor was someone else prior the Doctor years? What if John Hurt was "the Doctor's name," did something terrible and then he became the Doctor - one regeneration gone which is why Clara didn't see him in the timeline!

    My thoughts anyway


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    John Hurt is the name of the actor, it isn't the Doctor's name. Well, I'm fairly sure it isn't his name anyway, that would be pretty poor.
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    (Original post by NotMyToothbrush)
    What happened to that evil guy after he entered the timeline?
    Clara and the Doctor were fine but he mysteriously vanished after the others got there.
    How exactly did Clara going into it stop the paradox? Surely it would mean both she and that evil dude would be everywhere so surely that would alter the timeline still?


    I have no idea about that old guy at the end though
    The Great Intelligence was "killed" by scattering himself and dividing himself 1 million times across The Doctor's timeline as the Great Intelligence stated "It will kill me, but destroy you Doctor".
    Clara intended on sacrificing herself for the Doctor in order to rewrite the Great Intelligence's wrongs on The Doctor's past. Basically rewriting the rewrite. The Doctor went into the LAST POSSIBLE version of Clara before she would have been atomised in the TARDIS' scar tissue in the universe.
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    (Original post by Farmerboy521)
    What if the Doctor was someone else prior the Doctor years? What if John Hurt was "the Doctor's name," did something terrible and then he became the Doctor - one regeneration gone which is why Clara didn't see him in the timeline!

    My thoughts anyway


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    hmm...
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    John Hurt was the 9th doctor. He was the one who destroyed all time lords. This is why he didn't do it "in the name of the doctor". maybe this fits it all together.
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    (Original post by Kagutsuchi)
    My speculation is associated with a spoiler.

    The spoiler is to do with John Hurt

    Spoiler:
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    John Hurt being the 9th Doctor


    Better safe than sorry.
    Spoiler:
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    Hurt being 9th Doctor
    hasn't been confirmed anywhere has it?

    (spoilered the thing just in case it has been confirmed)
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    (Original post by Scienceisgood)
    Best I can think of.
    There's the possibility Matt is the last Doctor - therefore, Clara can't have seen any other Doctors because there aren't any more.
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    The 'Forgotten 9th' theory makes a lot more sense now. I don't think its a future version of the Doctor; 11 recognised him so he would be from his past. What did the Doctor do in his past that broke the promise of his name? I would guess that as an act of finishing the time war by committing the genocide of his people, he royally ****ed the true meaning of his name (which could simply be 'the man who helps people' as the Master said in The Sound of the Drums) in Gallifreyan and he wants to forget it. Strange how Clara couldn't see that in his stream though. :dontknow:


    Now. Where is that 50th clip we were promised?
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    (Original post by StephenNaulls)
    John Hurt is the name of the actor, it isn't the Doctor's name. Well, I'm fairly sure it isn't his name anyway, that would be pretty poor.
    It would be! I meant what if John Hurt is the Doctor but before he was the Doctor? He could have changed massively and became he Doctor after the first regeneration, the same guy just not the Doctor, which is why Clara didn't see him in the Doctor's timeline.

    Speculation I know but it's plausible!


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    (Original post by Kagutsuchi)
    There's the possibility Matt is the last Doctor - therefore, Clara can't have seen any other Doctors because there aren't any more.
    Going by previous times though, it is politics as to why Timelords only have 12 regenerations. The Master if he had helped the Doctor, he would have been given a whole new 12 regeneration cycles, however, where had hadn't he was only given an extra 2.

    Also, I think Rassilon had an infinite number of regenerations given his position in the timelord hireachy.

    EDIT:
    Otherwise, timelords would be immortal which as stated by previous characters, everything has to die.
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    (Original post by Hype en Ecosse)
    That's a really interesting interpretation of it!

    It wasn't a spoiler because the speculation didn't use any info that wasn't in this episode.
    Okiedokes - I've removed the spoiler tag - I just thought it was associated with the spoiler of who John Hurt played.

    Okay, this one is definitely a spoiler about John Hurt's Doctor:

    Spoiler:
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    So if we take information of John Hurt being the 9th Doctor as fact, that would mean he was the Doctor in the time war - presumably, he was the reincarnation which did the fighting took part in horrible atrocities during the time war.

    When Matt says "he is my secret" that didn't make much sense to me, since we all know he took part in the time war and fought damn hard, eventually ending it. Are the itty gritty horrid bloody details of his actions the secret he wishes to keep? or is there something more....
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    (Original post by Scienceisgood)
    The Great Intelligence was "killed" by scattering himself and dividing himself 1 million times across The Doctor's timeline as the Great Intelligence stated "It will kill me, but destroy you Doctor".
    Clara intended on sacrificing herself for the Doctor in order to rewrite the Great Intelligence's wrongs on The Doctor's past. Basically rewriting the rewrite. The Doctor went into the LAST POSSIBLE version of Clara before she would have been atomised in the TARDIS' scar tissue in the universe.
    So why wasn't the great intelligence there at the end too?
    i.e. the last possible version of him?
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    That was a very very good episode.

    Matt really is better at writing one-offs than entire series.

    And new Doctor
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    (Original post by Mr.Messy)
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    The 'Forgotten 9th' theory makes a lot more sense now. I don't think its a future version of the Doctor; 11 recognised him so he would be from his past. What did the Doctor do in his past that broke the promise of his name? I would guess that as an act of finishing the time war by committing the genocide of his people, he royally ****ed the true meaning of his name (which could simply be 'the man who helps people' as the Master said in The Sound of the Drums) in Gallifreyan and he wants to forget it. Strange how Clara couldn't see that in his stream though. :dontknow:


    Now. Where is that 50th clip we were promised?
    Spoiler:
    Show
    Since it's rumoured that David Tennant and Rose are returning, a potential link fitting into this is that 10... 11 if this is true (Damn you Moffat) prevented the return of the Time Lords. That would explain his return I suppose?

    I just feel all of this might be a little obvious, which isn't The Moff's style.
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    (Original post by The Mad Dog)
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    Hurt being 9th Doctor
    hasn't been confirmed anywhere has it?

    (spoilered the thing just in case it has been confirmed)
    Hurt

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    I thought it had, from the interview with Hurt.


    UNLESS HE'S A LYING DALEK!
 
 
 
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