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Member countries pay the benefits for the citizens in other countries? Watch

  • View Poll Results: Should the "home country" of an EU migrant pay their benefits wherever they go?
    Yes, the country an immigrant is born in should pay their benefits wherever they go
    10
    58.82%
    No, the country the immigrant arrives in should pay their benefit costs
    7
    41.18%

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    Firstly i'd rather we didn't admit Romanians and Bulgarians, but hypothetically if we really HAD to..... how about a proposal where the "source country" i.e. Bulgaria and Romania fund the benefits for their citizen visiting Britain? Those two countries would pay their local benefit rate, Bulgarians and Romanians wouldnt be able to afford to live here and we haven't defied EU law?

    In short- your country of citizenship pays your benefits for whatever country you decide to move to.
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    (Original post by billydisco)
    Firstly i'd rather we didn't admit Romanians and Bulgarians, but hypothetically if we really HAD to..... how about a proposal where the "source country" i.e. Bulgaria and Romania fund the benefits for their citizen visiting Britain? Those two countries would pay their local benefit rate, Bulgarians and Romanians wouldnt be able to afford to live here and we haven't defied EU law?

    In short- your country of citizenship pays your benefits for whatever country you decide to move to.
    So do you mean you basically get benefits as if you were still living in your home country?

    That could be awkward if the benefits in your home country differ from area to area. Say that in London you get more benefits than you would in other parts of the UK (not sure if that's true or not, but suppose it is). If you move from London to somewhere in France, which benefits would you get?

    I suppose that doesn't mean the idea is unworkable, but it's one issue you'd potentially have to sort out.
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    (Original post by Psyk)
    That could be awkward if the benefits in your home country differ from area to area. Say that in London you get more benefits than you would in other parts of the UK (not sure if that's true or not, but suppose it is). If you move from London to somewhere in France, which benefits would you get?
    What you have mentioned is actually the reason why I think the idea is great. The reason Romanians and Bulgarians want to come here is because, worse comes to worse- they get £15 to £20k a year benefit money because BRITAIN'S benefits are generous. However, if Romania were responsible for their benefit payments, they would not be any wealthier moving to the UK....
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    (Original post by billydisco)
    What you have mentioned is actually the reason why I think the idea is great. The reason Romanians and Bulgarians want to come here is because, worse comes to worse- they get £15 to £20k a year benefit money because BRITAIN'S benefits are generous. However, if Romania were responsible for their benefit payments, they would not be any wealthier moving to the UK....
    This is a brilliant idea mate!
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    (Original post by Psyk)
    So do you mean you basically get benefits as if you were still living in your home country?

    That could be awkward if the benefits in your home country differ from area to area. Say that in London you get more benefits than you would in other parts of the UK (not sure if that's true or not, but suppose it is). If you move from London to somewhere in France, which benefits would you get?

    I suppose that doesn't mean the idea is unworkable, but it's one issue you'd potentially have to sort out.
    Benefits are you the same throughout the UK-except housing benefit of course, which depends on the housing costs in the area you live in
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    (Original post by a729)
    Benefits are you the same throughout the UK-except housing benefit of course, which depends on the housing costs in the area you live in
    Ok, I wasn't sure if they had different benefits in Scotland or something. But anyway, my point was hypothetical. There's probably at least one country in the EU that has different benefits in different parts of it.
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    (Original post by Psyk)
    Ok, I wasn't sure if they had different benefits in Scotland or something. But anyway, my point was hypothetical. There's probably at least one country in the EU that has different benefits in different parts of it.
    It doesn't matter though, does it?
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    (Original post by billydisco)
    It doesn't matter though, does it?
    Well it's one possible complication of it. What would the actual EU law be in this case? You could just say that the host country doesn't have to give any benefits to EU migrants, and that it's the home country's responsibility.

    But that's different from making it so the home country has to give them benefits. If you say they have to give them benefits, which set of benefits for which part of the home country do they have to give them? If it's up to the country to decide then they're probably going to pick a system that allows them to get away with paying as little as possible.

    Really I'm just saying it could be potentially difficult to make it work with some countries' benefits laws. There's also the issue of checking for eligibility. Take disability benefits for example. There's enough fraud as it is now, it would be even harder to check someone really is disabled when they're living in another country.

    I'm not saying it couldn't work. Just highlighting some potential difficulties.
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    (Original post by Psyk)
    Well it's one possible complication of it. What would the actual EU law be in this case? You could just say that the host country doesn't have to give any benefits to EU migrants, and that it's the home country's responsibility.

    But that's different from making it so the home country has to give them benefits. If you say they have to give them benefits, which set of benefits for which part of the home country do they have to give them? If it's up to the country to decide then they're probably going to pick a system that allows them to get away with paying as little as possible.

    Really I'm just saying it could be potentially difficult to make it work with some countries' benefits laws. There's also the issue of checking for eligibility. Take disability benefits for example. There's enough fraud as it is now, it would be even harder to check someone really is disabled when they're living in another country.

    I'm not saying it couldn't work. Just highlighting some potential difficulties.
    I understand what you mean- all I am saying is that it would remove "benefit tourism" because you would always only receive the benefits from your home country (whatever level that is).
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    In the current state of affairs i can see merit to your idea.

    In future once the Eurozone becomes a true federation i can see the European Parliament deciding benefit rates centrally across all states.
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    Of course nobody has stopped to consider the issue of reverse tourism, where I could go to Romania and live like a King on British paid benefits at that rate...

    Also, you'd end up with European migrants living in the UK without the means to do so- I suggest that will look very bad for poverty and crime stats.


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    (Original post by LexiswasmyNexis)
    Of course nobody has stopped to consider the issue of reverse tourism, where I could go to Romania and live like a King on British paid benefits at that rate...
    Who said the "home country" would pay the same rate across all EU countries?

    (Original post by LexiswasmyNexis)
    Also, you'd end up with European migrants living in the UK without the means to do so- I suggest that will look very bad for poverty and crime stats.
    Hopefully it'll put them off/they'll return then!
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    (Original post by billydisco)
    Who said the "home country" would pay the same rate across all EU countries?


    Hopefully it'll put them off/they'll return then!
    1. Ahh right so the home country would pay whatever benefit rates there were in that settling country? Not a bad suggestion, actually.

    2. It might put them off but cause us big expensive issues if not.


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    (Original post by LexiswasmyNexis)
    1. Ahh right so the home country would pay whatever benefit rates there were in that settling country? Not a bad suggestion, actually.

    2. It might put them off but cause us big expensive issues if not.


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    What I mean is that, the home country could have rate X for country Y etc.... so its not rate X for every country in the EU.....
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    (Original post by billydisco)
    What I mean is that, the home country could have rate X for country Y etc.... so its not rate X for every country in the EU.....
    That is an interesting proposition.


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    (Original post by LexiswasmyNexis)
    That is an interesting proposition.


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    If an immigrant cannot get "sponsorship" from their home country- they cannot be allowed entry on grounds of supporting themselves.
 
 
 
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