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What are the conditions required for a body of matter to be conscious? Watch

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    I don't think possessing a brain is enough of an explanation really. I don't see why something can't be conscious in other dimensions or using other chemicals or reactions.

    Sometimes I like to thing trees, the Sun and even non-physical entities like footpaths have their own consciousness.

    What do you think?
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    i totally agree. we are now at a time when science and philosophy are coming ever closer together. although many people would argue that a footpath would only exist if a 'living' consciousness became aware of it. But then i think what is stopping something like a tree or footpath having its own consciousness? If im honest i dont think we will quite understand fully it in our human way of thinking
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    (Original post by The_Last_Melon)
    I don't think possessing a brain is enough of an explanation really. I don't see why something can't be conscious in other dimensions or using other chemicals or reactions.

    Sometimes I like to thing trees, the Sun and even non-physical entities like footpaths have their own consciousness.

    What do you think?
    The science very much points to our consciousness being an emergent property of our brain activity. I wouldn't rule out the potential for synthetic consciousness but this would no doubt have to involve some analogue to a big brain, like the one we humans have. Maybe computers are getting close to having at least the raw data-processing power.
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    (Original post by lilytheblue)
    ...But then i think what is stopping something like a tree or footpath having its own consciousness?...
    Presumably the absence of a complex congnative and sensory system. You might as well as why a glass of water can't walk down the street - it just doesn't have the necessary bits.
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    (Original post by Oswy)
    Presumably the absence of a complex congnative and sensory system. You might as well as why a glass of water can't walk down the street - it just doesn't have the necessary bits.
    Consciousness does not exist in the body or the brain. To give consciousness any form of materialistic qualities basically means you dont quite understand the concept of it. To understand it youd have to open your mind a bit more and change your dogmatic way of thinking
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    Exactly as above. Current science holds that consciousness is the result of brain activity. Paths, trees, the sun etc., don't have brains, therefore they cannot be conscious.
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    (Original post by lilytheblue)
    Consciousness does not exist in the body or the brain. To give consciousness any form of materialistic qualities basically means you dont quite understand the concept of it. To understand it youd have to open your mind a bit more and change your dogmatic way of thinking
    Can you back your theory that consciousness is not a result of brain activity?

    Do you believe in dualism?
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    (Original post by lilytheblue)
    Consciousness does not exist in the body or the brain. To give consciousness any form of materialistic qualities basically means you dont quite understand the concept of it. To understand it youd have to open your mind a bit more and change your dogmatic way of thinking
    But you're not really saying anything here. The science very strongly supports the idea that consciousness is an emergent property of brain activity - highly complex no doubt, but brain activity nonetheless. It's pretty compelling anecdotal evidence that our sense of 'self' feels like it is located somewhere in our head - where our brain is. Moreover, the fact that no matter where we go, even if we make a sudden turn in direction, when, say, we're out on our bicycle, our sense of 'self' seems to stay with us - right where our brain is.
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    (Original post by pjm600)
    Can you back your theory that consciousness is not a result of brain activity?

    Do you believe in dualism?
    The scientific method is reductionist. Yes I do believe in dualism. And read this with an open mind. You may agree with what im tyring to say here, or you may find it difficult to understand because of your dogmatic way of thinking but you can make up your own mind. So the daily life that we perceive with our 5 senses is not reality. Quantum physics has shown that space and time are illusions of perception. Therefore, our bodies cannot be a reality if they occupy this space. And our true consciousness does not exist in our brains or in our bodies. But the illusion of our individual bodies along with the misinformation of our true origins has manifested the idea that we all think independently from one another. With this misunderstanding it would seem impossible to scientifically explain telepathy, clairvoyance, spiritual mediums and other phenomena dealing with transferring information without physical means of communication. But when you understand that there is a common spiritual bond (consciousness) between the universe, and that we are all part of the one divine intelligence, no phenomena is unexplainable.
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    (Original post by lilytheblue)
    The scientific method is reductionist...
    The scientific method can be reductionist, true, though in its defence such reductionism tends to be what makes it so effective in explanatory and predictive power. I don't see you rejecting the use of the PC you're typing on right now, a product of the application of scientific theory - if the theory wasn't in any meaningful way accurate PCs just wouldn't work. Presumably you don't make use of mobile phones, TVs, motor cars or any other of the things which only exist because of the application of the scientific method, seeing as science is so unreliable.
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    (Original post by lilytheblue)
    ...With this misunderstanding it would seem impossible to scientifically explain telepathy, clairvoyance, spiritual mediums and other phenomena dealing with transferring information without physical means of communication...
    But these things are just falsehoods and inventions for the vulnerable and the gullible.
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    To be 'aware' and therefore react to changes in environment.
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    (Original post by lilytheblue)
    Quantum physics has shown that space and time are illusions of perception. Therefore, our bodies cannot be a reality if they occupy this space. And our true consciousness does not exist in our brains or in our bodies. But the illusion of our individual bodies along with the misinformation of our true origins has manifested the idea that we all think independently from one another. With this misunderstanding it would seem impossible to scientifically explain telepathy, clairvoyance, spiritual mediums and other phenomena dealing with transferring information without physical means of communication. But when you understand that there is a common spiritual bond (consciousness) between the universe, and that we are all part of the one divine intelligence, no phenomena is unexplainable.
    May I ask what qualifies you to make statements regarding quantum physics? I'm not sure that you're using the using the idea of time and space being an illusion correctly. Einstein's use of the phrase concerns the nature of reference points in the Universe, observed from different perspectives.

    This does not mean to say that our bodies cannot exist in reality, therefore rendering your assumption that consciousness cannot result from the brain false.
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    (Original post by Oswy)
    The scientific method can be reductionist, true, though in its defence such reductionism tends to be what makes it so effective in explanatory and predictive power. I don't see you rejecting the use of the PC you're typing on right now, a product of the application of scientific theory - if the theory wasn't in any meaningful way accurate PCs just wouldn't work. Presumably you don't make use of mobile phones, TVs, motor cars or any other of the things which only exist because of the application of the scientific method, seeing as science is so unreliable.
    Hey i dont think you understand what im trying to get at here...to define an electronic device as conscious is the complete wrong word and gives consciousness a completely different connotation to what im am trying to say. I am writing about science and philosophy coming together and merging because science can explain how something happens, yet it fails to explain why. I am truly for science, in fact i am doing all sciences for A level. Many times in class have i questioned the validity of the information, each time i am told just to accept it because thats what examiners want and i am sometimes even ridiculed. Yet, the people who do accept this information go on to get high grades and become the authorities of our society. What im trying to say is our school system teaches us to think in certain ways and teaches us not think openly. And because of this, people are quick to reject information that does not fit into their own way of thinking because they do not know how to open their minds and think in other ways. At the end of the day this is all my opinion you can choose to understand my point of view or ridicule it. I am still in the process of figuring this all out
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    (Original post by Bushido Brown)
    Do you have any sources for these claims?
    Hi yes partly my own intuition and films i have watched such as Kymatica and Esoteric Agenda. Also many scientific documentaries. I dont take it all as gospel but i have withdrawn certain ideas and thought about them a lot myself. In my reality it makes sense

    oh and check out the phantom DNA experiment is fascinating!
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    (Original post by pjm600)
    May I ask what qualifies you to make statements regarding quantum physics? I'm not sure that you're using the using the idea of time and space being an illusion correctly. Einstein's use of the phrase concerns the nature of reference points in the Universe, observed from different perspectives.

    This does not mean to say that our bodies cannot exist in reality, therefore rendering your assumption that consciousness cannot result from the brain false.
    So to believe in something i have to have a certain qualification? Well that says it all about society really..
    I am not claiming to know all about it, i am simply referring to what other 'new age' scientists have been talking about and i find myself agreeing with them.
    And what about all the people who have managed to heal themselves after the doctor has told them they dont have much time to live? Im not trying to make you agree with me but i think your way of thinking is too materialistic to understand what i am saying
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    (Original post by lilytheblue)
    So to believe in something i have to have a certain qualification? Well that says it all about society really..
    I am not claiming to know all about it, i am simply referring to what other 'new age' scientists have been talking about and i find myself agreeing with them.
    And what about all the people who have managed to heal themselves after the doctor has told them they dont have much time to live? Im not trying to make you agree with me but i think your way of thinking is too materialistic to understand what i am saying
    No, but to make valid claims stemming from your understanding of quantum theory, your understanding must also be valid. If your claiming to have knowledge of quantum theory that lets you make claims that other have not, you must be able to demonstrate some kind of understanding of the subject.

    If you're referring to cancer, yes, in some cases it can go into remission.

    To say I'm being too materialistic requires there to be something other than materialism, which has not yet been demonstrated.
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    (Original post by pjm600)
    No, but to make valid claims stemming from your understanding of quantum theory, your understanding must also be valid. If your claiming to have knowledge of quantum theory that lets you make claims that other have not, you must be able to demonstrate some kind of understanding of the subject.

    If you're referring to cancer, yes, in some cases it can go into remission.

    To say I'm being too materialistic requires there to be something other than materialism, which has not yet been demonstrated.
    Oh okay i see what you mean now. And how do you know i dont have any understanding...And of course there are other ways of existing unmaterialistically its called being spiritual, just look at Buddhist monks sounds like your waiting for someone else to figure it out for you, my advice is to change that way of thinking and start taking control of your own beliefs because no one else can do that for you.
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    (Original post by lilytheblue)
    Oh okay i see what you mean now. And how do you know i dont have any understanding...And of course there are other ways of existing unmaterialistically its called being spiritual, just look at Buddhist monks sounds like your waiting for someone else to figure it out for you, my advice is to change that way of thinking and start taking control of your own beliefs because no one else can do that for you.
    To be "spiritual" you have to prove that anything exists outside the physical realm. You're going to have a LOT of trouble with that.

    (Original post by lilytheblue)
    The scientific method is reductionist. Yes I do believe in dualism. And read this with an open mind. You may agree with what im tyring to say here, or you may find it difficult to understand because of your dogmatic way of thinking but you can make up your own mind. So the daily life that we perceive with our 5 senses is not reality. Quantum physics has shown that space and time are illusions of perception. Therefore, our bodies cannot be a reality if they occupy this space. And our true consciousness does not exist in our brains or in our bodies. But the illusion of our individual bodies along with the misinformation of our true origins has manifested the idea that we all think independently from one another. With this misunderstanding it would seem impossible to scientifically explain telepathy, clairvoyance, spiritual mediums and other phenomena dealing with transferring information without physical means of communication. But when you understand that there is a common spiritual bond (consciousness) between the universe, and that we are all part of the one divine intelligence, no phenomena is unexplainable.
    You sound like a hippy idiot. "one divine intelligence"? "common spiritual bond"? Get out of your ass!
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    (Original post by lilytheblue)
    Oh okay i see what you mean now. And how do you know i dont have any understanding...And of course there are other ways of existing unmaterialistically its called being spiritual, just look at Buddhist monks sounds like your waiting for someone else to figure it out for you, my advice is to change that way of thinking and start taking control of your own beliefs because no one else can do that for you.
    Exactly, I don't know whether you do or you don't. You might be a fully fledged professor of quantum theory for all I know.

    No, that's not what I'm saying. I'm not aware of any evidence that suggests the existence of any 'spiritual' entity/'dimension', and therefore I believe one would be foolish to assume its existence.

    People may try to separate themselves from material possessions, but this doesn't provide us with evidence of any 'spiritual' thing.
 
 
 
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