Ocr A2 Law (criminal): Offical Thread! Watch

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*lulu7*
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#281
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#281
think the special study paper is goin to be the easiest of the lot. We know exactly what we are going to write and we know how much to write. what you need to learn for source 1:

advantages adn disadadv of judicial precedent
Persuasive precedent
Do judges make law? yes adn no answers
Should judges make law? for and against
extrinsic aids
stare decisis
obiter dicta
ratio decidendi
1966 practice statement
literal rule
golden rule
mischief rule
how judges interpret statutes

then for the other sources:

theft act
burglary
robbery
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*lulu7*
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#282
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adv of judicial pre

exisiting precendents enable us to forecast what a decision will be adn plan accordingly

uniformity in the law, system consistent and public accept it.

flexiable and detailed

practical in its nature


________

Disadv.

Unfair to try and find similarities and relate cases.

time goes on and precedent is dated.

difficult finding what the ratio decidendi is

bad precedent set in 1st place

case law far too complex

________________
Do judges make law?

Yes

• Judicial precedent

• Their interpretations

• They cant simply send it back to parliament they have to make decisions

• 1966 practice statement announced H.O.L no longer be bound by its own decisions

• judges have been left to define their own role and role of courts

• The case of DPP 95 raised the issue of children’s liability . H.O.L decided it should not change the law even though the 1966 statement allowed it to do so

No

• Judges see themselves as declaring the law, not making, it. They see it as democratic


_________________________

should judges make law?

FOR

if all disputes went to parliament would take too long

judges should bake law, in order for it to evolve adapt and change.

in some case parliament gives no lead e.g Gillick v W Norfolk

in some cases e.g R v R the law needs to change in the name of justice

___

Lord Lowry suggested certain factors that should be considerd

judges should be wary of imposing their own answer
when a solution to a dilemma is doubtful

should be casutious of addressing areas which parliament has rejected

areas of social policy, v. political

only change law, if it would completly clear issue

basic areas of common law is apropriate for judges to change, not criminal

judges can adapt to change e.g fitzpatrick v sterling house

_________-

AGAINST

judges are not obliged to decide whetehr a law is satisfactory or not

could be narrow-minded and biased

rejecting parliaments decisions means disrespecting parliament

parliament is elected to make law in the first place.
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*lulu7*
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#283
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persuasive precedent


DISTINGUISHING
when a judge avoids using past decisions made they say the facts are too different for example BALFOUR v BALFOUR was distinguished in MERRITT v MERRITT


OVERRULING
Decision in earlier case is wring of Anderton v Ryan by H.O.L in R v Shivpin


REVERSING
This is where a higher court overrules a decision made in a lower court can only happen in appeals. This was illustrated in the the case of Kingston where the H.O.L reversed decision of C.O.A
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Nicci1187
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#284
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Lulu why do a lot of your notes contain precedent??? Now im scared!!! I thought we didnt need to learn a lot about that coz the main theme is statutory interpretation?? HELP....
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*lulu7*
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#285
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H.O.L was not bound by its own previous decisions until the case of London st tramways v London COunty council... where it bound itself in the interests of certainty

1966 practice statement came in to enable changes to previous decisions.

The first case where this happened was in British Railways Board v Herrington
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*lulu7*
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#286
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yeh but precedent is a type of interpretation.. that the judges use.. it is not a main theme.. but it is really significant within statutory interpretation... < that is what the judges do that is why i have got.. "do judges make law" " should judges make law"
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*lulu7*
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#287
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stare decisis-meaning stand by the decided. Lower courts have to stand by decisions made at higher courts

Obiter dicta-meaning other things said. Supporting explanations given by the judge to justify their decision. It is made before their decision is given therefore it shows their reasoning and though processes. (persuasive precedent)

Ratio decidendi- the actual decision made by judge (binding precedent)
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Nicci1187
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But I thought the only tupe of question we'd get in Q1 is based on source 1 which doesn't say much about precedent, so the question would be something like comparing 2 rules of interpretation? I'm confused :confused:
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*lulu7*
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#289
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well all i can say is i revised all of that and in a mock test i came out with a B+ ..didn't get the A because i didn't mention parliaments role and the facts about the 1966 practice statement!! so up to you lot if you use my notes.. most of them are up there.. the only thing i haven;t put up is extrinsic aids.. that judges use for statutory interpretation xxx
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zoea85
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#290
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thanks for your notes lulu!!!!! the whole judicial precedent thing worries me a bit too because my teacher never even mentioned that, but I will go over it just incase I guess...

EDIT: aww you have warnings! Did the silly so n so's get you for 'advertising'?? They did that to me once but I made them remove it by going on at them!
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Ben_Stephenson
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#291
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Mmm; I'm not convinced by your argument for precedent either; the last two mark schemes have been about statutory interpretation only.
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zoea85
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omg weird! I just posted a message on 'about the student room' asking if us law people could have our own forum and then when I clicked on academic help it is there in the list! I usually go through social sciences but I've realised that there is a law forum if you go to academic help first and scroll down to law and it has all our messages on it!! It's just not on the main list of forums! I better go delete my message lol, looks like we have our own board yay !
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*lulu7*
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#293
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(Original post by zoea85)
omg weird! I just posted a message on 'about the student room' asking if us law people could have our own forum and then when I clicked on academic help it is there in the list! I usually go through social sciences but I've realised that there is a law forum if you go to academic help first and scroll down to law and it has all our messages on it!! It's just not on the main list of forums! I better go delete my message lol, looks like we have our own board yay !
yeh i pushed and asked the head office for that helping people .. n what do i get a flippin get...a warning... no i got the warning because i was doing a survey on media current debates and posted it in general discussion, media and GUD....< but i thought it was relevant in all cateogories!!!!!!
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dilated
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#294
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My predictions for criminal law 2 for essay questions = Duress + Theft, just think they will come up havent seen them in any recent past mark schemes.
Criminal law 1 shouldnt have any strict liability cos it came up in januar, i hope a question on liabaility for omissions will come up along with an involuntary mansualughter story question.
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Dave_G03
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#295
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My Ideal Criminal Law 1 exam would be

Section A: Provocation Essay Or Causation
Section B: INV MS Problem

I dont really want a straight forward murder question on any of the sections as i dont like it and its boring!!!

Criminal Law 2 (havent started revising it yet i will be doing at half 12)

Section A: Reform Of Non Fatals or Insanity
Section B: A classic night club fight! or A Theft and a Defence?

I kno this sounds silly what defence other than neccesity could you have for theft?
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dilated
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#296
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duress.
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zoea85
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#297
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(Original post by Dave_G03)
My Ideal Criminal Law 1 exam would be

Section A: Provocation Essay Or Causation
Section B: INV MS Problem

I dont really want a straight forward murder question on any of the sections as i dont like it and its boring!!!

Criminal Law 2 (havent started revising it yet i will be doing at half 12)

Section A: Reform Of Non Fatals or Insanity
Section B: A classic night club fight! or A Theft and a Defence?

I kno this sounds silly what defence other than neccesity could you have for theft?
intoxication? I think? I've got to start putting it all together in my head like that cos I've kind of been learning them on their own and then forget what fits with what defence and what doesn't...I know that intoxication cannot be a defence for basic offences like assault/battery ABH etc though. It can for S18 OAPA and theft though can't it (because they only have intention as the mens rea)??


I would loveeeeeee insanity as a Section A Q and I guess non fatals wouldn't be too bad either, I think there is a strong possibility for that one, because it hasn't been up for a good while.

I want theft, burglary, making off without payment and criminal damage etc as a problem question!

If they ask specifically about reform of non fatals can you still talk do what you'd normally do for a normal 'discuss whether the law on non fatal offences is satisfactory' Q? but obviously mention reforms in the criticisms or would you have to just talk about suggested reforms and evaluate them?? Cos I don't really know much about the reforms
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Multiplexed
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(Original post by zoea85)
intoxication? I think? I've got to start putting it all together in my head like that cos I've kind of been learning them on their own and then forget what fits with what defence and what doesn't...I know that intoxication cannot be a defence for basic offences like assault/battery ABH etc though. It can for S18 OAPA and theft though can't it (because they only have intention as the mens rea)??


I would loveeeeeee insanity as a Section A Q and I guess non fatals wouldn't be too bad either, I think there is a strong possibility for that one, because it hasn't been up for a good while.

I want theft, burglary, making off without payment and criminal damage etc as a problem question!

If they ask specifically about reform of non fatals can you still talk do what you'd normally do for a normal 'discuss whether the law on non fatal offences is satisfactory' Q? but obviously mention reforms in the criticisms or would you have to just talk about suggested reforms and evaluate them?? Cos I don't really know much about the reforms
What would be great for me:

Essay: Non Fatals
Problem: Someone stealing some **** & then knockin them out.
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Dave_G03
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#299
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I actually agree with you there A theft and a non fatal would be cool im just looking back previous exam problems....

In Jan they had a theft question with a Battery (Knocking over the old lady as she ran out of the shop) and Duress with criminal damage.

I hear criminal damage is unlikely to come up as an Essay?

:tsr2:
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sonya_p
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#300
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people i have just been told that judicial precedent came up for the january exam. confirmed it with a person who done it in january 2006!!!!
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