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El Stevo
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#821
Report Thread starter 9 years ago
#821
(Original post by gbduo)
On channel 5 atm, there is a program called "Brits who made the modern world"

The first episode focuses on F1 and it is well worth a look at how Lotus especially were so brilliant at what they did and how the rules were so much more lax back then and encouraging revolutionary thinking by the engineers.

It is what F1 should go back to.
Yea.... No. Too many computers for that. Look at the cars of 2004 with rules only a little more lax than now.
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gbduo
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#822
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#822
(Original post by El Stevo)
Yea.... No. Too many computers for that. Look at the cars of 2004 with rules only a little more lax than now.
Yeh but as was shown in qualifying today, Schumy had a lap record in 2004 of 1:24.1, Vettel just beat it today with a 1.23.9, proving that the rules are ineffective and not slowing the cars down at all in qualifying. Yet there is less overtaking, because the cars cannot overtake each other due to the aero.

A total revamp needs to be done, starting with aerodynamics to cut down on the dirty air. Or better, just scrap the generic rules applied to each team and the FIA set the weight, size and minimum lap time of a F1 car around each circuit. How a team gets that is up to them...would be awesome! V8s for light and agile, V10s for all out speed and torque and no rev limiters just a max bhp. Would be awesome.
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El Stevo
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#823
Report Thread starter 9 years ago
#823
(Original post by gbduo)
Yeh but as was shown in qualifying today, Schumy had a lap record in 2004 of 1:24.1, Vettel just beat it today with a 1.23.9, proving that the rules are ineffective and not slowing the cars down at all in qualifying. Yet there is less overtaking, because the cars cannot overtake each other due to the aero.
All the rules are a lot tighter than back in 2004 and yet they are on the same pace.This should should tell you something about the ingenuity of the people in F1... 6 years before 2004 the cars were 6 seconds slower and there was no shortage of rule changes in that time either..

(Original post by gbduo)
A total revamp needs to be done, starting with aerodynamics to cut down on the dirty air. Or better, just scrap the generic rules applied to each team and the FIA set the weight, size and minimum lap time of a F1 car around each circuit. How a team gets that is up to them...would be awesome! V8s for light and agile, V10s for all out speed and torque and no rev limiters just a max bhp. Would be awesome.
Awesome? F1 would become a laughing stock - go watch Wacky Races re-runs if that's what you want. If you put in a max BHP you'd still have unbelievable engines, except to keep under the bhp you'd just funnel the extra power into a kers type system for when power is below the limit just to raise it up again.

And how can you have a light agile v8 car or a heavy grunty v10 when you've set a common weight limit? Have you even thought any of your post through, just a little bit?
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gbduo
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#824
Report 9 years ago
#824
(Original post by El Stevo)
All the rules are a lot tighter than back in 2004 and yet they are on the same pace.This should should tell you something about the ingenuity of the people in F1... 6 years before 2004 the cars were 6 seconds slower and there was no shortage of rule changes in that time either..


Awesome? F1 would become a laughing stock - go watch Wacky Races re-runs if that's what you want. If you put in a max BHP you'd still have unbelievable engines, except to keep under the bhp you'd just funnel the extra power into a kers type system for when power is below the limit just to raise it up again.

And how can you have a light agile v8 car or a heavy grunty v10 when you've set a common weight limit? Have you even thought any of your post through, just a little bit?
Lol, not really! I am just musing.

Either way, I know the wacky races are far more interesting to watch than F1 has been in years. And I have been watching it for years and I am starting to get fed up.

If it is boring at Silverstone when I go, i'm out.

I just think that F1 is supposed to be the pinnacle of engineering and technology. With the current rules, I think that F1 is slipping from this pinnacle and to curtail some of the rules to allow composite designs in the engines and aerodynamic features which cannot create 'dirty' air would be beneficial to the sport.

For example, ban rear diffusers and spoilers...and then the return of the Lotus skirt will come and you will see cars go sooo much faster than they are now and be able to overtake.

These are really random musings, don't pick it apart, take the post for what it is, just thoughts, not an argument. And I don't want an argument either.

Graham
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El Stevo
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#825
Report Thread starter 9 years ago
#825
(Original post by gbduo)
I just think that F1 is supposed to be the pinnacle of engineering and technology. With the current rules, I think that F1 is slipping from this pinnacle and to curtail some of the rules to allow composite designs in the engines and aerodynamic features which cannot create 'dirty' air would be beneficial to the sport.
All aero features create dirty air... it's what they do! The more efficient a wing is, the dirtier the air behind it is. I think there is overkill on the engines to be honest - an engine should last qualifying and the race.

For example, ban rear diffusers and spoilers...and then the return of the Lotus skirt will come and you will see cars go sooo much faster than they are now and be able to overtake.
Interesting you want diffusers banned and skirts returned.. A skirt needs a diffuser to work, unless of course, you wish to bring fan cars back? The reason skirts were banned in the first place, believe it or not, was driver safety - Gilles Villeneuve being a case in point. They were so fragile - if the car suddenly lose it's under-vacuum be it humping a kurb or a nasty bump or whatever, you were up **** creek because you'd suddenly be doing 150mph round a bend with no downforce. Effectively you'd be on ice and go straight to the scene of the accident. Imagine losing your rear wing going round Eau Rouge or Blanchimont...

These are really random musings, don't pick it apart, take the post for what it is, just thoughts, not an argument. And I don't want an argument either. Graham
I understand that... just there are inherent flaws in your musings. Just acknowledging them might make you realise there isn't an easy solution to the problem.
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gbduo
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#826
Report 9 years ago
#826
(Original post by El Stevo)
All aero features create dirty air... it's what they do! The more efficient a wing is, the dirtier the air behind it is. I think there is overkill on the engines to be honest - an engine should last qualifying and the race.


Interesting you want diffusers banned and skirts returned.. A skirt needs a diffuser to work, unless of course, you wish to bring fan cars back? The reason skirts were banned in the first place, believe it or not, was driver safety - Gilles Villeneuve being a case in point. They were so fragile - if the car suddenly lose it's under-vacuum be it humping a kurb or a nasty bump or whatever, you were up **** creek because you'd suddenly be doing 150mph round a bend with no downforce. Effectively you'd be on ice and go straight to the scene of the accident. Imagine losing your rear wing going round Eau Rouge or Blanchimont...


I understand that... just there are inherent flaws in your musings. Just acknowledging them might make you realise there isn't an easy solution to the problem.
Thanks for your insight, I see where you are coming from!

It is tricky, I understand that, but I think if we look back 15 or 20 years there is a huge difference in F1 racing compared to now. I am not saying go back to that, times move on, but I do think the sport has been locked down to such a degree that although the engineers are brilliant, they are so brilliant that they are somewhat making the sport too clinical by creating excessive amounts of dirty air and designing a car that cannot cope with dirty air if it is in dirty air!

The engineer who can smooth out dirty air in front and create downforce will be worth a fortune, lol!

Maybe you are right though, the answer is not in aero, but just more power!! Power is good. And I still think the V10s sounded better than the current V8s, lol!

It is difficult isn't it! Interesting though!
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El Stevo
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#827
Report Thread starter 9 years ago
#827
(Original post by gbduo)
Maybe you are right though, the answer is not in aero, but just more power!! Power is good. And I still think the V10s sounded better than the current V8s, lol!

It is difficult isn't it! Interesting though!
The easiest solution, is to give them crap tyres. Everybody rants about how awesome slippery track racing is. And what changes on wet tracks? They still have the aero but they lose ********* of mechanical grip, all of it due to the tyres having less grip. Make the tyres hard enough to last a race without needing to conserve them and ban tyre changes. There is only one tyre manufacturer so if anything like 05 Indy occurs, everyone will be similarly affected.
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gbduo
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#828
Report 9 years ago
#828
(Original post by El Stevo)
The easiest solution, is to give them crap tyres. Everybody rants about how awesome slippery track racing is. And what changes on wet tracks? They still have the aero but they lose ********* of mechanical grip, all of it due to the tyres having less grip. Make the tyres hard enough to last a race without needing to conserve them and ban tyre changes. There is only one tyre manufacturer so if anything like 05 Indy occurs, everyone will be similarly affected.
I'm not sure Bridgestone would be too keen on the idea though, after all they want to make the best tyres to sell tyres to the viewers. If you force them to make crap tyres, then the excellent publicity they get from the cars being quick in all conditions and the tyres lasting will be gone.

I really can't see Bridgestone agreeing to that, it is not in their best interests...
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IzzieViolett
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#829
Report 9 years ago
#829
Hey,

Just thought as an avid F1 fan and supporter or Robert Kubica and Lewis Hamilton (Jenson too but...not really convinced with his overall fighting/working his way through the grid...so it's lewis im with) - well actually i'm a fan of everyone who isn't about to overtake lewis LOL:p:

But hey, I'm half British and half polish...what can i say ^^:rolleyes:
anywho...it's about half eight now and i got up at stupid o'clock to watch the melbourne grand prix.

What driver(s)/team(s) do you support?
Predictions on the next race?

things like that!

and please no rude or harsh comments to other users and especially NO DISCRIMINATION, or you WILL be kicked off the thread, reported and your rep will go down.

thanks

x:rolleyes:
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El Stevo
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#830
Report Thread starter 9 years ago
#830
There's an entire sub-forum for this in sports, just so you know...
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IzzieViolett
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#831
Report 9 years ago
#831
thanks

i know but there's no place for general discussion...only Fantasy F1 games etc.
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ibysaiyan
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#832
Report 9 years ago
#832
(Original post by IzzieViolett)
Hey,

Just thought as an avid F1 fan and supporter or Robert Kubica and Lewis Hamilton (Jenson too but...not really convinced with his overall fighting/working his way through the grid...so it's lewis im with) - well actually i'm a fan of everyone who isn't about to overtake lewis LOL:p:

But hey, I'm half British and half polish...what can i say ^^:rolleyes:
anywho...it's about half eight now and i got up at stupid o'clock to watch the melbourne grand prix.

What driver(s)/team(s) do you support?
Predictions on the next race?

things like that!

and please no rude or harsh comments to other users and especially NO DISCRIMINATION, or you WILL be kicked off the thread, reported and your rep will go down.

thanks

x:rolleyes:
Shoots! and here i was thinking this to be a thread dedicated to june 2010 FP1 exams .
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gbduo
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#833
Report 9 years ago
#833
You know what, I take it all back, Melbourne today was awesome!
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Untitled258
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#834
Report 9 years ago
#834
Right, i'm bored and was thinking about how F1 could have more races then 19 in one season, and how they could fit them in so we have more back to back race weekends.



Current race locations.


the route they are currently taking around the world? It seems such effort, they are wasting time shipping things from one end of the world to the other, like Turkey to Canada to Spain, and later on south korea to brazil to Abu Dhabi.


If they went around in a logical order such as above, surely it would cut down on shipping cost, Co2 emissions, etc, and most importantly time, so they can add extra races into the mix too to create a season with say, 24 races? With races in India, Russia, USA, France or where-ever, mexico or something. Even though races like Abu Dhabi and Bahrain are next to each other, both in the dessert etc, one is a day/night race so it won't be samey. The only Issues i can really think of are the seasons, but why cant we have more of a seasonal variation in the races? They seem to be trying to get all the races to be in the summer of a country for warm conditions, but cooler or wet conditions will mix it up.

Most importantly Melbourne is first and Brazil last!

I dunno, like i said, im bored. I'm sure its not that simple
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hannahhi
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#835
Report 9 years ago
#835
While it's good theory in the way that it'd cut down shipping costs etc etc (I like your diagram), it just wouldn't be feasible to have say 24 races. Currently they're going March - November, with a three week gap for summer (which they didn't want to give up last year). The teams and drivers are away from home a lot of the time, they'd need time off, they need time to develop the next year's car, test it etc. Plus imagine the cost :eek:
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Untitled258
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#836
Report 9 years ago
#836
Fam-i-what??? Time off???
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gbduo
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#837
Report 9 years ago
#837
I like it! Would make a lot more sense to the jumbled mess we have atm. Although, it seems far too sensible to be even considered for F1!
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Untitled258
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#838
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#838
And ive just thaught Hannah, 24 isn't a lot! Its still less then half of the year!!
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hannahhi
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#839
Report 9 years ago
#839
(Original post by Untitled258)
And ive just thaught Hannah, 24 isn't a lot! Its still less then half of the year!!
That is true, and it'd mean a lot more back-to-back races (yay for us :p: ) but I couldn't imagine the teams liking that, being on the road for so long!
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MessyEater
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#840
Report 9 years ago
#840
Having a logical route across the world...aye, saves costs and we all know how keen everyone is on doing that.
But...
More races, more engines, more staff wages, more tools and uncertainty of race popularity = wayyyy more money than would be saved!
Not that I wouldn't love it though.
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