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David Cameron's views on the EU - out of touch Watch

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    Well I read what David Cameron's views on the EU were one word, wow. How can anybody this much out of touch with those that are disillusioned with the EU? People are out there complaining about unlimited immigration and the EU's financial burden and he comes up with the most ridiculous response.

    His answer to this is to try and renegotiate back rights for the UK to increase the working week and the number of hours people can work. How in the world does he expect to beat off UKIP with that nonsense? Why would anybody in their right mind support staying in the EU on basis of them having to work for longer? I think this really shows how out of touch David Cameron is with both the left and the right, he only seems to be catering for the business class. If I had the choice between staying in the EU as it is now and Cameron's vision for less worker protections I would keep it as it is. This is coming from a massive anti EU possible UKIP supporter.
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    http://www.spiegel.de/international/...-a-899588.html
    http://www.spiegel.de/international/...-a-899460.html


    Two rather good articles from German paper Der Speigal on European wide concerns about theEU. Worth reading.
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    As Peter Hitchens once correctly, and wisely exclaimed 'Cameron hates his own party'. He isn't a Tory. He is like Blair, centre-right. What does compassionate conservatism even mean? Cameron has no control over his backbenchers. Traditional tory ideology would suggest a Britain not in the EU, instead independent with limited state involvement. Although I dislike her policies, Thatcher was a real Tory- neoliberal and republican.
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    'Out of touch' one of the most overused phrases of modern times.
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    (Original post by gladders)
    'Out of touch' one of the most overused phrases of modern times.
    I'd agree with that. Other phrases overly used are Fascist, Fascist, Bigot, outraged and offended.
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    (Original post by penguinman1)
    Traditional tory ideology would suggest a Britain not in the EU, instead independent with limited state involvement. Although I dislike her policies, Thatcher was a real Tory- neoliberal and republican.
    Actually, traditional Tories are 'one nation conservatives'; people like Ken Clarke and Michael Heseltine. Thatcherism, as the name suggests, only began with Thatcher (and while Eurosceptic, she never wanted Britain to leave the EU completely).
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    (Original post by MatureStudent36)
    I'd agree with that. Other phrases overly used are Fascist, Fascist, Bigot, outraged and offended.
    And 'cultural marxist'
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    (Original post by anarchism101)
    Actually, traditional Tories are 'one nation conservatives'; people like Ken Clarke and Michael Heseltine. Thatcherism, as the name suggests, only began with Thatcher (and while Eurosceptic, she never wanted Britain to leave the EU completely).
    Not strictly true, Keith Joseph was the main inspirer of Thatcherism and could in another timeline have become Leader of the Conservative Party (and we'd now have Josephism!), but also Enoch Powell to some extent.
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    (Original post by gladders)
    And 'cultural marxist'
    if only, then we could unwind the state-sponsored brainwashing known as political correctness at last
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    Would hardly call him out of touch. A fair chunk of the business community and some Tory MP's do actually want to stay in the EU. The EU debate needs to stop being presented as the entirety of Britain wanting out, it's not that at all. Those who want out just seem to shout the loudest. A poll here put it at 40% to stay in and 34% to leave
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    (Original post by thesabbath)
    if only, then we could unwind the state-sponsored brainwashing known as political correctness at last
    Good grief, man. It can't ever be just people simply disagreeing with you, can it? You simply cannot abhore people freely coming up with an opinion different than yours - it has to be brainwashing.
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    The laws on the working week are actually a serious problem for the NHS. Unless you want them to spend more money and time on training junior doctors then it's an important power to get back.
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    (Original post by Rob da Mop)
    The laws on the working week are actually a serious problem for the NHS. Unless you want them to spend more money and time on training junior doctors then it's an important power to get back.
    Not that anyone really listens to the working time directive
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    (Original post by anarchism101)
    Actually, traditional Tories are 'one nation conservatives'; people like Ken Clarke and Michael Heseltine. Thatcherism, as the name suggests, only began with Thatcher (and while Eurosceptic, she never wanted Britain to leave the EU completely).
    There's a very good documentary on youtube called Tory! Tory! Tory! It takes you through the very beginnings of Thatcherism.
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    (Original post by MJK91)
    Not that anyone really listens to the working time directive
    What are you talking about? The NHS is a good, EU law abiding employer

    No, but it would be nice if it was all above-board and more... legitimate? Not really sure what the word I'm looking for is, but it would be nice if we could say "this is how it works" and that's how it works...
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    (Original post by gladders)
    Good grief, man. It can't ever be just people simply disagreeing with you, can it? You simply cannot abhore people freely coming up with an opinion different than yours - it has to be brainwashing.
    but these conformist opinions are permissable to express without risking your liberty or career, whereas all the stuff that upsets the PC brigade, the anti-white "anti-racists" and the gaystapo is risking just that.

    it is this disparity between freedom of thought and freedom of speech that political correctness has created. it has bred a dishonest sociopathic culture where those who hold contrary beliefs have to wear a mask.

    my contention is that those who go along with this have suspended the ability to think critically, for to do otherwise would highlight the endless double standards that are PC tenets (the moral high ground having been established by definition as complicity with these beliefs).
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    (Original post by Seahorseman)
    Well I read what David Cameron's views on the EU were one word, wow. How can anybody this much out of touch with those that are disillusioned with the EU? People are out there complaining about unlimited immigration and the EU's financial burden and he comes up with the most ridiculous response.

    His answer to this is to try and renegotiate back rights for the UK to increase the working week and the number of hours people can work. How in the world does he expect to beat off UKIP with that nonsense? Why would anybody in their right mind support staying in the EU on basis of them having to work for longer? I think this really shows how out of touch David Cameron is with both the left and the right, he only seems to be catering for the business class. If I had the choice between staying in the EU as it is now and Cameron's vision for less worker protections I would keep it as it is. This is coming from a massive anti EU possible UKIP supporter.

    I actually think he's played a blinder. He gets more powers back for the uk as Germany will not want to see us leave so will concede. Governments have to think long term. Public perception has recently shifted, but there's nothing saying that it'll shift back to marginally pro.

    either way we have a referendum and our relationship with Europe is settled once and for all irrespective of your viewpoints.
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    (Original post by thesabbath)
    but these conformist opinions are permissable to express without risking your liberty or career, whereas all the stuff that upsets the PC brigade, the anti-white "anti-racists" and the gaystapo is risking just that.

    it is this disparity between freedom of thought and freedom of speech that political correctness has created. it has bred a dishonest sociopathic culture where those who hold contrary beliefs have to wear a mask.

    my contention is that those who go along with this have suspended the ability to think critically, for to do otherwise would highlight the endless double standards that are PC tenets (the moral high ground having been established by definition as complicity with these beliefs).
    Not really. You don'y get arrested for having your views, you have complete freedom of speech. The chief concern is that if you have attitudes like you do, that you aren't really going to treat people differently from you terribly fairly. For example, your gaystapo comment. It just shows you hate. And hate does not deserve respect.
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    (Original post by MatureStudent36)
    I actually think he's played a blinder. He gets more powers back for the uk as Germany will not want to see us leave so will concede. Governments have to think long term. Public perception has recently shifted, but there's nothing saying that it'll shift back to marginally pro.

    either way we have a referendum and our relationship with Europe is settled once and for all irrespective of your viewpoints.
    Spot on. So many people have gone anti-EU almost solely on immigration issues and the benefits scandals. It's compounded by the economic crisis we've been in and the large scale unemployment, but those factors WILL improve in time. It's also largely overlooked that the benefits of the EU far outweigh, economically, the money we lose out on with immigration/benefit abuse.

    I suspect if we did have the referendum in 2017, the answer would be "stay in Europe". If we did it today, it could swing either way.
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    (Original post by gladders)
    Not really. You don'y get arrested for having your views, you have complete freedom of speech. The chief concern is that if you have attitudes like you do, that you aren't really going to treat people differently from you terribly fairly. For example, your gaystapo comment. It just shows you hate. And hate does not deserve respect.

    Hate's a strong word.
 
 
 
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