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How could you not support gay parents from adopting? watch

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    Following this thread on yet another gang being found guilty of grooming and sexually exploiting girls, I felt that rather than people banging on about their hatred for Muslims, (when clearly the issue (if you believe there is one) is a cultural one, not a religious one), I thought it would be more relevant to have a debate on gay rights for child adoption.

    The children that were groomed were all from backgrounds of care and thus the most vulnerable children. Statistics from the who cares trust found that:

    • Almost 40% of prisoners under 21 were in care as children
    • 1/4 of young women leaving care are pregnant or already mothers, and nearly half become mothers by the age of 24
    • Almost 1/3 of children in care leave school with no GCSEs or vocational tests like GNVQs.
    • Only 6% of care leavers go to university - compared with 38% of all young people


    Stuart Hazell, who murdered Tia Sharp, was 'the son of a prostitute and a jailbird who grew up in care' that 'became hooked on booze at 13 and received his first criminal conviction a year later.' 'As a teenager, he lived on the streets and claimed he was raped in a homeless hostel in Soho when he was 16.'

    Hazell is most likely an extreme example, however, it is certainly found that children in care are far more likely to be sexually abused, have problems with crime, drugs and mental health than their peers.

    So given what a negative impact of being in care for a child is, I find it shocking that people can be so opposed to gay people adopting children.

    Even if you so adamantly believe that a child being raised by a male and female figure is the best form of care, surely you cannot be naive enough to understand that, given the amount of children in care and the lack of people adopting, this simply cannot be the case a lot of children. Thus, surely it would be far better for the child to grow up with gay parents than in care at all?

    Besides this point, research into children with a lesbian or gay parents find no effect on their relationship and neither on the child’s socialising or mental health. Yes, perhaps a child may be teased a bit for having gay foster parents, but, as horrible as this sounds, a lot of children are teased and a bit of teasing is certainly the 'lesser of two evils' considering the fate a child may have if left in care.

    Moreover, gay couples, given that they cannot have a biological child that genetically that belongs to both parents, may be more open to adoption than that of straight couples that often turn to IVF.

    In short (stealing from wiki ), same sex adoption in the UK is not a "gay rights" issue but one of providing as many children as possible with a stable family environment rather than seeing them kept in care.

    Thank you for the read.
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    I completely agree, the only reason it isn't legalised is because so many uneducated bigots would protest furiously.
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    Legal status by country/jurisdiction [edit]

    Full joint adoption by same-sex couples is currently legal in the following countries:



    - Just to clarify
    Aside I believe homosexuals, bi sexuals, asexuals should all be allowed to adopt, I cannot see a negative effect on couples who are already adopting and on the children being adopted.
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    Kid I went to school with had 2 lesbian mums, got bullied the **** out of and hanged himself.

    So from my view, that's why. I can't imagine how much worse the bullying would've been if he'd have had 2 gay dads.


    edit: not sure why 3 people have negged the fact that a poor kid hanged himself. TSR users are weird.
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    (Original post by Rybee)
    Kid I went to school with had 2 lesbian mums, got bullied the **** out of and hanged himself.

    So from my view, that's why. I can't imagine how much worse the bullying would've been if he'd have had 2 gay dads.

    If we do nothing the problem will simply persist.
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    Homosexual 'marriage' = stable family environment? trololololol

    In a study of male homosexuality in Western Sexuality: Practice and Precept in Past and Present Times, M. Pollak said he found that
    "few homosexual relationships last longer than two years, with many men reporting hundreds of lifetime partners.”
    Pollack concluded,
    “Even in those homosexual relationships in which the partners consider themselves to be in a committed relationship, the meaning of ‘committed’ typically means something radically different than in heterosexual marriage.”

    Sex in America: A Definitive Survey, by authors Michael, Gagnon, Laumann, and Kolata, cites a study of homosexual male couples conducted by gay researchers.The couples who participated had been together between 1 and 37 years.
    Findings were as follows:

    • 100% (all) of the couples experienced infidelity in their relationship within the first 5 years.
    • Couples who remained together past the 10-year mark were able to do so only by accepting the painful reality of infidelity in their relationship.

    • More than 85 percent of the couples reported that their greatest relationship problems center on issues related to outside relationships.
    And have a look at this comparison of those living the homosexual lifestyle compared with those not (suicide risks, health risks, etc).

    Unfortunately, it is in fact a "gay rights" issue and will be used as such. They'll be adopting kids just to make a point.

    Letting a child into a home where two people of the same sex shack up and pretend to be married all the while engaging in objectively disordered and immoral behaviour is child abuse. Children should not be subject to that.

    Come at me with your negs.
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    It's always about the rights of the couple. What about the children who will be bullied by fellow peers who aren't old enough to understand the issue?
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    (Original post by Rybee)
    Kid I went to school with had 2 lesbian mums, got bullied the **** out of and hanged himself.

    So from my view, that's why. I can't imagine how much worse the bullying would've been if he'd have had 2 gay dads.
    But that's not the fault of the parents but society? So in a sense shouldn't we be making it illegal to bully people because of such issues rather than banning the adoption?
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    (Original post by SPB)
    Homosexual 'marriage' = stable family environment? trololololol






    And have a look at this comparison of those living the homosexual lifestyle compared with those not (suicide risks, health risks, etc).

    Unfortunately, it is in fact a "gay rights" issue and will be used as such. They'll be adopting kids just to make a point.

    Letting a child into a home where two people of the same sex shack up and pretend to be married all the while engaging in objectively disordered and immoral behaviour is child abuse. Children should not be subject to that.

    Come at me with your negs.
    Oh, and some constantly drunk/drugged up parents who accidentally got pregnant with their 6th kid whilst living in some cramped council house isn't child abuse?

    Okay, it's an extreme situation, but you get the gist.
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    (Original post by eggfriedrice)
    But that's not the fault of the parents but society? So in a sense shouldn't we be making it illegal to bully people because of such issues rather than banning the adoption?
    Making it illegal to bully people because their mum/dad's gay?

    What planet do you live on?

    Never heard anything more ridiculous in my life.
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    (Original post by Rybee)
    Making it illegal to bully people because their mum/dad's gay?

    What planet do you live on?

    Never heard anything more ridiculous in my life.
    Are you for real? o.o
    Have you not heard of students getting arrested for bullying people to the point of suicide?
    And so are you saying two loving people who want to share their love with a child is worse than some ignorant sh*ts who bully people simply because theyre different?

    Wow.

    My point is not to restrict adoption but to educate the nation.
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    (Original post by eggfriedrice)
    Oh, and some constantly drunk/drugged up parents who accidentally got pregnant with their 6th kid whilst living in some cramped council house isn't child abuse?

    Okay, it's an extreme situation, but you get the gist.
    Are drunks and drug addicts campaigning for society to worship their behavior and sanction it? Are drunks and drug addicts campaigning for the right to adopt children? Are Catholic adoption agencies closing because drunks and drug addicts make complaints that they can't adopt there? Nope!

    It's unfortunate if someone has to grow up in such an environment. But the solution is not to put them in a house that is just as full of immorality and instability. We should be campaigning for better homes and marriages, not trying to pass children off onto people just because they have a "right" to have kids and want everybody to know it. The same people that complain about this issue and lament the breakdown of traditional marriage are also usually the ones who love sexual liberation, pornography and celebrate all kinds of infidelities. It's all part of the same problem, and allowing more sin and celebrating more filth isn't going to solve the worlds problems. More purity, more modesty, more sacrificial love, more manliness, more feminine virtue and more responsibility. This will solve the issue of broken homes. But as of yet I see nobody on the liberal side campainging for this. It's all sex and more sex and laissez faire sexuality.

    Poor little kiddies. A political tool; a handbag and accessory for people who want to stick it to the Christians and the conservatives.
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    (Original post by SPB)
    Homosexual 'marriage' = stable family environment? trololololol






    And have a look at this comparison of those living the homosexual lifestyle compared with those not (suicide risks, health risks, etc).

    Unfortunately, it is in fact a "gay rights" issue and will be used as such. They'll be adopting kids just to make a point.

    Letting a child into a home where two people of the same sex shack up and pretend to be married all the while engaging in objectively disordered and immoral behaviour is child abuse. Children should not be subject to that.

    Come at me with your negs.
    The bulk of scientific research would seem to contradict you, as shown by these literature reviews.
    canadian psychological association

    Australian Psychological society

    brief of the american psychological association, the california psychological association, the american psychiatric association, and the american association for marriage and family therapy
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    (Original post by hollywoodbudgie)
    Following this thread on yet another gang being found guilty of grooming and sexually exploiting girls, I felt that rather than people banging on about their hatred for Muslims, (when clearly the issue (if you believe there is one) is a cultural one, not a religious one), I thought it would be more relevant to have a debate on gay rights for child adoption.

    The children that were groomed were all from backgrounds of care and thus the most vulnerable children. Statistics from the who cares trust found that:

    • Almost 40% of prisoners under 21 were in care as children
    • 1/4 of young women leaving care are pregnant or already mothers, and nearly half become mothers by the age of 24
    • Almost 1/3 of children in care leave school with no GCSEs or vocational tests like GNVQs.
    • Only 6% of care leavers go to university - compared with 38% of all young people


    Stuart Hazell, who murdered Tia Sharp, was 'the son of a prostitute and a jailbird who grew up in care' that 'became hooked on booze at 13 and received his first criminal conviction a year later.' 'As a teenager, he lived on the streets and claimed he was raped in a homeless hostel in Soho when he was 16.'

    Hazell is most likely an extreme example, however, it is certainly found that children in care are far more likely to be sexually abused, have problems with crime, drugs and mental health than their peers.

    So given what a negative impact of being in care for a child is, I find it shocking that people can be so opposed to gay people adopting children.

    Even if you so adamantly believe that a child being raised by a male and female figure is the best form of care, surely you cannot be naive enough to understand that, given the amount of children in care and the lack of people adopting, this simply cannot be the case a lot of children. Thus, surely it would be far better for the child to grow up with gay parents than in care at all?

    Besides this point, research into children with a lesbian or gay parents find no effect on their relationship and neither on the child’s socialising or mental health. Yes, perhaps a child may be teased a bit for having gay foster parents, but, as horrible as this sounds, a lot of children are teased and a bit of teasing is certainly the 'lesser of two evils' considering the fate a child may have if left in care.

    Moreover, gay couples, given that they cannot have a biological child that genetically that belongs to both parents, may be more open to adoption than that of straight couples that often turn to IVF.

    In short (stealing from wiki ), same sex adoption in the UK is not a "gay rights" issue but one of providing as many children as possible with a stable family environment rather than seeing them kept in care.

    Thank you for the read.
    Your entire post is aimed at children in care under straight people. If gays adopt, how can you know that they'll be less likely to have a stable environment/end up in prison for selling meth etc.?

    I think it's a generalisation you're making in assuming that simply being in the custody of a homosexual couple they'll be immune from abuse/a **** life. Not that I stand in the way of gays from adopting, but I think you're being overly keen in thinking that everything will work out when the reality is that it doesn't always work out that way.
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    (Original post by SPB)
    Are drunks and drug addicts campaigning for society to worship their behavior and sanction it? Are drunks and drug addicts campaigning for the right to adopt children? Are Catholic adoption agencies closing because drunks and drug addicts make complaints that they can't adopt there? Nope!

    It's unfortunate if someone has to grow up in such an environment. But the solution is not to put them in a house that is just as full of immorality and instability. We should be campaigning for better homes and marriages, not trying to pass children off onto people just because they have a "right" to have kids and want everybody to know it. The same people that complain about this issue and lament the breakdown of traditional marriage are also usually the ones who love sexual liberation, pornography and celebrate all kinds of infidelities. It's all part of the same problem, and allowing more sin and celebrating more filth isn't going to solve the worlds problems. More purity, more modesty, more sacrificial love, more manliness, more feminine virtue and more responsibility. This will solve the issue of broken homes. But as of yet I see nobody on the liberal side campainging for this. It's all sex and more sex and laissez faire sexuality.

    Poor little kiddies. A political tool; a handbag and accessory for people who want to stick it to the Christians and the conservatives.
    Not completely sure what you're on about but I'll try to answer accordingly.

    What do you mean by "worship"? Plus they don't even NEED to complain, why? Because they're straight.

    "Immortality and instability"? I'm not too sure if you're referring to the drunks or the same sex couples? I don't know, but you sound like a conservative Christian. The values of "manliness" and being "feminine", don't you think it's degrading to label someone to have to act a certain way depending on what they have between their legs. Plus, its not like all straight men and women are manly or feminine, and vice verse. You live in such a stereotypical world, and if something doesn't fit in it, then you condemn it.

    Also "pass children off", have you ANY idea the amount of paper work etc same sex couples need to do before a child is "passed on to them". You make it sound like same sex couples just pop to the shops and find a child.

    You need to widen your eyes, we no longer live in the 1500's.
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    Gay couples have had the ability to adopt in England since 2002 and in Scotland since 2009. Like gay marriage the only challenge was getting it passed into law due to the younger generations overwhelmingly supporting social equality and the people who don't being overwhelmingly old thus being weeded out daily by mother nature / faulty heating systems / steep steps.

    But yes i support gay people being able to adopt because there are no genuine reasons to oppose it and around 70,000 reasons to support it.
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    (Original post by Thriftworks)
    Legal status by country/jurisdiction [edit]
    I know it's legal adJust because it's legal, it doesn't mean people don't oppose it

    (Original post by SPB)
    Homosexual 'marriage' = stable family environment? trololololol
    Because logically speaking, a gay couple who wants to go through raising a child is going to be a couple of guys who just met at a bar wanting to prove a point rather than some people in a comitted relationship wanting to raise a child because being gay doesn't remove your paternal/maternal desires :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by Kiss)
    Your entire post is aimed at children in care under straight people. If gays adopt, how can you know that they'll be less likely to have a stable environment/end up in prison for selling meth etc.?

    I think it's a generalisation you're making in assuming that simply being in the custody of a homosexual couple they'll be immune from abuse/a **** life. Not that I stand in the way of gays from adopting, but I think you're being overly keen in thinking that everything will work out when the reality is that it doesn't always work out that way.
    Of course it won't cause miracles, but it makes more sense that a child in the attention of two adults who have gone through the long process of child adoption will more likely provide a better enviroment than one that is of many neglected children living together in an enviroment that is statistically proven to not be a very good one.
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    Just to play devil's advocate here for a minute: before the legalization of gay adoption anywhere, did anybody have any data on what a child's experience being raised by a homosexual couple would be? No, because for millions of year, only straight couples had children. Does nobody worry that these children are essentially part of a social experiment, the outcome of which nobody has any idea of at all?

    It does amuse me when liberals will sit on a chat show like The Big Questions and they'll say platitudes like: 'all a child needs is love' to the sound of raucous applause. Is love all a child needs? Do we no what the effect of having two parents of the same gender will have on a child? Do we know whether this is important or not? The reality is we have absolutely no idea. And good luck trying to argue against that.
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    (Original post by hollywoodbudgie)
    I know it's legal adJust because it's legal, it doesn't mean people don't oppose it
    ]

    I said " Just to clarify " To make the point absolutely clear

    Due to ignorant responses like this:


    (Original post by The*****Of96)
    I completely agree, the only reason it isn't legalised is because so many uneducated bigots would protest furiously.
 
 
 
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