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Female tennis players out of shape!

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Original post by chigyy
Does this count towards males as well? Last time I checked a player by the name of Michael Russell (never heard of him?) is much more muscular than Roger Federer, but hey Russell hasn't won a title, yet Federer has won quite a few.


Obviously natural ability is a big factor
Reply 61
Original post by The Rusty Spork
There isn't a bit of excess fat on him though. He has the correct speed/power ratio for him. A lot of the WTA players look like they could push themselves harder and be in better shape.




He's so beautiful. :emo: I hope he makes a return next year.
Reply 62
Original post by chigyy
Does this count towards males as well? Last time I checked a player by the name of Michael Russell (never heard of him?) is much more muscular than Roger Federer, but hey Russell hasn't won a title, yet Federer has won quite a few.


You are making poorly thought out points and seem to be spoiling for an argument.

It's about making the most of natural talent. Federer has bags of natural talent and his physique suits his game. Carrying excess fat is of absolutely no benefit in a sport like tennis.
Original post by pandabird
Ironically, you're the first sexist post on this thread. We'll done.


My post is making fun of the people accusing OP of sexism here. Like the first poster to reply to this thread. But I accept your compliment and will carry it like a badge of honour.
Reply 64
Original post by pane123
You are making poorly thought out points and seem to be spoiling for an argument.

It's about making the most of natural talent. Federer has bags of natural talent and his physique suits his game. Carrying excess fat is of absolutely no benefit in a sport like tennis.


I don't want an argument, but what I'm saying is that I agree with his point that athletes should be in the best shape possible. However I do not agree with the point that if they aren't in the best shape then they are inferior.
Reply 65
Original post by The Rusty Spork
This has already been dealt with and tbh backs up my point. Yes Rooney is a good player, a very talented athlete but he is not making the absolute best of his ability by not being in the best shape he can possible be. He would be faster, more explosive, stronger etc if he was in top shape. He has been criticised for such in both the press and by Ferguson in the past.



It isn't a case of her dieting in the sense that she should be slim. She should want to be in the best shape possible with the correct muscle/speed ratio. If she was to do push herself to the absolute limits like Djokovic etc then she might be able to dominate the women's game in a similar way to Serena.

As an athlete near the top of the world game why would you not want to push yourself to your maximum to see what you can achieve. Winning 1,2, 3 titles is fine. Winning 15 because you pushed yourself to your limit is better.

This thread isn't an a question of 'the women aren't good enough to win in the current women's game'. It is a question of 'why don't they push themselves to their maximum'.


But is it better?! Some athletes also want a life outside the sport, and clearly she's one of them who's happy to not devote her life entirely to the game. Same with Rooney. Take the money from being gifted at something, and then use the rest of your time to spend it on fun stuff to do with friends and family rather than live in a gym until you retire and having spent all your younger years obsessing over a game.
Reply 66
Original post by Rascacielos
Not really, because it doesn't support your argument. She's a damned good tennis player who has beaten Serena Williams on numerous occasions. Instead, it supports my view that there is no specific "shape" an athlete (at least, in tennis) has to have.

Everybody can be in "better" shape. No doubt even Serena Williams herself could be. There are many reasons for the latter's success - her muscle only forms part of it. You can have the most powerful biceps in the world, but it counts for nothing if you don't have the skill to keep it within the lines or the stamina to play 2-3 hours of continuous tennis. In the same way, Maria Sharapova is no doubt a great tennis player but any 'failure' on her part is probably not attributable to her weak arm power.


If you are continuously going to disregard entire posts then this will be even more pointless than it already is :dontknow:

I have answered pretty much all of the above previously but so it is simple.

I never said there was a specific shape except that carrying flab isn't beneficial.
I don't think every player should be as muscular as Serena.
I do think every top athlete should push themselves to their physical limits if they want to be at the top on a consistent basis. (Which is likely one of the reasons why so many WTA players win a single slam and then fade away rapidly).
Finally, the player should try and aim for the perfect speed/power ration to ensure that they can get around the court as quickly and efficiently as possible and the hit the ball as hard and accurate as possible.

There is no way that you cold argue that Kvitova is anywhere near the absolute top end of her perfect physical fitness.

Also, Sharapova has a 2 - 14 H2H against Serena :dontknow:
http://www.wtatennis.com/head2head/player1/9499/player2/9044/title/maria-sharapova/title/serena-williams
Reply 67
Original post by Bhumbauze
Other than having the stamina to get through a match without crumbling, Tennis is mainly a game of skill rather than raw athleticism. especially in the women's game where they rely less on powerful serves, etc.

The top male tennis players, whilst obviously very fit, have relatively "normal" body compositions. They spend a lot more time practicing elements of the game itself than doing pure cardio or getting "gym buff".

Compare this to the Olympics which is more of a display of raw strength, speed and endurance in the track and field events... less skill, more pure body conditioning.

The reason Williams dominates is because she has a naturally more masculine body than most women. The amount of "gym work" most women would have to put in to achieve her body shape would mean no time for practicing tennis. And, for whatever reason (this is not sexism, just fact) men are better at sports than women. Williams may dominate the female game but she would be out of the male tour very quickly, probably against a fairly low-level player. Is that because she doesn't put in the effort? No. And the same goes for the other female players vs. Williams.


This!

With the woman's games being out of 3 sets, they concentrate on power rather than endurance. You don't see slim weightlifters now do you? Obviously this is as well as skill related training, beyond of which there is limited time to get a body shape of a superb athlete for the marginal benefit.

I'm sure a lot of these, less from perfect tennis player do wish to have a better physique, but maybe if they concentrated on this aspect, they would actually be further away from tennis champions than they are now due to opportunity cost.
I just read that Robson and Kanepi both have quicker average ground strokes than Serena so far.

So maybe muscle isn't so important after all.
Reply 69
Original post by snapper1
But is it better?! Some athletes also want a life outside the sport, and clearly she's one of them who's happy to not devote her life entirely to the game. Same with Rooney. Take the money from being gifted at something, and then use the rest of your time to spend it on fun stuff to do with friends and family rather than live in a gym until you retire and having spent all your younger years obsessing over a game.


To get to the top of tennis I am pretty sure you would have to devote your life to it.

Also, Rooney is an employee. He is paid to be in the best physical condition possible, otherwise he won't be doing his job as well as he could be.
Original post by snapper1
But is it better?! Some athletes also want a life outside the sport, and clearly she's one of them who's happy to not devote her life entirely to the game. Same with Rooney. Take the money from being gifted at something, and then use the rest of your time to spend it on fun stuff to do with friends and family rather than live in a gym until you retire and having spent all your younger years obsessing over a game.


You're talking nonsense and do not understand professional sport.
Reply 71
Original post by chigyy
I don't want an argument, but what I'm saying is that I agree with his point that athletes should be in the best shape possible. However I do not agree with the point that if they aren't in the best shape then they are inferior.

They are inferior to their highest possible level though. If they were in better shape then they would be better players.

Original post by snapper1
But is it better?! Some athletes also want a life outside the sport, and clearly she's one of them who's happy to not devote her life entirely to the game. Same with Rooney. Take the money from being gifted at something, and then use the rest of your time to spend it on fun stuff to do with friends and family rather than live in a gym until you retire and having spent all your younger years obsessing over a game.


That is entirely my point which people seem to have jumped all as though I am wrong :confused: Of course they can go and have a life outside etc that is their prerogative but am I not therefore correct that they are not in their best possible shape and that there seems to be a higher proportion (in tennis) of WTA players who are not in the best physical shape as opposed to in the men's tour and therefore if a WTA player did push themselves to their maximum then they may be able to dominate similar to what Serena has been able to do?
Reply 72
Original post by maskofsanity
I just read that Robson and Kanepi both have quicker average ground strokes than Serena so far.

So maybe muscle isn't so important after all.


What point are you trying to make? The ball doesn't move as fast off the racquet as it does off Serena's.
Original post by kettlechips
And tennis isn't a sport that requires pure muscle power
Spoken like someone who knows nothing about tennis.
Reply 74
Original post by The Rusty Spork
What point are you trying to make? The ball doesn't move as fast off the racquet as it does off Serena's.


This is a meaningless statistic. It offers no insight to the effectiveness of their ground strokes. One would imagine a player like Williams requires fewer strokes to see out a point because of the power behind each shot, proving your point yet again.
Original post by The Rusty Spork
If you are continuously going to disregard entire posts then this will be even more pointless than it already is :dontknow:


I wasn't. I replied to the rest of your penultimate post, just without quoting it.

Original post by The Rusty Spork
There is no way that you cold argue that Kvitova is anywhere near the absolute top end of her perfect physical fitness.


I hardly think she's far away. Aside from losing maybe half a stone of fat - which is hardly a lot - then based on that photo alone (since I don't expect you - like I - have any particular knowledge of her fitness in other respects), there is absolutely no way you can tell whether she is near her perfect physical fitness.

Also, Sharapova has a 2 - 14 H2H against Serena :dontknow:
http://www.wtatennis.com/head2head/player1/9499/player2/9044/title/maria-sharapova/title/serena-williams

Like I said, I doubt that is a mere result of Sharapova's arm strength (or lack thereof). Arm strength is only useful in combination with skill - which Williams undoubtedly has lots of. You can't get an ace unless you are capable of very precisely serving the ball as well as doing it quickly; you can't overpower your opponent on arm strength alone, if you aren't skilled in containing that strength and the balls goes out of the court; and you can't smash the ball unless you have put yourself in the right place to do so first. Skill alone, however, does win matches (assuming the tennis player has stamina, which I don't think is in issue here - Kvitova, Williams, Sharapova and others undoubtedly have stamina, despite their difference in size) even if the tennis player is not the strongest in their class.
(edited 10 years ago)
Reply 76
Original post by Some random guy
My post is making fun of the people accusing OP of sexism here. Like the first poster to reply to this thread. But I accept your compliment and will carry it like a badge of honour.


You're a little wild one aren't you?
Reply 77
Original post by maskofsanity
I just read that Robson and Kanepi both have quicker average ground strokes than Serena so far.

So maybe muscle isn't so important after all.


She's also losing 6-2
Reply 78
Original post by Rascacielos
Aside from losing maybe half a stone of fat - which is hardly a lot


I'm playing football tonight so I'll stick 7 pounds in my weight vest and wear it while I play. I will report back to you if I don't kill myself.
Original post by pane123
I'm playing football tonight so I'll stick 7 pounds in my weight vest and wear it while I play. I will report back to you if I don't kill myself.


Because you wouldn't be used to it and don't have the physical fitness to carry that excess weight. It clearly works for Kvitova. I'm not saying it would be a bad idea for her to lose that weight but I don't think it is my business to suggest that she should do that: as I've suggested, a tennis player's weight only makes up a tiny amount of their ability to succeed in the sport. Clearly different athletes will have different shapes, and since Kvitova is neither overweight nor unfit, if she is content with her present weight - and I think we should give her the benefit of the doubt that she and her coach know what is best for her performance - I don't think I have any right to suggest, nor do I believe, that she is "out of shape."
(edited 10 years ago)

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