Medical School Cost
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Original post by BlondHair
Miliband did promise ( lol ) that the maximum tuition rate would be 6k . In a recent speech , he said he wanted to go further in reducing tuition. He seems like a bit of a leftie to me......with his union agreements etc. I doubt he will not deliver on that promise after he saw what happened to Clegg and Lib Dems
And before the 2001 GE, Labour said they wouldn't introduce top up fees. But they did.
Anyway, I don't think he made any specific promise or pledge. As he say, he just said he "wanted" to reduce fees.
As said, even if the fees are reduced it will take a significant amount of time for the new policy to be voted on and introduced. For example, the vote on top up fees took place in January 2004, but they weren't introduced until 2007.
Original post by Helenia
The only reason money would get in your way is if you let yourself get scared by big numbers. There is no reason why your background or current finances should cause you trouble. Your student loan is not a bad debt or a burden, it just gets paid back out of your salary (which will be reasonable, with decent job security) after you graduate. It's not going to cause you trouble like e.g. credit card debt or even a mortgage if you can't pay.
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I would listen to this. As a UK undergraduate, you won't be asked to pay anything up front and you will get funded so try not to over think things. Take things one step at a time
(edited 10 years ago)
We are talking about £50,000 of debt, yet you actually pay substantially more over the course of the repayment.
Has anybody calculated the approximate total figure?
It's £36k of tuition fees
And say £3.5k living costs x 5
= £53,500 of initial borrowing.
Has anybody done the sums to work out the average total cost repayment for a doctor from F1 --> 30 years later? Obviously it depends a bit on speciality but there should be 'average' figures so to speak?
Only out of curiousity this is
EDIT: The interest rate on the money borrowed is approximately 6% (3% + RPI) although if the rate of inflation increases, so will the amount to repay of course.
Has anybody calculated the approximate total figure?
It's £36k of tuition fees
And say £3.5k living costs x 5
= £53,500 of initial borrowing.
Has anybody done the sums to work out the average total cost repayment for a doctor from F1 --> 30 years later? Obviously it depends a bit on speciality but there should be 'average' figures so to speak?
Only out of curiousity this is
EDIT: The interest rate on the money borrowed is approximately 6% (3% + RPI) although if the rate of inflation increases, so will the amount to repay of course.
(edited 10 years ago)
Original post by BlondHair
What would be a more accurate figure for living costs?
Well in Cambridge ...
my rent was about £100 per week x 30 weeks = £3000
Food let's say £5 per day x 30 x 7 = £1000
Extras let's say £50 per week average (high end estimate tbh) = £1500
Total = £5500 per year.
London will be a bit dearer, rent will be more and you'd probably have to pay for transport. Transport in London can add up to A LOT over a year. I've never had to do it, but some of my friends do.
So could be £4000 - £4500 ish if you're really careful, around £5000 - £6000 if you're normal. Also will be a bit higher for clinical as you're around much more. Still way less than £9000 though you'll be pleased to hear. What were you budgeting to take it so high? A family could live off £9000 (albeit very simply).
HTH
Original post by nexttime
Final 2 years for 6 year course.
Final 2 years for 6 year course.
Dayum.
It's 6k for the tuition fees for the last 2 years.
For Oxford 9k in living expenses is a perfectly sensible figure. I've spent about that much, as have my friends and it's about what the uni say you'll spend. I have no idea how nexttime spends 6k, unless that was in his first year before 4% inflation happened for about 2 years. College accommodation alone is about 4k.
For Oxford 9k in living expenses is a perfectly sensible figure. I've spent about that much, as have my friends and it's about what the uni say you'll spend. I have no idea how nexttime spends 6k, unless that was in his first year before 4% inflation happened for about 2 years. College accommodation alone is about 4k.
Original post by Lionheartat20
We are talking about £50,000 of debt, yet you actually pay substantially more over the course of the repayment.
Has anybody calculated the approximate total figure?
It's £36k of tuition fees
And say £3.5k living costs x 5
= £53,500 of initial borrowing.
Has anybody done the sums to work out the average total cost repayment for a doctor from F1 --> 30 years later? Obviously it depends a bit on speciality but there should be 'average' figures so to speak?
Only out of curiousity this is
EDIT: The interest rate on the money borrowed is approximately 6% (3% + RPI) although if the rate of inflation increases, so will the amount to repay of course.
Has anybody calculated the approximate total figure?
It's £36k of tuition fees
And say £3.5k living costs x 5
= £53,500 of initial borrowing.
Has anybody done the sums to work out the average total cost repayment for a doctor from F1 --> 30 years later? Obviously it depends a bit on speciality but there should be 'average' figures so to speak?
Only out of curiousity this is
EDIT: The interest rate on the money borrowed is approximately 6% (3% + RPI) although if the rate of inflation increases, so will the amount to repay of course.
I thought the maximum interest charged was fixed at 3.something%
9000 * 1.06 = 9540
$540 interest after your first year
Multiply that by six, and thats roughly 3k worth of interest outstanding on a loan of 9k... and you haven't even started working at this point so the debt is going to keep accumulating. I'm going to try to pay off the debt asap.
(edited 10 years ago)
Original post by TheStudent.
I thought the maximum interest charged was fixed at 3.something%
9000 * 1.06 = 9540
$540 interest after your first year
Multiply that by six, and thats roughly 3k worth of interest outstanding on a loan of 9k... and you haven't even started working at this point so the debt is going to keep accumulating. I'm going to try to pay off the debt asap.
9000 * 1.06 = 9540
$540 interest after your first year
Multiply that by six, and thats roughly 3k worth of interest outstanding on a loan of 9k... and you haven't even started working at this point so the debt is going to keep accumulating. I'm going to try to pay off the debt asap.
The number is so large you wouldn't actually make a dent with normal repayments. It then gets written off after 30y. I think there's a fair chance 30y of repayments is less than the actual debt, so paying it off quickly doesn't make much sense. It also means that you'll be paying off about 5k per year for 20y when you're making a decent salary.
I will owe around £35,500 to student finance england when I finish (including tuition fees).
That is my only debt and I've managed to support myself on it and summer earnings, with some grants and bursaries (SFE and NHS) as well.
Your tuition fees would add £24,000 but that is still makes only £60,000 - even if you receive less grant and/or living costs are higher in Oxford than Birmingham, I still don't know where you've extra 40 grand from if you are at all careful with money!
My living costs are in the region of £6000/year and that includes running costs of a car during all of my clinical years. £9k/year seems like madness to me.
That is my only debt and I've managed to support myself on it and summer earnings, with some grants and bursaries (SFE and NHS) as well.
Your tuition fees would add £24,000 but that is still makes only £60,000 - even if you receive less grant and/or living costs are higher in Oxford than Birmingham, I still don't know where you've extra 40 grand from if you are at all careful with money!
My living costs are in the region of £6000/year and that includes running costs of a car during all of my clinical years. £9k/year seems like madness to me.
(edited 10 years ago)
Original post by Pigling
I will owe around £35,500 to student finance england when I finish (including tuition fees).
That is my only debt and I've managed to support myself on it and summer earnings, with some grants and bursaries (SFE and NHS) as well.
Your tuition fees would add £24,000 but that is still makes only £60,000 - even if you receive less grant and/or living costs are higher in Oxford than Birmingham, I still don't know where you've extra 40 grand from if you are at all careful with money!
My living costs are in the region of £6000/year and that includes running costs of a car during all of my clinical years. £9k/year seems like madness to me.
That is my only debt and I've managed to support myself on it and summer earnings, with some grants and bursaries (SFE and NHS) as well.
Your tuition fees would add £24,000 but that is still makes only £60,000 - even if you receive less grant and/or living costs are higher in Oxford than Birmingham, I still don't know where you've extra 40 grand from if you are at all careful with money!
My living costs are in the region of £6000/year and that includes running costs of a car during all of my clinical years. £9k/year seems like madness to me.
Where are you getting the 6k figure from? The issue with these estimates is that when you add up how much you think you're spending, it's almost always less than the cashflow through your account. I thought I spend about 7k, but the online banking cashflow meter shows it's higher.
My rent for next year for a room in a private house in Oxford is 350GBP/mo. This is apparently average to low. The house and utilities (+agency fee) alone add up to about 4500gbp/mo. I genuinely can't see how you'd pay for petrol/car amortization/food/fun/etc. with 125GBP/mo. That is 4.20GBP/day, which is incidentally about the cost of a good college lunch or of one dinner. Chances are you're not counting some of your costs (car amortization?) or simply excluding some cash you received from work/parents/wherever.
Do note that the OP is asking about the total cost and not about the final debt number.
Original post by AnonymousPenguin
For Oxford 9k in living expenses is a perfectly sensible figure. I've spent about that much, as have my friends and it's about what the uni say you'll spend. I have no idea how nexttime spends 6k, unless that was in his first year before 4% inflation happened for about 2 years. College accommodation alone is about 4k.
Oxford's estimate for undergrad is £7,600. It includes several costs that i consider rather fanciful though - £450 on clothes (?! why?) £300 on course costs (what costs?) £230 'travel from home' which i doubt most people spend, and £75 per week on food (which anyone with access to a kitchen could easily halve).
I spent a lot less than 6K in 1st year, when my accommodation cost were closer to £2400
You realise by your own estimate you are spending £200 per week on non-accommodation related expenses?!
Original post by AnonymousPenguin
The number is so large you wouldn't actually make a dent with normal repayments. It then gets written off after 30y. I think there's a fair chance 30y of repayments is less than the actual debt, so paying it off quickly doesn't make much sense. It also means that you'll be paying off about 5k per year for 20y when you're making a decent salary.
I wish that were true, I really do. I used this 'student debt calculator' online, and not only does it say that I'll pay off the initial debt, but I would have to pay an incredibly traumatising amount back in interest
I think for some students, the debt that gets written off after 30 years is the interest. Of course, the calculator only gives you a rough estimate, and its all dependent on how much you end up earning as a doctor. But:
Year 1 - 9K loan, 3K interest
Year 2 - 9K loan, 2.5K interest
Year 3 - 9K loan, 2K interest
Year 4 - 9K loan, 1.5K interest
Thats roughly 9K interest that you have to pay back on the point of graduation, and the figure is just going to get bigger and bigger... This doesn't even take into account the living loan that some students take out.
I'm not sure why people are saying this is a good debt. If you check the numbers, its terrible.
Edit - I forgot that the interest is compounded
so the interest accrued is actually alot higher than 9K.(edited 10 years ago)
Original post by nexttime
Oxford's estimate for undergrad is £7,600. It includes several costs that i consider rather fanciful though - £450 on clothes (?! why?) £300 on course costs (what costs?) £230 'travel from home' which i doubt most people spend, and £75 per week on food (which anyone with access to a kitchen could easily halve).
I spent a lot less than 6K in 1st year, when my accommodation cost were closer to £2400
You realise by your own estimate you are spending £200 per week on non-accommodation related expenses?!
I spent a lot less than 6K in 1st year, when my accommodation cost were closer to £2400
You realise by your own estimate you are spending £200 per week on non-accommodation related expenses?!
Actually the last estimate from the uni is 7900 for first 3 years http://www.ox.ac.uk/admissions/undergraduate_courses/student_funding/living_costs/index.html
and 12900 for the final 3 years http://www.ox.ac.uk/feesandfunding/fees/livingcosts/graduates/
The official numbers average out to 10400 GBP/year.
I've looked back at my expenses and they were about 7600 gbp for last year if I exclude the summer accommodation needed for the FHS project and flights (EU student). However, the final three years will surely pull that up to a lot higher given that it's a full year and not just 24-ish weeks.
Original post by TheStudent.
I'm not sure why people are saying this is a good debt. If you check the numbers, its terrible.
I'm not sure why people are saying this is a good debt. If you check the numbers, its terrible.
It's very good compared with other types of debt though. Look at interest rates and T&Cs for a mortgage, a commercial loan, a credit card or wonga.com (or similar) and a student loan is very favourable by comparison.
Given that your alternatives are a)not going to med school or b)working till you can pay up front, it's a no-brainer, really.
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Original post by AnonymousPenguin
Where are you getting the 6k figure from? The issue with these estimates is that when you add up how much you think you're spending, it's almost always less than the cashflow through your account. I thought I spend about 7k, but the online banking cashflow meter shows it's higher.
My rent for next year for a room in a private house in Oxford is 350GBP/mo. This is apparently average to low. The house and utilities (+agency fee) alone add up to about 4500gbp/mo. I genuinely can't see how you'd pay for petrol/car amortization/food/fun/etc. with 125GBP/mo. That is 4.20GBP/day, which is incidentally about the cost of a good college lunch or of one dinner. Chances are you're not counting some of your costs (car amortization?) or simply excluding some cash you received from work/parents/wherever.
Do note that the OP is asking about the total cost and not about the final debt number.
My rent for next year for a room in a private house in Oxford is 350GBP/mo. This is apparently average to low. The house and utilities (+agency fee) alone add up to about 4500gbp/mo. I genuinely can't see how you'd pay for petrol/car amortization/food/fun/etc. with 125GBP/mo. That is 4.20GBP/day, which is incidentally about the cost of a good college lunch or of one dinner. Chances are you're not counting some of your costs (car amortization?) or simply excluding some cash you received from work/parents/wherever.
Do note that the OP is asking about the total cost and not about the final debt number.
I only earn a certain amount each year - if it isn't all spent (it isn't) - I simply can't be spending more than £6k a year.
My rent is £2700, my water share is £120, my gas&electricity share is ~£300. So that leaves almost £3k for spending, which is actually close to £8/day. Maybe cheap, but not impossibly little when you consider that £8/day includes all of the holidays when I may be living at home with parents.
I have received money from my parents - but I've banked all of that money, I'm not spending it on living.
And sure, people here and there will have given me gifts - but my family is hardly wealthy, I would not expect I received more/higher value gifts than an average student. These aren't "expenses".
Yes this amount is lower than what you would expect to spend living completely independently for a year - but I am not, a spend a considerable proportion (eg: non-term times) living with parents spending virtually nothing. This is no different to most students though.
Original post by TheStudent.
I'm not sure why people are saying this is a good debt. If you check the numbers, its terrible.
I'm not sure why people are saying this is a good debt. If you check the numbers, its terrible.
Challenge you to find any mortgage that is better. And that's a bigger loan, which if you default on they take your house away. Just based on the lack of that risk, the student loan is very good.
Original post by AnonymousPenguin
Actually the last estimate from the uni is 7900 for first 3 years http://www.ox.ac.uk/admissions/undergraduate_courses/student_funding/living_costs/index.html
and 12900 for the final 3 years http://www.ox.ac.uk/feesandfunding/fees/livingcosts/graduates/
The official numbers average out to 10400 GBP/year.
I've looked back at my expenses and they were about 7600 gbp for last year if I exclude the summer accommodation needed for the FHS project and flights (EU student). However, the final three years will surely pull that up to a lot higher given that it's a full year and not just 24-ish weeks.
and 12900 for the final 3 years http://www.ox.ac.uk/feesandfunding/fees/livingcosts/graduates/
The official numbers average out to 10400 GBP/year.
I've looked back at my expenses and they were about 7600 gbp for last year if I exclude the summer accommodation needed for the FHS project and flights (EU student). However, the final three years will surely pull that up to a lot higher given that it's a full year and not just 24-ish weeks.
The graduate estimate is even more ridiculous. No one needs to pay 7K for their accommodation. No one needs to pay £60 per week for food, etc etc.
(edited 10 years ago)
Original post by nexttime
Challenge you to find any mortgage that is better.
Just to be the devils advocate here, the interest on mortgages can be lower at this moment.
Original post by BlondHair
I'm saying 9k including accomadation at a college.
I have 2k savings.
So the NHS will pay the tuition costs for my last year?
I have 2k savings.
So the NHS will pay the tuition costs for my last year?
Yes the NHS will pay for your final year but it is still so expensive. if you are eligible for student finance this may help reduce costs
If you borrow £36,000 (£9000 a year for tuition fees) - you could end up re-paying over £75,000+
I don't think that is a good deal at all. Maybe it is relative to other loans (albeit mortages are better!) - tuition fees only used to be £3,000 a year .... Not only are we paying three times the amount, the interest rates on what is a large amount of money is terrible anyway.
That said, there is not much we can do about it if you want to go to med school, although we are still paying £75,000 + for a £36,000 loan, for what used to cost £12,000 only 2 or 3 years ago!
I don't think that is a good deal at all. Maybe it is relative to other loans (albeit mortages are better!) - tuition fees only used to be £3,000 a year .... Not only are we paying three times the amount, the interest rates on what is a large amount of money is terrible anyway.
That said, there is not much we can do about it if you want to go to med school, although we are still paying £75,000 + for a £36,000 loan, for what used to cost £12,000 only 2 or 3 years ago!
(edited 10 years ago)
9k is high, even for London.
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