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Are Muslims right to be outraged by police actions? watch

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    (Original post by ArthurOliver)
    Yup. That be the question.

    About the poor posts - I'm saying that D&D is killed by all the base insults, unsupported arguments, and deliberate diversions and obfuscations - all the yeahbutwhys, whatdoyoumeans and Idisputethemeaningofthatwords - they go on forever if the goodwill debaters allow it by adjusting downward to the idiot level. I already had in mind the question asked in another thread of why D&D was so quiet and was thinking of the voices I missed.

    The idiots (beekeeper, thud, cottonmouth or whoever) might yet explain why "Muslims" are right to be outraged. I'd like to see it.
    ^o)

    lol.


    nonetheless, I explained already in my first post on this thread my opinions, if the "master race" didn't read it, it ain't my problem.
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    Great first response Thud - tossing in the fascist derailing tactic. Great last response Thud - tossing in the master race derailment tactic.

    Doesn't in any way add to my point about idiot and diversionary and insulting comment and the effect on quality and reasonable debate.
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    Ever thought that maybe I toss in the "master race derailment tactic" after being called an idiot by you?

    You've now shown twice in this thread what an utter hypocrite you are. Both of these times I've pointed it out.
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    (Original post by ArthurOliver)
    Yup. That be the question.

    About the poor posts - I'm saying that D&D is killed by all the base insults, unsupported arguments, and deliberate diversions and obfuscations - all the yeahbutwhys, whatdoyoumeans and Idisputethemeaningofthatwords - they go on forever if the goodwill debaters allow it by adjusting downward to the idiot level. I already had in mind the question asked in another thread of why D&D was so quiet and was thinking of the voices I missed.

    The idiots (beekeeper, thud, cottonmouth or whoever) might yet explain why "Muslims" are right to be outraged. I'd like to see it.
    Oh please, stop being a hypocrite. A delusional one, that hallucinates at that.

    All credibility is falling away from you at this point.
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    (Original post by Thud)
    Ever thought that maybe I toss in the "master race derailment tactic" after being called an idiot by you?

    You've now shown twice in this thread what an utter hypocrite you are. Both of these times I've pointed it out.
    Yes that's the way it works in mainstream politics Thud. But mainstream politics and it's media coverage doesn't allow for straight and honest debate.

    Those who claim that necessary and justified police action to oppose terrorism looks fascist, or that opposing views reflect a "master race" ideology - all without any justification - are given automatic respect and free-reign. The accusations being made attract a shield of what has come to be known as political-correctness. Calling such claims idiot merely adds to the guilt on the original party who has been attacked unjustly. Conservatives back off - when conservatives back off for a whole generation, conservatives are no more. That's the idea.

    Fortunately, hopefully?, honest and rational debate has the floor here.
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    (Original post by Cuddles)
    Oh please, stop being a hypocrite. A delusional one, that hallucinates at that.

    All credibility is falling away from you at this point.
    Justify!

    I quote! I explain why I think what I do!

    I've missed something here. Apologies if it's obvious.
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    (Original post by ArthurOliver)
    Justify!

    I quote! I explain why I think what I do!

    I've missed something here. Apologies if it's obvious.
    post 33 and 34. don't tell me you didn't see it.
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    Im unsue about this either. You could say that it is unfair that the police is always targeting them but you could also say past events have given reason to the police to be suspicious of radical muslim groups.

    The police can take no risk and if they had turned out to be terrorists and the police did not do anything about it, we would be facing a much larger crisis. On the other hand, it all comes down to poor 'intelligence' and the police should know enough to be almost completely sure if they are hiding a chemical device or not.

    Undoubtabely, I feel those two brothers should be compensated for the ordeal they have had to go through and the one for being shot.
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    (Original post by Cuddles)
    post 33 and 34. don't tell me you didn't see it.
    I read them but didn't get their meaning. (33) It may be that moderators can say you looked at the page after I posted and before you logged out and confirm I looked at your profile and saw where you were after I posted. That would settle the dispute. (34) Not a point at all.

    And this:
    The argument is down to such methods of profiling. The view they have shown is not the slightest extremist or strange as you make it out to be.
    Pass. I haven't a clue what it means.

    Thud,

    that last post falls into the category of unjustified attack, smear, lie, non-argument and bunkum. Quote and then dispute! We all have an open mind and we all should be judged by our posts here rather than with the (er, fascistic (you like) tactic of group responsibility and blame). Quote. Explain. Justify.

    I quoted your idiot raising of fascistic and White supremacist ideas. I explained why they are dumb and unjustified and an attempt to derail the argument and smear opposing views. See the difference?

    Again, none of this adds to my earlier point about why the D&Ders are deserting...

    edit:

    I'm back where I was: all the yeahbutwhys, whatdoyoumeans and Idisputethemeaningofthatwords - they go on forever if the goodwill debaters allow it by adjusting downward to the idiot level

    too much trouble

    bye!
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    (Original post by ArthurOliver)
    I read them but didn't get their meaning. (33) It may be that moderators can say you looked at the page after I posted and before you logged out and confirm I looked at your profile and saw where you were after I posted. That would settle the dispute.
    I'm sorry, what? Get the mods to check when I logged out for this? I know for a fact that I did not see that point. I had spoken to someone on MSN, announced I was going to bed and it was before you posted. (message history is handy)

    Stop insinuating I am a liar, because unfortunately for you, I'm not. Unlike you.

    If you really want to waste mods time on such a pointless matter as this, then go ahead. That's if you think I'm a liar.

    Secondly, so what if someone *did* read your post and not reply straight away?

    What kind of petty person are you?

    (34) Not a point at all.
    There are plenty of posts I make in a jest. Please develop a sense of humour. You clearly are in need of one.

    And this:Pass. I haven't a clue what it means.
    profiling. go and look it up.

    You are incredibly boring AO, not to mention incredibly petty. I'm surprised anyone has a debate with you. You have lost nearly most if not all crediblity in the way you debate. It's a bit of a joke? eh?

    ''but oh i cant be bothered, boohoo, people dont respond to me at the instant and people are liars!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!''

    grow yourself a brain.

    Thanks.
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    Cuddles,

    whether or not you read the post last night is quite redundant because the complaints I made about your lack of response and the relevance when it came have been reinforced by your later posts.

    My post 26 and it's claim is not constrained by any temporal limit. Your later claim that it is comes under my terms of dumbness and trolling, or deliberate diversions and obfuscations. So I can quote. We may make opposing claims in our posts but I can quote yours and be sure of rightness - you cannot (and do not) quote mine and claim similar recognition.

    Do you see the difference???

    Your post (34) might have been more obviously a joke if your "real" arguments made more sense.

    As long as you make these posts:
    Secondly, so what if someone *did* read your post and not reply straight away?

    What kind of petty person are you?
    You are incredibly boring AO, not to mention incredibly petty. I'm surprised anyone has a debate with you.
    when all you have is personal attack and pettiness you continue to make my earlier point for me:

    D&D is destroyed by idiots.
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    (Original post by ArthurOliver)
    Cuddles,

    whether or not you read the post last night is quite redundant because the complaints I made about your lack of response and the relevance when it came have been reinforced by your later posts.
    Oh, good lord! Its finally got through?

    It was you who said, that it would ''settle the dispute''. When it infact would not, the dispute is something further than that. Some obvious grievance that you have. Which once again, is completely and utterly petty.

    You contine you make yourself look a fool:

    My post 26 and it's claim is not constrained by any temporal limit. Your later claim that it is comes under my terms of dumbness and trolling, or deliberate diversions and obfuscations. So I can quote. We may make opposing claims in our posts but I can quote yours and be sure of rightness - you cannot (and do not) quote mine and claim similar recognition.
    What? Don't tell me you're being serious?

    I jumped back and forth from the other threads I was reading and posting in and saw you read my post. I have to say it's typical you didn't answer.
    you then go on to say how people like me, who do not answer your posts immediately, based on your hallucination:

    There's a pronounced problem in this forum. People post challenges and then disappear. It might just be that I post on racialist/nationalist matters and so see the anti-racialist/nationalist voices go silent, but even if it's across the board I think it's a bloody nuisance.

    Mods should make posters in D&D account for their posts. And if they can't, they should drop bombs on them.
    My ''later claim'' came from those quotes above. You have no rightness and no you cannot be sure of it. Learn to read and understand your OWN arguments, let alone mine.

    Do you see the difference???

    Your post (34) might have been more obviously a joke if your "real" arguments made more sense.
    What arguments? What you think I said above? Oh dear, AO, someone cant even understand some simple posts marking out what I've said. Someone call the doctor.

    As long as you make these posts:when all you have is personal attack and pettiness you continue to make my earlier point for me:
    Oh, no he personally attacked me! Oh for crying out loud, I gave you some helpful advice. Whereas you with some malice and spite said people like me should have ''bombs dropped'' on us.

    What kind of a rational person does something like this and also demands that mods check all posts that do not fit your standards?

    My reaction was perfectly acceptable, on the grounds of what you said to me, on the fact that you couldnt understand humour, and you still can't. Also on the fact you insisted that I must be lying.

    Bold claims coming from the likes of you, who says one minute: ''we need to find out when you logged out'' and then ''that point is redudant''

    Erm, AO, that was your point. You've just called your own points redundant. I wonder how much further this extends to your other ethos.

    D&D is destroyed by idiots.
    agreed. so if you would kindly leave.
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    I leave it to posterity.

    Goodwill Cuddles.
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    (Original post by ArthurOliver)
    I leave it to posterity.

    Goodwill Cuddles.
    Well done AO. Thanks.
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    They should not be outraged, and the people who got raided should DEFINATELY not sue.
    The culture we're getting into where everyone sues when anything goes wrong really annoys me. Sue the police now and they'll be hesitant to raid the next house that actually does have a bomb in it, and tens or hundreds of people will die. Plus the police have enough of a funding problem already without having to deal with individuals sueing them.

    The muslim community should be thankful to the police for foiling many attempted terrorist attacks since the London bombings. All the people the police have investigated are muslims because all the terrorists they have encountered so far are muslims. The police aren't randomly targeting muslims because they feel like it.
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    Ian Blair needs to go, he's a mess
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    They are right to be outraged, but non cooperation isn't the way IMO.
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    (Original post by Socrates)
    They are right to be outraged, but non cooperation isn't the way IMO.
    they did cooperate. in fact the guy who was shot had to cooperate. the police said he had to speak but only if they took away his medication.

    what really pisses me off is that the general public had been lied to. the police said that one brother had shot the other brother during the raid; which turned out to be a lie. and also that he got shot in the shoulder, but actually he was shot in the chest. it could have killed him if he havnt been standing on the top of the stairs so the bullet came from about 45degrees below him.

    i saw the live pressconference with the brothers and im shocked and appalled how the whole family have been treated. the police claimed they had a tip off that chemical bombs were in the house which turned out to be false. they could have just strolled past with one of the chemical readers outside without breaking in at 4 o clock, arresting everyone in the house including elderly people, and causing a huge public fiasco. the family didnt even know it was a police raid until they were arrested, they thought it was a break in. this was before he was shot to the ground and had his head kicked in while one policeman shouted"shut the **** up" when he asked what was going on. plus the family had been physically abused and are still in great pain. they were in a terrible state on tv. this had violate their civil liberties !!!

    ian blair has made a huge mess and clearly doesnt know how to handle such problems properly. he ruined the community's trust in the area and caused one of the brothers who were arrested, the one who had not been shot, to give up his aim in becoming a community police officer. this will have an effect on muslims around the country as they will think twice about joining the force now.

    i agree the police should be ready to stop any terrorism but ruining familys lives are not the way do it.
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    No I meant, idiots like Yvonne Ridley saying that Muslims shouldn't cooperate with the police, is not IMO, a good idea.

    Ian Blair has a lost a lot of trust with the public, and if he had any decency he would have gone after the shooting of Menses.
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    (Original post by Socrates)
    No I meant, idiots like Yvonne Ridley saying that Muslims shouldn't cooperate with the police, is not IMO, a good idea.

    Ian Blair has a lost a lot of trust with the public, and if he had any decency he would have gone after the shooting of Menses.
    i dont know who that is but she deserves to be deported to bush's gulag guantanamo

    i dont see why the police love to shoot nowadays. isn't it a bit hypocritical if a guy on the street decides to shoot someone in revenge he goes to jail. but if the poilice shoot and kill someone nothing happens except the buy off the family with a £15 000 , recieving a get out of jail free card...

    i think they should use tazers or rubber bullets instead. then the police wont have such a crap reputation
 
 
 
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