TSR George
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#1
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#1
Does a rise in body temperature when ill stimulate the immune system? I have read conflicting information it does.
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DavidYorkshireFTW
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#2
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#2
A rise in the body temperature is caused by pyrogens, which travel through the blood stream into the hypothalamus, which regulates body temperature and causes a 'fever, these pyrogens travel do this then they come into contact with certain bacteria or viruses. The increase body temperature can be enough to kill said viruses/bacteria if they are sensitive to temperature.
Hope I helped
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DavidYorkshireFTW
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#3
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#3
Well, without reading it all and just the title, there is no way of me knowing for certain, but, it makes sense, all proteins have an optimum temperature, and the normal temperature for humans (37.5) allows our digestive and other enzymes that we use in every day life an optimum (or close to) efficiency. However if we have a foreign bacteria/virus in your system your body may be required to use immune cells that it wouldn't normally use, which require a higher temperature to be able to work at optimum efficiency, so it makes sense that the body would temporarily raise its temperature in order to fight the infection
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Dynamo123
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#4
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#4
Due to chemicals called pyrogens secreted by leukocytes, bacterias and viruses, the hypothalamic set point may be displaced from the normal 37 C (310 K). As a cosequence, the patient experiences pyrexia, which is the snazzy term for fever. Following fever, the most simple explanation is that bacterial and viral proteins might be denatured and the organisms destroyed. Some other factors, such as increased leukocyte mobility and phagocytosis may also be involved.


I can't say much about the site's authenticity, but the theme they present is interesting. A 2007 study showed that fever might cause an increased proliferation of T cells. This one, which you have quoted seems to suggest that the no. of CD 8 T cells increases with an increase in temperature. This might also be due to the fact that bacterial mortality decreases with increased temperature, as in hyperthermia, so the bacteria at low temperature might have the same no. of T cells, but their mechanism of action would have been slow. There is no corroborating evidence to suggest that this might be the case. The simplest assumption would be that high temperature physiologically enhances the immune system
to do an even better job of wiping off bacteria.


(Original post by DavidYorkshireFTW)
Well, without reading it all and just the title, there is no way of me knowing for certain, but, it makes sense, all proteins have an optimum temperature, and the normal temperature for humans (37.5) allows our digestive and other enzymes that we use in every day life an optimum (or close to) efficiency. However if we have a foreign bacteria/virus in your system your body may be required to use immune cells that it wouldn't normally use, which require a higher temperature to be able to work at optimum efficiency, so it makes sense that the body would temporarily raise its temperature in order to fight the infection
Hmm, the assumption you present (the body raising its temperature slightly to activate some special T cells for greater physiological ability) appears to be a bit not in line with the research paper. It suggests that in mice at normal body temp., the CD 8 works just as well. At higher temperature, the functional ability is enhanced, which doesn't exactly match with activation of a specific immune cell. However, my assumption is not complete, and I would welcome further evidence

Note: The journal entry in the Journal of leukocyte biology can be found in pdf format here.
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hslt
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#5
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#5
(Original post by Dynamo123)
Following fever, the most simple explanation is that bacterial and viral proteins might be denatured and the organisms destroyed.
A rise of 3 degrees above an proteins normal temperature is not going to be enough to denature it - it may be enough to decrease function to some extent.

It is my understanding that the mechanisms are not well understood - but there is plenty of research to suggest that a fever increases the body's ability to destroy pathogens. Or at least, that pathogens remain in the body for longer if you lower someone's temperature when ill. Possibly because it causes the more rapid proliferation of immune cells, and possibly because it enhances their activity.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong - but I believe that there is no firm mechanistic explanation, only lots of possibilities.
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DavidYorkshireFTW
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#6
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#6
(Original post by Dynamo123)
Due to chemicals called pyrogens secreted by leukocytes, bacterias and viruses, the hypothalamic set point may be displaced from the normal 37 C (310 K). As a cosequence, the patient experiences pyrexia, which is the snazzy term for fever. Following fever, the most simple explanation is that bacterial and viral proteins might be denatured and the organisms destroyed. Some other factors, such as increased leukocyte mobility and phagocytosis may also be involved.


I can't say much about the site's authenticity, but the theme they present is interesting. A 2007 study showed that fever might cause an increased proliferation of T cells. This one, which you have quoted seems to suggest that the no. of CD 8 T cells increases with an increase in temperature. This might also be due to the fact that bacterial mortality decreases with increased temperature, as in hyperthermia, so the bacteria at low temperature might have the same no. of T cells, but their mechanism of action would have been slow. There is no corroborating evidence to suggest that this might be the case. The simplest assumption would be that high temperature physiologically enhances the immune system
to do an even better job of wiping off bacteria.




Hmm, the assumption you present (the body raising its temperature slightly to activate some special T cells for greater physiological ability) appears to be a bit not in line with the research paper. It suggests that in mice at normal body temp., the CD 8 works just as well. At higher temperature, the functional ability is enhanced, which doesn't exactly match with activation of a specific immune cell. However, my assumption is not complete, and I would welcome further evidence

Note: The journal entry in the Journal of leukocyte biology can be found in pdf format here.
Thank you for the comment, as I said, I didn't read the article, but very good analysis:rolleyes: I'm, as a biologist, impressed and hope to have the same ability when I start my degree
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ash92:)
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#7
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#7
Urm, not per se - the pathogen is what literally stimulates the immune system.
To say it as in the OP would be incorrect.

As others have said, a rise in body temp may denature some proteins in pathogens (as they most likely are suited to normal body temp).
In addition, I recall that "immune cells" are more optimal at slightly above 40.C. As Dynamo has said, mobility will be enhanced, resulting in faster neutrophil infiltration (and then phagocyte infiltration). The metabolism of these cells will also be increased, as will the rate of reaction of released chemicals such as radical oxygen species (which damage the pathogen).

Hope this helps


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Dynamo123
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#8
Report 8 years ago
#8
(Original post by hslt)
A rise of 3 degrees above an proteins normal temperature is not going to be enough to denature it - it may be enough to decrease function to some extent.

It is my understanding that the mechanisms are not well understood - but there is plenty of research to suggest that a fever increases the body's ability to destroy pathogens. Or at least, that pathogens remain in the body for longer if you lower someone's temperature when ill. Possibly because it causes the more rapid proliferation of immune cells, and possibly because it enhances their activity.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong - but I believe that there is no firm mechanistic explanation, only lots of possibilities.
Yes, there is no firm mechanistic explanation that sequentially describes the events leading to pathogen destruction during fever. We have a lot of evidence, however, but it hasn't been compiled in a single explanation yet.
As for protein inactivation, you are right, for we have observed upto 70% decrease in effectiveness at 40 C, and total ineffectiveness at 58.5 C for albumin.

(Original post by DavidYorkshireFTW)
Thank you for the comment, as I said, I didn't read the article, but very good analysis:rolleyes: I'm, as a biologist, impressed and hope to have the same ability when I start my degree
Thanks buddy
(Original post by ash92:))
Urm, not per se - the pathogen is what literally stimulates the immune system.
To say it as in the OP would be incorrect.

As others have said, a rise in body temp may denature some proteins in pathogens (as they most likely are suited to normal body temp).
In addition, I recall that "immune cells" are more optimal at slightly above 40.C. As Dynamo has said, mobility will be enhanced, resulting in faster neutrophil infiltration (and then phagocyte infiltration). The metabolism of these cells will also be reduced, as will the rate of reaction of released chemicals such as radical oxygen species (which damage the pathogen).

Hope this helps


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Ah, I was forgetting aboyt radical oxygen species. Nice recall.
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ash92:)
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#9
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#9
(Original post by Dynamo123)
Ah, I was forgetting aboyt radical oxygen species. Nice recall.
Yeh maaan, it's like totally radical dude :headbang:

[erm...excuse the pun }

EDIT: I just noticed a contradictory typo in my last post - corrected now.
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Dynamo123
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#10
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#10
(Original post by ash92:))
Yeh maaan, it's like totally radical dude :headbang:

[erm...excuse the pun }

EDIT: I just noticed a contradictory typo in my last post - corrected now.
Nice pun

I noticed the contradiction (with radical O species decreasing etc) now. Seems I should have paid more attention :facepalm::five:

:O
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ash92:)
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#11
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#11
(Original post by Dynamo123)
Nice pun

I noticed the contradiction (with radical O species decreasing etc) now. Seems I should have paid more attention :facepalm::five:

:O
Haha, yeh that's the one :teehee:
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Dynamo123
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#12
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#12
(Original post by ash92:))
Haha, yeh that's the one :teehee:
Yeah
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