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'It's the NATIONAL Health Service, not the INTERnational Health Service.' watch

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    http://www.aljazeera.com/video/europ...313650879.html
    Inane argument employed by Home Secretary Theresa May to further racist schemes and disallow migrants who have no home to go to from accessing basic healthcare. They say that doctors are demanding identification papers before they treat patients. That's absolutely disgusting. I don't think it applies to all doctors, though, because there are many NHS worker who are not British or descendants of migrants.
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    I don't see how it's racist to not give free healthcare to people who haven't and may never contribute to the system. Why should my taxes go towards treating them, when I couldn't get treatment for free in their country.
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    Its the international health service in terms of who provides the healthcare.
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    What does race have to do with immigration?
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    It's just scaremongering from the Tories.

    Today I received a Tory party leaflet through the post - we have a council bye election coming up. One thing the leaflet mentions is that if you're not British, you'll have no free use of the NHS nor will you get a home for free. What the leaflet does not mention is that the cost to the NHS of treating non British citizens accounts to 0.1% of its total expenditure. Nor does it mention that only 9% of tenants in new social housing are non-UK nationals.

    I suspect that the aim of the poster is to rally support from those who may be tempted to vote UKIP, as UKIP have put quite a lot of effort into doing well in the bye election. But in doing so, they have totally distorted the facts. So we do spend money on treating people who do not live here. So we do provide homes to non UK nationals. But there is no perspective. No mention of the fact that the numbers are so low to be almost insignificant. No mention that as far as treatment of foreign nationals is concerned, there are steps in place to recover the money spent.

    The whole leaflet is designed to make it look like we are just sitting around, giving money and homes away (and to make matters worse - to foreigners!) at an extraordinary rate. It's just rubbish scaremongering. It is a shame to see mainstream parties have to sink to the levels of parties like UKIP - levels which usually mean the facts are ignored and sensationalism is the order of the day.

    As it happens, I was used to be in the same Politics class at college with the Tory candidate who is running. He always seemed to be a nice lad when I knew him...
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    (Original post by InnerTemple)
    It's just scaremongering from the Tories.

    Today I received a Tory party leaflet through the post - we have a council bye election coming up. One thing the leaflet mentions is that if you're not British, you'll have no free use of the NHS nor will you get a home for free. What the leaflet does not mention is that the cost to the NHS of treating non British citizens accounts to 0.1% of its total expenditure. Nor does it mention that only 9% of tenants in new social housing are non-UK nationals.
    Small percentages perhaps, but what does that equate to in a nominal figure?
    Plus, marginal gains? This argument that is constantly brought up, generally by those who are anti-cuts, that a dubious expenditure is 'small' so we should simply ignore it is baffling.
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    Identification papers can also simply mean your passport. You need to prove to doctors (NHS) you are who you say you are - why should they just take your word for it ?
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    (Original post by pol pot noodles)
    Small percentages perhaps, but what does that equate to in a nominal figure?
    Plus, marginal gains? This argument that is constantly brought up, generally by those who are anti-cuts, that a dubious expenditure is 'small' so we should simply ignore it is baffling.
    Well the NHS manages to recover around £25 million of what is owed from non-UK patients who receive treatment. This leaves £100 million outstanding. The NHS's budget sits around the £108.9 billion mark.

    Of course I am not saying we should ignore it. But the response to this issue should be proportionate. It makes a great headline to say "we will stop foreigners taking your NHS services!!!" but so what? These are council elections - I want to know when they will start fixing the roads which are falling to pieces, when they will fit homes with UPVC doors which they have promised for years, what are they going to do about the parks which have just been left to go to ruin. Recently we have had a problem with massive holes opening up in the ground - one took someone's driveway with it.... what are they going to do about that?

    The fact that nationally, the NHS spends a tiny amount of its budget treating non-UK patients is pretty low on the list of concerns. In fact, even if this was a general election, I still think that there are issues above this one.

    So one wonders why this policy was number one on the leaflet I had put through the door? The answer is because UKIP are campaigning hard and the Tories have joined a race to the bottom in terms of policy ideas which will result in very little, but sound good (to the ill informed, at least).
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    (Original post by The article)
    Critics say it may put some migrants' lives at risk.
    In the same way that people in various parts of Africa, Asia, the Middle East and even the USA have their lives at risk because the NHS isn't treating them for free. But we can't save everyone, and I fail to see why out of people not entitled to be here, we should give preference to those who've broken our laws by entering illegally.
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    Are you folks aware that there are working, tax-paying migrants who are not entitled to NHS care or social welfare?
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    (Original post by pol pot noodles)
    Small percentages perhaps, but what does that equate to in a nominal figure?
    Plus, marginal gains? This argument that is constantly brought up, generally by those who are anti-cuts, that a dubious expenditure is 'small' so we should simply ignore it is baffling.
    Its more you have to compare it to the admin of charging.

    Currently if I walk into a hospital with a burn, I don't have to prove my immigration status. Is the staff time and processes to support worth the effort?

    I'm not anti cuts, but I'm certainly not up for setting up a system which costs 0.3% of NHS revenue to recover 0.1%.
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    (Original post by nic-nac)
    I don't see how it's racist to not give free healthcare to people who haven't and may never contribute to the system. Why should my taxes go towards treating them, when I couldn't get treatment for free in their country.
    Are you like the vast majority of people on TSR who shout the 'my taxes' line when you're a net reciprient of Govt funding both in year and over your lifetime to date?

    Almost by definition 'students' are leeching off the state, yet get arsey that others are too.
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    (Original post by Quady)
    Are you like the vast majority of people on TSR who shout the 'my taxes' line when you're a net reciprient of Govt funding both in year and over your lifetime to date?

    Almost by definition 'students' are leeching off the state, yet get arsey that others are too.
    That's why I said "haven't and may never contribute" I may not have contributed much, but I intend on getting a job and contributing more in the future, some of these people never will and don't intend on paying into the system.
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    (Original post by nic-nac)
    That's why I said "haven't and may never contribute" I may not have contributed much, but I intend on getting a job and contributing more in the future, some of these people never will and don't intend on paying into the system.
    Sure, just your taxes are a bit hypothetical.

    Do your comments also cover countries where we have reciprocal health care agreements?
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    (Original post by Quady)
    Sure, just your taxes are a bit hypothetical.

    Do your comments also cover countries where we have reciprocal health care agreements?
    I have paid taxes/national insurance in the past. My comment was aimed at anyone who doesn't/won't contribute to the system and foreigners from countries where we couldn't receive free healthcare at a satisfactory standard.
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    I don't really see any need for this. As a medical student who will work via the NHS, I have no qualms in treating whoever is placed in front of me (A view I hope all medical staff share, given one of the core qualities is to eliminate all bias and personal view during practice).

    For the national scale, I'm honestly not so sure how much of an impact foreign nationals and their treatment is having on the NHS or funds. InnerTemple could I have a source for your figures?

    (Original post by InnerTemple)
    What the leaflet does not mention is that the cost to the NHS of treating non British citizens accounts to 0.1% of its total expenditure. Nor does it mention that only 9% of tenants in new social housing are non-UK nationals.
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    (Original post by DivinityA)
    I don't really see any need for this. As a medical student who will work via the NHS, I have no qualms in treating whoever is placed in front of me (A view I hope all medical staff share, given one of the core qualities is to eliminate all bias and personal view during practice).

    For the national scale, I'm honestly not so sure how much of an impact foreign nationals and their treatment is having on the NHS or funds. InnerTemple could I have a source for your figures?
    Of course: http://fullfact.org/articles/immigra...benefits-29233
 
 
 
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