Can we talk about the 40% PGCE drop out rate? Anyone here dropped out?

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kpwxx
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(Original post by FilmExpert)
Thank you for the honest response. When you were having that really horrible first year, did you tell people around you about it? Did your friends know? Did they know how hard it was for you? That you considered/consider quitting? Everyone I know in teaching seems really unhappy but never talks about it. Then I read stuff like this and wonder if it is right for me.

For me, it started as 'I don't know what else to do, it's either this secure career choice or I fleet around in minimum wage jobs or unemployment'

but since getting teaching experience it has turned into 'Hey, I can actually see myself doing this'. Now I enjoy it and want to do it. But I wonder if I have enough passion to see me through the tough times.
Thought I would share with you my experience too. I did the PGCE last year. It was very hard, stressful. I didn't have much time for me all year and I did have moments where I thought 'What if I can't do this?!' (though never thought of quitting). But it was also fun, inspirational and exciting.

I am now in my NQT year. I started my job as a Nursery teacher on 26th September and I haven't cried once! I feel, personally, under much less stress than last year. I will admit this is not the same as for many of my colleagues. I think it may be linked to the fact that I really struggle with focussing on two big things at once (e.g. placement and assignments). Now I can throw my all into teaching MY class I can just focus more, I am having more time for me etc. Yes there are fresh challenges and the amount of work for school is much higher, and there are so many new experiences to deal with. But honestly I am loving it.

(Original post by Juichiro)
Jesus Christ, this is so depressing. I don't know what to say. I volunteer in two schools: one wonderful, the other one not that wonderful. In the wonderful school, kids are nice and while the lessons are fast paced and really dynamic, I see myself standing there delivering the lessons (which I will soon do as a volunteer ). In the not wonderful school, I see myself as more of a game changer, as a crazy optimistic which is going to show those bored kids why I think my subject is the place to be. No boring irrelevant stuff but things that make you thrill and chill and laugh and cry. If I am ever a teacher in a tough school, I will want to get those hyperactive bad-behaved kids sat down to listen in an informal way why I (not as a teacher but as a person who has been a student like them) think they should listen to what I have to say. Because what I have to say is something they will like, something they will love. I will infuse interest and motivation within them.
I am a very positive person. I don't know how I'd get on in the job if I wasn't! I just wanted to note, regarding people's replies to your post, there is a difference between wanting to inspire and be a great teacher and being unrealistic.

I know that statistically a certain number of my pupils will probably get 'lost' through their educational experience. They will switch off, have behaviour issues that they never overcome, be let down by a teacher or lack motivation and end up where they don't want to be. But honestly I see no point in sitting there and dwelling on that. I accept the reality but I also constantly believe that I can make a difference for each individual... does that make sense? If I said that that child is lost then for me I would think why am I even bothering then. And it is worth it for me if even one child has their path changed to a more positive outcome for them... those moments when the child with behaviour issues has a brilliant day. Those moments when a child you were worried about makes a huge step in their learning. Those moments when you see a pupil who was uninterested become passionate about something they are learning. To me, it doesn't matter if it's not as super duper as you would wish for, as long as you have a few of those moments.

Obviously I am still early on. I haven't even pass Christmas yet! Perhaps the rest of the year will be harder (though usually people say this is the hardest time of the year) or perhaps NQT+1 will be tougher for me. And maybe I will wear down a bit as I go through my career. But I have always been a positive person, and though I don't think my teaching will be like a movie I do think that I can get little bits right and constantly improve, and even that small difference to a life is worth all the stress for me!


Ok that sounds so soppy and 'Hey I'm young and positive!!!' lol. But I just wanted to post a positive experience in amongst all this negativity.

xxx
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Mr M
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(Original post by awe)
Certainly a sobering thread, guys! P:

I don't think I'm under any blinding illusions as to what will happen when my course hopefully begins, because I try not to have any real expectations. I am determined to make it as easy as possible for myself by cutting off all distractions and making sure my partner, working elsewhere, is on board for the year emotionally and understands the limiting timetable I'll likely have. I'm not imagining a first classroom too much, and I'm not attempting to envision myself changing the lives of the children I come into contact with. Equally, obviously, I'm ignoring any thought of dropping out or bowing under pressure. I know that I can take a great many terrible times and experiences because I have before and will again, and I think the money and time being put into something such as a teacher training course is far too valuable to give up before its over. I am determined to take each day as it comes, to absolutely freaking relish the good things, and to have a really brilliant cry about anything bad - and then to go to sleep and attempt to forget/overcome it somehow the next day. Full-picture realism is the only thing I want to be thinking when I start... so hopefully I will.

Thank you, though, for all the honest responses here. I think it's very good to have this side of the argument available. I especially value the opinions of current working teachers towards the education politics going on, so feel free to embellish on that! I would enjoy reading further thoughts.
You sound well equipped for the challenge ahead.
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Carnationlilyrose
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(Original post by kpwxx)

Ok that sounds so soppy and 'Hey I'm young and positive!!!' lol. But I just wanted to post a positive experience in amongst all this negativity.

xxx
It's great that you feel like this and we certainly need fresh blood. I think your experience as a nursery teacher is very different to the secondary school experiences I have been talking about, where the stresses and flashpoints are very different. I hope you continue to be happy and positive.
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kpwxx
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(Original post by carnationlilyrose)
It's great that you feel like this and we certainly need fresh blood. I think your experience as a nursery teacher is very different to the secondary school experiences I have been talking about, where the stresses and flashpoints are very different. I hope you continue to be happy and positive.
Thanks!

Yes, well I feel like I have it easy because it's like... Nursery is great! EYFS is great! I find it so much easier. But I can't tell if it is actually like that or if it's because I am so passionate about the ethos etc that it removes other stresses? I know some people say they wouldn't be able to handle the way of EYFS or the tininess of the children, but the idea of the older ones scares me a lot!

xxx
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Carnationlilyrose
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(Original post by kpwxx)
Thanks!

Yes, well I feel like I have it easy because it's like... Nursery is great! EYFS is great! I find it so much easier. But I can't tell if it is actually like that or if it's because I am so passionate about the ethos etc that it removes other stresses? I know some people say they wouldn't be able to handle the way of EYFS or the tininess of the children, but the idea of the older ones scares me a lot!

xxx
Being a parent, I know very well I couldn't stand dealing with runny noses and untied shoelaces for a minute. I'd be demented by the end of the first morning. Teenagers have plenty of problems, but they are more in my line than munchkins. Horses for courses.
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username1170246
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(Original post by kpwxx)
Thought I would share with you my experience too. I did the PGCE last year. It was very hard, stressful. I didn't have much time for me all year and I did have moments where I thought 'What if I can't do this?!' (though never thought of quitting). But it was also fun, inspirational and exciting.
Thanks for sharing your experience, it's good to have some positive experiences in the thread. I am concerned I might not be 'cut out' for it, as teaching isn't my first choice in career, although I do enjoy it, I don't know if I have enough passion. I feel like it's either, I teach, or I am unemployed or working low pay jobs that I hate for the rest of my life. Teaching is stable, and the pay isn't terrible. That's the sad reality for me.

Why did you initially go into teaching, may I ask? & what was your job/degree background?
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username1170246
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(Original post by Steveluis10)
at the end of the day even if you did hate it it's a year of your life. The most likely alternative is you'd be unemployed or struggling in another poorly paid job you hate.
This is my attitude going into it. But I wonder if it's the best attitude to have. Am I just doing it because it's my only option? I don't want to be unhappy with my job for the rest of my life but I also don't want to be unemployed or working on a lower pay.

A year isn't too long, but unless you do maths, computing or chemistry, or have a 1st degree, you so will be paying £5000-£9000 fees too. So would be a waste of money as well.
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Oliver Queen
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If you can't handle a bunch of kids trying it on and giving you a bit of verbal then I do think you need to toughen up a bit mentally and maybe go and sit in a state school that has a bad reputation and try and see things from another perspective.

I went to a horrendous state school myself and I myself was no angel and I had my moments but maturity does come and with hindsight I know why I had those moments. I often got bored and detached from lessons that were just monotonous and I became distant to the teacher and their methods. I'd then fidget and get distracted and do something to keep myself awake during the lesson.

If a pupil asks 'why do we have to learn this crap?' then answer in the right way and put a bit of back information on it and try and add your own story on it so that its not just 'because you have to do so'. The thing is, loads of secondary school pupils are craving to be addressed like adults but feel they aren't by their parents maybe or the school or even the system and government and we've all been through that phase when we were younger of having an attitude.

Im looking forward to my PGCE and whilst I will at first be nervous about getting up in front of a class to teach I will learn and be dedicated to not only the task of expressing my subject knowledge further afield but also supporting them and helping them gain an understanding of what matters and how things are.

I was nervous when I first got in a car, the roads full of other drivers tailgating me trying to bully me into speeding up and doing what they wanted. I overcame that and I will use my passion to become a teacher to overcome the hurdles that teachers face on a daily basis. Of course its not going to be easy but thats life, its never easy.

You go into a corporate scene and you'll have adults stabbing you in the back trying to climb the career ladder and make their big break. They'll do that behind your back and they'll tell your colleagues things about you or talk about you at the table at lunch to try and get their cliques going. Thats just life. Be prepared for people to say bad things about you.

At least school children are straight up with it and will tell you its crap if its crap and be honest. Its good to be a good talker but I see nothing wrong with asking them 'what would you prefer? why is this not coming across right for you?'. Listen to them and reason with them and understand that they are human beings who should be respected. As a teacher you have a lot to learn as well and there will be children in that class who learn at home about the subject you teach and know more than you.

I may be fortunate in that my subject can be both academic and vocational (computer science) so I'll most likely be able to take them into the computer room, get them involved in things and alleviate the boredom somewhat from a normal classroom setting. I think a lot of pupils get bored and speak out because they want to test teachers. I will happily cater to different learning styles because I myself struggle to take things in from just having someone in front of a whiteboard speaking. Different approaches reach different people and keep them interested.

YouTube videos to show things, props such as devices and hardware, group sessions, get pupils involved and if they make a mistake so be it because thats life.

I remember one teacher I had for history and she said to us at the beginning of the year 'if you do all your work in the week then Friday afternoon we'll watch a film in that lesson'. She said to us that life is about working hard and playing hard and that if you put in the effort you deserve to reap the rewards. Everyone worked their socks off in the class, people got involved in what to some is regarded as a boring subject (I love history however :P ) and we watched a film every week. I ended up with an A in History and most others in my class had at least a B or above in a state school that had a bad reputation at the time.

Be someone who cares and be someone willing to go that extra mile to make a difference. You put in the effort and you'll reap the rewards as well when you get pupils thanking you for believing in them.
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Juichiro
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(Original post by Oliver Queen)
If you can't handle a bunch of kids trying it on and giving you a bit of verbal then I do think you need to toughen up a bit mentally and maybe go and sit in a state school that has a bad reputation and try and see things from another perspective.

I went to a horrendous state school myself and I myself was no angel and I had my moments but maturity does come and with hindsight I know why I had those moments. I often got bored and detached from lessons that were just monotonous and I became distant to the teacher and their methods. I'd then fidget and get distracted and do something to keep myself awake during the lesson.

If a pupil asks 'why do we have to learn this crap?' then answer in the right way and put a bit of back information on it and try and add your own story on it so that its not just 'because you have to do so'. The thing is, loads of secondary school pupils are craving to be addressed like adults but feel they aren't by their parents maybe or the school or even the system and government and we've all been through that phase when we were younger of having an attitude.

Im looking forward to my PGCE and whilst I will at first be nervous about getting up in front of a class to teach I will learn and be dedicated to not only the task of expressing my subject knowledge further afield but also supporting them and helping them gain an understanding of what matters and how things are.

I was nervous when I first got in a car, the roads full of other drivers tailgating me trying to bully me into speeding up and doing what they wanted. I overcame that and I will use my passion to become a teacher to overcome the hurdles that teachers face on a daily basis. Of course its not going to be easy but thats life, its never easy.

You go into a corporate scene and you'll have adults stabbing you in the back trying to climb the career ladder and make their big break. They'll do that behind your back and they'll tell your colleagues things about you or talk about you at the table at lunch to try and get their cliques going. Thats just life. Be prepared for people to say bad things about you.

At least school children are straight up with it and will tell you its crap if its crap and be honest. Its good to be a good talker but I see nothing wrong with asking them 'what would you prefer? why is this not coming across right for you?'. Listen to them and reason with them and understand that they are human beings who should be respected. As a teacher you have a lot to learn as well and there will be children in that class who learn at home about the subject you teach and know more than you.

I may be fortunate in that my subject can be both academic and vocational (computer science) so I'll most likely be able to take them into the computer room, get them involved in things and alleviate the boredom somewhat from a normal classroom setting. I think a lot of pupils get bored and speak out because they want to test teachers. I will happily cater to different learning styles because I myself struggle to take things in from just having someone in front of a whiteboard speaking. Different approaches reach different people and keep them interested.

YouTube videos to show things, props such as devices and hardware, group sessions, get pupils involved and if they make a mistake so be it because thats life.

I remember one teacher I had for history and she said to us at the beginning of the year 'if you do all your work in the week then Friday afternoon we'll watch a film in that lesson'. She said to us that life is about working hard and playing hard and that if you put in the effort you deserve to reap the rewards. Everyone worked their socks off in the class, people got involved in what to some is regarded as a boring subject (I love history however :P ) and we watched a film every week. I ended up with an A in History and most others in my class had at least a B or above in a state school that had a bad reputation at the time.

Be someone who cares and be someone willing to go that extra mile to make a difference. You put in the effort and you'll reap the rewards as well when you get pupils thanking you for believing in them.
Really good post. What are you going to apply for?
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Mr M
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(Original post by Oliver Queen)
If you can't handle a bunch of kids trying it on and giving you a bit of verbal then I do think you need to toughen up a bit mentally ...
Other people are not expected to put up with abuse in their workplace so why should teachers? Anyway, we are talking about issues that are rather more serious than "a bit of verbal".

(Original post by Oliver Queen)
If a pupil asks 'why do we have to learn this crap?' then answer in the right way and put a bit of back information on it and try and add your own story on it so that its not just 'because you have to do so'.
They are not seeking an answer - it is just a deliberate attempt to derail the lesson and needs to be quashed. A suitable response might be "I'll glad you asked that. Stay behind at lunch and we can have a really long discussion about it."

(Original post by Oliver Queen)
You go into a corporate scene and you'll have adults stabbing you in the back trying to climb the career ladder and make their big break. They'll do that behind your back and they'll tell your colleagues things about you or talk about you at the table at lunch to try and get their cliques going. Thats just life. Be prepared for people to say bad things about you.
I don't recognise this at all.

(Original post by Oliver Queen)
I see nothing wrong with asking them 'what would you prefer?
No need. They would prefer to discuss celebrities and play with their phones.

(Original post by Oliver Queen)
IThere will be children in that class who learn at home about the subject you teach and know more than you.
I've yet to met one.

(Original post by Oliver Queen)
I'll most likely be able to take them into the computer room, get them involved in things and alleviate the boredom somewhat from a normal classroom setting.
They go to computer rooms all the time so it is a "normal classroom setting" for them.

(Original post by Oliver Queen)
I will happily cater to different learning styles ...
There's no such thing.

(Original post by Oliver Queen)
YouTube videos to show things
Banned by most school networks.

(Original post by Oliver Queen)
I remember one teacher I had for history and she said to us at the beginning of the year 'if you do all your work in the week then Friday afternoon we'll watch a film in that lesson'.
Banned by most school leaderships.

(Original post by Oliver Queen)
You put in the effort and you'll reap the rewards as well
The likelihood of a successful lesson is not proportional to the effort made by the teacher.
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Mr M
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Really good post. What are you going to apply for?
He said 'Computer Science' in that post.
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(Original post by Mr M)
Other people are not expected to put up with abuse in their workplace so why should teachers? Anyway, we are talking about issues that are rather more serious than "a bit of verbal".



They are not seeking an answer - it is just a deliberate attempt to derail the lesson and needs to be quashed. A suitable response might be "I'll glad you asked that. Stay behind at lunch and we can have a really long discussion about it."



I don't recognise this at all.



No need. They would prefer to discuss celebrities and play with their phones.



I've yet to met one.



They go to computer rooms all the time so it is a "normal classroom setting" for them.



There's no such thing.



Banned by most school networks.



Banned by most school leaderships.



The likelihood of a successful lesson is not proportional to the effort made by the teacher.

It would not hurt you to be a a little bit more optimistic/enthusiastic.
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Juichiro
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(Original post by Mr M)
He said 'Computer Science' in that post.
Just woke up minutes ago.
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RachelB11
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Re the behavioural problems - what they say about getting to know a child to get good behaviour is spot on. It gives you that opportunity to catch them off guard behaving so that you can give praise, connects them to you as a fellow human being and gives you an opportunity to explain what you don't like about the behaviour making it clear it's the behaviour not them personally.
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sliceofcake
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I'm not doing a PGCE but I have a friend on Facebook who is. Reading the statuses she posts that her PGCE friends reply to have honestly been enough to put me off of the idea of teaching for the rest of my life (not that I had any thought to go into teaching). While they all admit that some days makes it all seem completely worth it and they keep encouraging each other with "it'll be over soon", I've slowly witnessed the happiness completely drain from them all and it's devastating. She was quite nervous yet excited about it at first but then she posted something the other day along the lines of how she can't bring herself to get out of bed and she's been crying all day. Not a one off occurance for either, I don't think. I'm sure if you really care about it then once it's all over it will be worth it but this genuinely seems like the hardest year(s?) of their lives. I don't know what being a fully qualified and practicing teacher is like, especially in comparison to the work of the PGCE students. I've heard it gets harder but at the same time easier. If the course doesn't accurately represent what it's like to be a teacher then why is the course the way it is? Does it need to be so demanding? Surely it's not as terrible when you're an actual teacher?
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kpwxx
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(Original post by FilmExpert)
Thanks for sharing your experience, it's good to have some positive experiences in the thread. I am concerned I might not be 'cut out' for it, as teaching isn't my first choice in career, although I do enjoy it, I don't know if I have enough passion. I feel like it's either, I teach, or I am unemployed or working low pay jobs that I hate for the rest of my life. Teaching is stable, and the pay isn't terrible. That's the sad reality for me.

Why did you initially go into teaching, may I ask? & what was your job/degree background?
I wanted to be a teacher for a while. Even though I was very shy around children I wanted to work with then from around year 5. At first I thought a nanny would be good, eventually settled on teacher somewhere around year 9. I've always enjoyed learning and teaching is a job where you have to be constantly learning to improve yourself, as well as the fact you are always helping others learn. It also has a reward for me. I get depressed when I think about how much of his time my partner puts in to a job which he hates as it's all he can get at the moment. We spend so much of our time as adults working I don't think I could handle it if I didn't think what I was doing long term was worthwhile and enjoyable.

I did a maths decree followed by a Primary (Early years) PGCE at UEA. I chose this route because I didn't want to do an undergrad degree in education to find that teaching isn't for me, and then be like "What do I do?" Maths is something else I love, and it opens a lot of doors if a. I turned out to be awful at teaching, b. I couldn't find a teaching job, c. I ever wanted to change career- especially relevant as the retirement age is increasing! It also helps me with maths teaching even though the material is obviously not what I am teaching 3 year olds lol. It's more about the understanding and the passion.



(Original post by Mr M)
Other people are not expected to put up with abuse in their workplace so why should teachers? Anyway, we are talking about issues that are rather more serious than "a bit of verbal".
Have you ever worked in another customer facing role? Shop assistants? Telephone operators? Anyone who works for the council/govt.? Bus drivers? Train ticket officers? I could go on. People face abuse every day in various jobs, the difference with teaching is that you don't have to put up with it, you deal with it in the way you and the school choose. And that with pupils I find it way easier to see why they are behaving this way which makes it a lot easier to handle.


No need. They would prefer to discuss celebrities and play with their phones.
This is a bit presumptuous. Yes there are some pupils who feel like this but to judge all as just being uninterested removes the opportunity for you to analyse your teaching and I feel is very unfair to the pupils. Also, it's not just a case of that... You then have to ask why would they prefer that? Why are they disengaged? What do they need as an individual to re-engage with education? Lastly there are very few pupils even at secondary level who don't have some lessons or subjects they have enjoyed somewhere along the line.

There's no such thing.
There might not be learning styles for individuals in the model that people talk about (kinaesthetic, visual etc) but surely you can see the value of using different methods to teach things? For a start it takes away boredom. Secondly it engages pupils more if you find something they enjoy doing. Thirdly presenting things in different ways gives then more opportunities to understand... Have you never not understood something until you've seen a diagram? Or figured out what someone meant when you read it written down a few times?

Xxx


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username1170246
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(Original post by sliceofcake)
I'm not doing a PGCE but I have a friend on Facebook who is. Reading the statuses she posts that her PGCE friends reply to have honestly been enough to put me off of the idea of teaching for the rest of my life (not that I had any thought to go into teaching). While they all admit that some days makes it all seem completely worth it and they keep encouraging each other with "it'll be over soon", I've slowly witnessed the happiness completely drain from them all and it's devastating. She was quite nervous yet excited about it at first but then she posted something the other day along the lines of how she can't bring herself to get out of bed and she's been crying all day. Not a one off occurance for either, I don't think. I'm sure if you really care about it then once it's all over it will be worth it but this genuinely seems like the hardest year(s?) of their lives. I don't know what being a fully qualified and practicing teacher is like, especially in comparison to the work of the PGCE students. I've heard it gets harder but at the same time easier. If the course doesn't accurately represent what it's like to be a teacher then why is the course the way it is? Does it need to be so demanding? Surely it's not as terrible when you're an actual teacher?
A lot of my friends in teaching seem so miserable. I feel bad for them. I think for a lot of graduates they feel it's the only way they can get work in this climate. It's either this or unemployment and low pay jobs. The mindset is 'I'd rather be miserable in an OK paid job than less miserable and unemployed'.

I work as a Teaching Assistant, so can't speak as a teacher, but it is one of those jobs where you never really stop. You think 'it'll be over at 3.30pm', (or whenever school finishes) but it isn't. Usually hours are until 5pm to mark books and prepare the classroom, then you don't finish on time, so you take all these books and stuff with you home. THEN you have to plan tomorrows lessons, so you're up until late at night doing this. No time for yourself. Rinse & repeat. Same goes for summer holidays, you think it's going to be a nice long break, but it's just more stress and lesson/exam planning and marking books. It really consumes your life. It's more like a 24/7 lifestyle habit than a job. And in the end, you don't even earn enough to justify the stress. Pay scale point 1, for a qualified teacher, after tax and NI, works out to about £356 a week, £425 a week if you're lucky enough to get an inner-city job. Just about covers food and bills. Still living with parents, so no rent, luckily. I guess you have to really enjoy it to some extent if you want to last.
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Mr M
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(Original post by Juichiro)
It would not hurt you to be a a little bit more optimistic/enthusiastic.
I'll stick to telling the truth if that's alright with you.
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Mr M
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(Original post by kpwxx)
Have you ever worked in another customer facing role?
Yes - I didn't train to teach until I was in my mid 30s.

(Original post by kpwxx)
People face abuse every day in various jobs, the difference with teaching is that you don't have to put up with it, you deal with it in the way you and the school choose.
Adults who are verbally abusive are subject to arrest and prosecution. Schoolchildren are routinely let off and their teachers disciplined for failing to control the situation. Being told where to go by a Primary child is very different from a sinister 15 year old whispering they are going to rape your daughter and stab your wife (these threats were made to one of my colleagues before he went off with stress).

(Original post by kpwxx)
This is a bit presumptuous.
I was being facetious but my point was that professional educators are best placed to decide the content of a lesson - it should not be put to a classroom vote.
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Oliver Queen
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(Original post by Mr M)
Other people are not expected to put up with abuse in their workplace so why should teachers? Anyway, we are talking about issues that are rather more serious than "a bit of verbal".

  • Air hostesses
  • Customer service reps
  • Tube supervisors
  • Traffic wardens
  • Police officers
  • Most corporate professions there is *****ing



They are not seeking an answer - it is just a deliberate attempt to derail the lesson and needs to be quashed. A suitable response might be "I'll glad you asked that. Stay behind at lunch and we can have a really long discussion about it."
Thats an assumption. Children are all different and you should stop generalising them. Maybe if you were a better identifier and reader of people you'd see those who want to learn from those who don't.

You are not psychic either and each child will have his/her own problem/reason for derailing the lesson. Ever considered you may just be seen as a boring teacher so they play up in your lessons? Judging by your attitude I'm quite inclined to believe that you believe the fault is always with them and not yourself.

I don't recognise this at all.
Well I can assure you it does happen and that the corporate world, having worked in it for 2 years, is full of people like those in the Apprentice. They are on a mission to the top and will quite happily stab you in the back if needs be to get there. A few bad words here and there to the manager to try and sway his opinion.

No need. They would prefer to discuss celebrities and play with their phones.
Another absurd generalisation.

I've yet to met one.
I've met plenty. Like I've said, your experiences don't and won't reflect those of everybody. I have been in schools where the children are polite and I have been in schools where the children are not and act up. Adults don't change either, they're just better at masking their immaturity and true motives.


They go to computer rooms all the time so it is a "normal classroom setting" for them.
Another generalisation made on the experiences at your school.

There's no such thing.
There are multiple learning styles and of course they exist. Another absurd statement.


Banned by most school networks.
Plan the lesson in advance and download the video to present. Its not exactly hard and takes all of 5 minutes.

Banned by most school leaderships.
Most, not all. You said it yourself. If its an option, its an option.

The likelihood of a successful lesson is not proportional to the effort made by the teacher.
Fair point as things can occur during the lesson that throws it all up in the air but if you make an effort and care you very well may see progress. Im guessing by your attitude that you've had bad experiences and now don't care as much and you are happy to spread your pessimistic tone to the far reaches.

(Original post by kpwxx)
There might not be learning styles for individuals in the model that people talk about (kinaesthetic, visual etc) but surely you can see the value of using different methods to teach things? For a start it takes away boredom. Secondly it engages pupils more if you find something they enjoy doing. Thirdly presenting things in different ways gives then more opportunities to understand... Have you never not understood something until you've seen a diagram? Or figured out what someone meant when you read it written down a few times?
That alone proved he was clueless. There are numerous different learning styles and you have pointed out two of them. I have identified mine whilst at university. I find learning from lecture slides hard and I am more of a hands on learner and need to be practical and so on to learn. Finding out your own best methods of learning proves this does exist.

I fear that the person in question, Mr M, has had terrible experiences in his school and think everyone is like that and that they are the set example for children everywhere which couldn't be more wrong. Maybe its time he stopped generalising an entire sector of society on the basis of his life experiences because the world is bigger that what he has lived.

I have been in schools where the children are polite and want to do well. These schools are more likely to be private and professionally kept. I have been in state schools where they have enforced a professional setting to try and bring a degree of respect within the school. I have been in state schools where the children go berserk and are hard for the teachers to handle.

Like I said, adults can be equally as immature and horrible yet they're just better at masking it with often more serious motives such as getting promotion in the workplace.
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