Oxford appliations: fair? Watch

Stonedlove
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(Original post by fluteflute)
You're right to say that Oxford isn't that different from other unis

But also don't let the people you met at interview put you off - the students who apply can be quite different from the students who get in
Students from private schools are 8 times more likely to be offered a place than students from state schools with the same qualifications.
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1298977
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(Original post by Stonedlove)
Students from private schools are 8 times more likely to be offered a place than students from state schools with the same qualifications.
By same qualifications, do you mean same grades as well as same entrance test scores?

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Noble.
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(Original post by Stonedlove)
Students from private schools are 8 times more likely to be offered a place than students from state schools with the same qualifications.
Perhaps that would mean something if Oxford gave offers out solely on the basis of standard qualifications. Practically everyone applying has the same qualifications, precisely why there's admissions tests and interviews.
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Noble.
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(Original post by souktik)
By same qualifications, do you mean same grades as well as same entrance test scores?

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No, of course the statistic doesn't include entrance test scores. It's just a pointless statistic, like usual.
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fluteflute
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(Original post by Stonedlove)
Students from private schools are 8 times more likely to be offered a place than students from state schools with the same qualifications.
Please don't make silly statements like that, (unless you can provide a decent source to back them up).

The academic research that I've seen, says the opposite is true. (Although of course I'm willing to be contradicted.)
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1298977
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(Original post by Noble.)
No, of course the statistic doesn't include entrance test scores. It's just a pointless statistic, like usual.
Thought so... :rolleyes:

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fluteflute
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(Original post by Noble.)
No, of course the statistic doesn't include entrance test scores. It's just a pointless statistic, like usual.
Or give that we've not come across it before, more likely a completely made up statistic.
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Stonedlove
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(Original post by Noble.)
No, of course the statistic doesn't include entrance test scores. It's just a pointless statistic, like usual.
If you have any love for this country and care about civic peace you should not belittle these statistics as pointless. A growing number of working class people in this country are becoming aware of the old boys network that has been running things. It can't carry on the way it is much longer, you will see civil unrest if the majority of citizens feel excluded from our "finest" institutions and feel their path to social mobility is blocked by the haves wanting to KEEP everything for themselves and their off spring.
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Noble.
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(Original post by fluteflute)
Or give that we've not come across it before, more likely a completely made up statistic.
Well given that I get the impression most of those from private schools are disadvantaged when compared to state students applying to Oxford, pretty much.
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Limebuddhist
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(Original post by Stonedlove)
How did your interviews go?
Not awful, not brilliant, no way of telling
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dreamer959
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It may look as if private school students are more likely to get in because of snobbery, but I don't think that's the case. Almost all of my teachers went to Oxbridge, which means we got plenty of prep and advice before our interviews; I met plenty of people from state schools who had no idea what their interview would look like, because there was no one around to help them, so blaming it all on snobbery isn't fair. Out of curiosity, where did u read the 8 times more likely thing?
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Noble.
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(Original post by Stonedlove)
If you have any love for this country and care about civic peace you should not belittle these statistics as pointless. A growing number of working class people in this country are becoming aware of the old boys network that have been running things. It can't carry on the way it is much longer, you will see civil unrest if the majority of citizens feel excluded from our "finest" institutions and feel their path to social mobility is blocked by the haves wanting to KEEP everything for themselves and their off spring.
Given that I come from very much a 'working class' family I don't really disagree that everyone should have the opportunity to apply to Oxford. The fact of the matter is, those from disadvantaged backgrounds already get a 'boost' in the application procedure (I myself would've got two flags, one for living in an area where there's a high chance of poverty, and coming from a very poor secondary school) - this is already more than enough, to give any further advantage to the working class just undermines the world-class academic institution Oxford is, it isn't supposed to be a pity party for the poor.
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Stonedlove
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(Original post by souktik)
By same qualifications, do you mean same grades as well as same entrance test scores?

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Same grades at GCSE and A level. In one town the local state school had almost exactly the same GCSE/AS level results as the local private school. The state school put forward 17% of their students to apply to Oxbridge while the private school put forward 66% of their students.
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fluteflute
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(Original post by Stonedlove)
Same grades at GCSE and A level. In one town the local state school had almost exactly the same GCSE/AS level results as the local private school. The state school put forward 17% of their students to apply to Oxbridge while the private school put forward 66% of their students.
You still haven't found a source for the 8x figure. Did you make it up?
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Stonedlove
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(Original post by Noble.)
Given that I come from very much a 'working class' family I don't really disagree that everyone should have the opportunity to apply to Oxford. The fact of the matter is, those from disadvantaged backgrounds already get a 'boost' in the application procedure (I myself would've got two flags, one for living in an area where there's a high chance of poverty, and coming from a very poor secondary school) - this is already more than enough, to give any further advantage to the working class just undermines the world-class academic institution Oxford is, it isn't supposed to be a pity party for the poor.
That's what happens, the few who are "let in" become gate keepers
I didn't say working class should be let in or given special treatment. I said that private school students with the same qualifications were 8 times more likely to get in.
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Noble.
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(Original post by Stonedlove)
That's what happens, the few who are "let in" become gate keepers
I didn't say working class should be let in or given special treatment. I said that private school students with the same qualifications were 8 times more likely to get in.
Yes, because they performed better in the interview and admissions tests. Also, there's more than 'a few' working-class students at Oxford. It just sounds like you're trying to convince yourself if you get rejected it's because you're "working class" as opposed to the reality - you just weren't as good as other applicants.

EDIT: We also haven't seen where you've got this statistic from.
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Stonedlove
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(Original post by souktik)
Thought so... :rolleyes:

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Also white males gain admission disproportionately. It is suspected that this is because of homophily, most tutors doing the interviewing being white males.
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dutchmaths
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(Original post by Stonedlove)
Same grades at GCSE and A level. In one town the local state school had almost exactly the same GCSE/AS level results as the local private school. The state school put forward 17% of their students to apply to Oxbridge while the private school put forward 66% of their students.
So wouldn't this be more of a problem within schools than it is a problem within Oxbridge? Universities can't force people to apply, the public school in this case should clearly have encouraged more of its students to apply to an Oxbridge university. Also do you have any statistics on how many people from the schools actually got in in this case? Any sources to back your statements up in general?
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Stonedlove
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(Original post by Noble.)
Yes, because they performed better in the interview and admissions tests. Also, there's more than 'a few' working-class students at Oxford. It just sounds like you're trying to convince yourself if you get rejected it's because you're "working class" as opposed to the reality - you just weren't as good as other applicants.

EDIT: We also haven't seen where you've got this statistic from.
I'm working class but my SCHOOL is not. My school is in the top 10 state schools for gaining admission to Oxford. So I am not disadvantaged at all, I got interview practice, my year head came in on a Saturday morning to give me extra interview practice. So you got me wrong. I have friends who go to comprehensives but I go to a grammar school.
Not everything has to be from a selfish point of view. I can talk about the plight of working class kids, without thinking personally of my own application.
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Limebuddhist
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(Original post by dutchmaths)
So wouldn't this be more of a problem within schools than it is a problem within Oxbridge? Universities can't force people to apply, the public school in this case should clearly have encouraged more of its students to apply to an Oxbridge university. Also do you have any statistics on how many people from the schools actually got in in this case? Any sources to back your statements up in general?
Public school doesn't mean state school
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