The upper echelons of society very cliquey towards those outside their circle?

Hello, I am at university in my second year, and thus so far I have done okay in terms of my studies. I consider myself hard working, articulate and friendly towards people, even though I can be cynical and not have faith in humanity at times.

This issue is that, as a young male in my early twenties, I certainly feel as though fellow students (particularly my generation- 18-25), within universities are/or can very much come across as ostentatious in regard to, the way they portray themselves, how they dress and in how they treat others.

This generally is exemplified with the kind of over-proliferation of the typical 'middle class' spoiled individual, that seems to be 'part and parcel' of the higher educational system.

The Yuppie, flamboyant 'daddies girl' and Jack Willis wearing males seem to frequent university up and down the country, making themselves known, through overt means, such as speaking in such a refined manner, that one would call this over the top. I just feel that modesty has gone out of the window, with regard, to us all treating one and other with respect.

Like for example, I am very down to earth, and I can accept anyone from any background (despite my post- which inadvertently implies spitefulness), though, it can be said the such individuals as stressed in the above, seem to just disregard people if they speak with a certain accent.

This is more apparent with Northerners and Southerners, with Northerners being seen to be the weaker, of lesser party of the two, based on perceived value of a person, accent, regional differences, how they dress and cultural etiquette.

The point is, there are many of these people within university (generalizing here), that despite their ignorance and contempt for people that speak or act, or come from a less than affluent/rigorous educational background, they still come out on top. With respect to securing employment, or getting onto a grad scheme.

Simply because they are wealthy or they 'know people', albeit, the right people. Even if lets say, they didn't work as hard at university, as someone who is from a very working class background, but is modest, dedicated and intelligent, these people still triumph over those that are disadvantaged.

The over-arching idea of this thread was for me to exemplify how these people seem to cut out people they perceive as of lower class, but also in why they do this? Other than the fact it is a divide, why should this be the reason? What ever happened to politeness and manners? Which as I am sure, 'them', being so educated and eloquent should possess such basic levels of modesty and know how to treat people.

Its like, in my job, many of the guests that we get are of the higher bracket range, in terms of what they earn, and their status in society. It just annoys me that they seem so scornful towards me, even when I offer my hand in friendship. Also, this extends to employment and the like, because such people always seem to possess something I don't have, thus seem to be part of this invisible 'in-crowd'.

It is rather annoying if you are someone that works hard, and is modest, and they chose to hire someone within their circle (even if I am employed within the same company).
I have encountered this sort of situation lots of times, where I have offered up my portfolio to potential clients, and they have implied their interest, only to be fed the same line "we will get back to you...", even when they don't or I know they won't.

They then fob me off for someone else, and I am left wondering why that person is so good, and I am not?

Any advice, or general insight?

p.s. Modesty, real hard work, dedication and character over perceived prestige, social class, snobbery and elitism. Not "...one for the boy", but one for the many :smile:

Reply 1

Anonymous #1

Also....I think in reading this post to myself, I realized that it isn't as clear as I had intended.

Basically this idea of people only giving opportunities to/or communicating with those they see fit/or worthy is something that could be extended to say if you were a Director of a company. I feel that for example, if you are someone of whom is held in good esteem with directors or CEO's you are kind of welcomed into their circle, and might be invited to external functions and the like. They see you as within their same standing of 'social class, or grasp, you can earn their money, and are a worthy voice. My thread was basically arguing this, and why it is so? Is it wrong to do so? Isn't this segregation? Even if such welcomed people are not all that great as people, or honest or particularly talented.

Reply 2

Capn cas

I will sum up what I expect to follow:

1. The nature of people is what it is.

2. 'Birds of a feather flock together'

3. Competition and selectiveness are naturally occurring.

Reply 3

MagicNMedicine

Yeah I think its true but mainly amongst the very top of the social ladder. It was only at university that I ever really experienced it.

One of the girls I lived with at uni was from a very wealthy background but she was quite down to earth (hence living with a pleb like me) although she fitted naturally in to those circles. I remember asking her about this once and she said that its hard to fit in socially with those circles if you aren't very rich because the stuff they do costs a lot of money: she was going on holiday all the time, when the summer ball came it was very competitive about what the girls were wearing and she spent like £1500 on a dress and was stressing because some other girl had spent £4000 on a dress (well I expect their parents were buying them these). Also they would all have cars, not second hand like most students that drove but they would have new cars, BMWs, Audis etc (the insurance was probably more expensive than the year's student loan) and some of them owned houses as well, their parents would buy a house for them and then get them to be the landlord for their friends.

The other side is that in these elite social circles people do judge each other on affluence, it seems materialistic to the rest of us but to them it's seen as a signal of success. There is parental pressure as well in terms of who you choose as a partner, its similar to religious pressures where some people from certain religions would be expected to pick someone of their religion, when you have very rich and successful parents sometimes there's pressure to choose someone whose parents would be from the right background. I suppose its like the royals really, Prince William brought home Kate and she was of the right class, but if Harry decides he wants to marry Cheryl Cole or Tulisa then I doubt it would be permitted.

One other point about being from a super rich background is it helps your success with the opposite sex no end. If you're a socially awkward square from low or average income background you are probably quite shy and introverted but if you are from a super high income background you are probably super confident, loud and deemed 'eccentric' rather than square, you will have loads of friends (or 'friends') and hangers on and will be able to organise and pay for amazing parties.

Reply 4

GodAtum

Do you go to Oxford or Cambridge lol? Southerners wont tend to mix with Northeners.

Reply 5

Le Nombre

Original post by MagicNMedicine

^This

Also, the old boy/girl network has always existed. To be fair if I were paying 30k plus for my child to attend a particular school I'd want guarantees, not just 'we'll do our best', and if the kid's a thicko and/or tit the old boy/girl network is the only way to make them.

(edited 10 years ago)

Reply 6

Mr_Vain

At the centre of everything is money. Get that and the world is literally your playground. This is something that the Americans comprehend a lot more clearly across the pond I think. Where social mobility and meritocracy is a lot more accepted whereas here it is seen as a bit crass. If you say you are an entrepreneur in Britain people are sceptical and even dismissive of the entire notion of personal enterprise. Whereas in America it is very much in the culture of the "American dream" to be a self starter. Think about it this way, can a working class kid here (both male and female) really amass a lot of power and money like they can if they work hard and diligently in the USA? The USA is full of examples of people in great political positions who got there from the bottom of society. The UK? You will struggle to tell most apart since they all seem to have went to the same schools. In the UK, social mobility does not really exist, you can gain a lot of money but you will never get real power if you are not part of the "old money" section of society that has been around for centuries. So, any successful entrepreneur would be best advised to move if that is what they want. And indeed, many do.

The UK is lost on me sometimes with it's worship of the old gentry, not much seems to have changed since the 1800's.

Reply 7

Alpha brah

Original post by Le Nombre

True that

Reply 8

Anonymous #1

Original post by GodAtum

Do you go to Oxford or Cambridge lol? Southerners wont tend to mix with Northeners.

No I don't attend Oxford or Cambridge. I attend a university in a place in the North of England on the east coastline.

I don't really understand why, I mean, aside from accents and regional differences both are still humans with valuable lessons to learn from one and other. There seems to be some misconception that all people from the North live like paupers and reside in mud huts, when it couldn't be more far from the truth. I understand that the reverse of this may be true for southerns, of whom may regard themselves as more 'better off' or they may be wrongly labelled this way.

Reply 9

Anonymous #1

Some very interesting viewpoints here, and I thank you all for your contributions.

From what I have gathered then, the general consensus is that, on the whole individuals within this closed off circle of 'old money', traditional gentry or otherwise wealthy people are in a position (that is far better off) to gain employment or status and power, purely because of being born into this line of peerage?
I see this as an understandable assumption for us all to make, and it is interesting what "Mr_Vain" has said about money being this centre of universe factor, in which people can do anything they want with unlimited amounts of capital...however, what about if I was talking about people of whom are generally successful (and upper class land owners, peerage/gentry etc.) but those that are simply successful for knowing people? Yet they may still potentially shun people away, even if they were from the same class or status as they once were.

I.e. if I was a pauper, and I became a rich business man, and then all of a sudden I had an abundance of ambitious 'has not's' and I turn them away. This wouldn't be a particularly pleasant thing to do, yet we see it all the time, putting aside general factors like competitiveness, and selection and the rest of it, people tend to shun people, without empathy in most cases. This is my frustration really.

I have had a few chances to get some work experience, to work with some "small-time" local businessmen to gain some industry experience. However, even to this degree (experience on a local level) it seems to be much harder for me to secure this sort of opportunity, as it would be for someone that was networked with people from "old money".

My issue is that, I seem to be getting overlooked by people, and brushed aside for people, that are already successful magnets in the business world, i.e. "fingers in too many pies". I am a student, and no matter how hard I try nobody seems to be giving me a chance. I get to the stage where I show them my portfolio and they cut contact.

Reply 10

Anonymous #1

Sorry meant to say not talking about people coming from a long line of peerage/gentry etc. But those that are simply successful without these variables.