Changing direction with MSc Computer Science question.

Some background:
I studied BA History and thoroughly enjoyed it, have now worked 2 years teaching English in Asia (an amazing experience). I have a lot of free time here and have self-taught myself HTML and Javascript and taken Coursera and other courses in Python, Java and other languages.

BASICALLY,
I am seriously considering taking an MSc to help me start a career as a computer programmer but my parents are concerned that my comparative lack of experience (compared to people who studied a BA in computer science) will be too great for me to bridge the gap.

I am wondering if anybody has any anecdotes or testimonials to share about getting into computer science from a non computing background? Can I do it?

Thankyou.

Reply 1

gbuchanan

8

Hi,

I'm an admissions tutor for computing-related MSc programmes, but once upon a time I ran a software house, and I've employed quite a lot of people who became (good) programmers via unorthodox routes.

One thing I would say is that in the long run, passion and imagination are key attributes in becoming a good programmer, and not every graduate with a BSc in Computer Science has that. Also, at MSc level, maturity, passion and enthusiasm count way more than many people recognise.Your experience in teaching people English may also help you provide an extra range of skills that will given you an advantage in a computing career - many computer folk can't explain the technology; if you can.. that will bring benefits later.

There are many successful stories of graduates in a generalist/conversion MSc making a great career in CS - I had two programmers work for me who came from conversion MScs, and both now work in the States for the (well known) company that bought me out. Andy and Paul are both great coders.

One thing you might want to consider is whether you want to choose a more focussed MSc programme like City University's eBusiness MSc, which particularly emphasises web technologies, and includes specialist lectures on usability and eCommerce systems [disclosure: I teach on this degree], or a more standard conversion MSc that provides a more open range. If you've got some idea of where you want to end up, this may tip the scales in a particular direction. One advantage of a more focussed one is that [presuming it's relevant to the area you want], it gives you great strength in one domain, which may in fact put you ahead, in that area, of 'standard' CS graduates. There are other courses in specialisms around games, finance, etc.

I hope that helps for now.

All the best,

George

Reply 2

MartinMorrison

6

Hi,

You don't need a degree in Computer Science to get a good programming job, even at places like Amazon and some banks (I have interviewed and been told this). But to pass their tests well you need a solid understanding of computational complexity, and algorithmic problem solving.

Though for a lot of programming jobs, just knowing languages well is enough.

Reply 3

gbuchanan

8

Mmm.... That's partially true....programming and CS aren't the same thing...but you may make lots of mistakes you don't realise, and you'd need a hard maths background.... Those sorts of roles are typically looking for specialists in a domain who can program, rather than a programmer per se. If you've come from a history first degree, then that won't apply - which is the OPs situation. Statistically, overall, a non CS degree gives you much poorer odds.

Reply 4

kaythanksbye

A CompSci MSc would help you get past the dreaded Human Resources filter. A lot of companies (worse at larger ones) will bin CVs that are not a clear fit with the role you are applying for. They will have a set of rules, like 'must have a numerate degree', and an MSc would let you satisfy those.

It would also help you to pass a stereotypical software interview.

The final benefit is that your MSc project will provide evidence that you can do that kind of work. A good chunk of a normal graduate programming interview is usually taken discussing your project.

I will warn you though that this MSc might be hard. If they are assuming you already have a CompSci background, you may find the courses assume you know things (from matrix algebra to basic algorithms) that you don't. Different schools teach different courses for different people, so shop around to get the right one. You may find the best course for you isn't at the best ranked school.

As an aside, if you have some portfolio, drop me a PM and I'll try and push your CV at my boss. If nothing else, the feedback might be useful for your decision.

Reply 5

c2uk

14

Original post by Hotei

Some background:
I studied BA History and thoroughly enjoyed it, have now worked 2 years teaching English in Asia (an amazing experience). I have a lot of free time here and have self-taught myself HTML and Javascript and taken Coursera and other courses in Python, Java and other languages.

BASICALLY,
I am seriously considering taking an MSc to help me start a career as a computer programmer but my parents are concerned that my comparative lack of experience (compared to people who studied a BA in computer science) will be too great for me to bridge the gap.

I am wondering if anybody has any anecdotes or testimonials to share about getting into computer science from a non computing background? Can I do it?

Thankyou.

Looks like you've asked this a while ago, so first off, are you any further with this?

And if you aren't, well there might be a conversion course for you at Cardiff that includes the possibility of doing an extending work placement:

http://courses.cardiff.ac.uk/postgraduate/course/detail/p076.html

Reply 6

poohat

18

Original post by gbuchanan

One thing you might want to consider is whether you want to choose a more focussed MSc programme like City University's eBusiness MSc, which particularly emphasises web technologies, and includes specialist lectures on usability and eCommerce systems [disclosure: I teach on this degree], or a more standard conversion MSc that provides a more open range. If you've got some idea of where you want to end up, this may tip the scales in a particular direction. One advantage of a more focussed one is that [presuming it's relevant to the area you want], it gives you great strength in one domain, which may in fact put you ahead, in that area, of 'standard' CS graduates. There are other courses in specialisms around games, finance, etc.

Do you have any salary or employment statistics which support the claim that eBusiness students have career advantages over (eg) standard CS BSc/MSc graduates? I assume someone in the department is tracking the career destination/placement of graduates, so they should be around somewhere.

While I cant find statistics for the particular Masters degree you mention (or any MSc programs for that matter), it seems the average 6 month salary for vanilla CS undergrads at City university is higher than the average salary for Business Computing Systems undergrads (which I suspect has similarities to eBusiness) at City, although both are lower than CS undergrad salaries from the handful of Russell Group universities I checked.

City:
http://unistats.direct.gov.uk/Subjects/Overview/10001478FT-USCSCI/ReturnTo/Search (City, CS, £24k)
http://unistats.direct.gov.uk/Subjects/Overview/10001478FT-USBCSY/ReturnTo/Search (City, BCS, £23k)

some random CS BSc salary figures from RGs:
http://unistats.direct.gov.uk/Subjects/Overview/10007794FT-G400-2208/ReturnTo/Search (Glasgow, £25k)
http://unistats.direct.gov.uk/Subjects/Overview/10007158FT-239/ReturnTo/Search (Southampton, £26k)
http://unistats.direct.gov.uk/Subjects/Overview/10007786FT-4COSC006UU-201213/ReturnTo/Search (Bristol, £28k)
http://unistats.direct.gov.uk/Subjects/Overview/10007788FT-UG_CSTX_KIS/ReturnTo/Search (Cambridge, £30k)
http://unistats.direct.gov.uk/Subjects/Overview/10003270FT-G400/ReturnTo/Search (Imperial, £34k)

Note: salary figures for graduates from Imperial and City above are likely to be slightly inflated since I assume more of their graduates will work in London.

(edited 10 years ago)

Reply 7

c2uk

14

Original post by poohat

Do you have any salary or employment statistics which support the claim that eBusiness students have career advantages over (eg) standard CS BSc/MSc graduates? I assume someone in the department is tracking the career destination/placement of graduates, so they should be around somewhere.

While I cant find statistics for the particular Masters degree you mention (or any MSc programs for that matter),

I don't see where he said anything of that matter?

A BSc is very different from a MSc, and no you won't find that sort of stats anywhere for MSc programmes as universities are only required to provide this sort of data for their undergraduate programmes.

Reply 8

Hotei

OP

2

Thank　you for the replies everyone、it　reassured　me looking through them.
I am contracted to　my　English teaching job until September so I asked this question early on. I have been recommended courses at a couple of Universities and I am spending my time doing some online Coursera courses in the mean time.

I have time to think about where I want to do my MSc and which specific MSc I want to do but I appreciate the replies.

Reply 9

gbuchanan

8

Original post by poohat

Do you have any salary or employment statistics which support the claim that eBusiness students have career advantages over (eg) standard CS BSc/MSc graduates? I assume someone in the department is tracking the career destination/placement of graduates, so they should be around somewhere.

Strangely, we do. The average salary from that MSc is c. £4k higher than our average for the BSc programmes.

While I cant find statistics for the particular Masters degree you mention (or any MSc programs for that matter), it seems the average 6 month salary for vanilla CS undergrads at City university is higher than the average salary for Business Computing Systems undergrads (which I suspect has similarities to eBusiness) at City, although both are lower than CS undergrad salaries from the handful of Russell Group universities I checked.

If you check some others, we are comparable to a number of them - Cambridge and Imperial are somewhat a law onto themselves. The figures are typically rounded to the nearest £1k, so differences of that size with Glasgow are, for example, fairly meaningless, and we normally level-peg with them over the years. Queen Mary are RG, London-based, and have the same average salary as us.

It's also worth noting that by 40 months, the gap between us and Southampton is reversed. Many of our students enter the financial sector, where starting salaries are generally lower, but the training schemes are particularly generous and progression is relatively rapid.

For what it is worth, you completely misunderstand what eBusiness is; it's a specifically web-development degree, which is nothing like the Business Computing BSc programme. The latter is aimed at those seeking Business Analyst roles. The equivalent MSc is Business Systems Analysis and Design - whose average salaries are over £40k at six months [again, the influence of seniority in the financial sector has a strong bearing on that, though it is also a demonstration of where a conversion MSc can get you in ahead of many BSc students.

As a footnote, the London factor is much more spread than to London universities - I did my BSc at York, and most of my cohort ended up in the capital. What is a stronger influence is the social capital of many of those going to Imperial or Cambridge, much of which they have when they arrive.

George

Reply 10

poohat

18

Fair enough, thanks for clarifying.

Changing direction with MSc Computer Science question.

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