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Should women stay at home and serve men? watch

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    (Original post by stoney)
    oh fair enough lol. yeah thats a fair point, i mean its like you were being kicked in the teeth for not doing so well at work (like you wouldnt be under enough pressure from your boss without worrying about family life collapsing) we should be able to rely on each other for mutual support perhaps my hasty support of Mata's assertion was under thought.
    Exactly the point I am trying to make. We should support each other and complement each other. It seems very common for these modern women to be first class hypocrites and expect men to do half of their work, yet they don't expect to have to do half of the work men are currently doing.
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    (Original post by Mata)
    Put it this way:

    I will assume that any man I marry will share housework/childcare/salary equally with me. Perhaps we will have a short conversation about it, his failure to agreeing to sharing all aspects of life equally resulting in me leaving him.

    If, once we are married, he stops doing his half of the housework, his half of the childcare or his half of the earning, then there will be serious talks. It is not my job to clean a house that we both live in and take care of children that we both conceived, on my own, just as it is not my job to support us financially on my own. If the husband carries on refusing to do his half of the work, then I wouldn't be able to live with him.

    Its not about feminism, or politics. I'm a human, I want a job, respect, understanding and I want to be with a person who is considerate enough to do half of all the work, because he would be half of our marriage. I just don't feel that its my responsibility to do certain 'female' jobs. He can burp a baby and wield a mop just as well as I can.
    "Do you mind picking up the kids from school today? I know it's my day, but if I don't get this project finished I'll lose my job."

    "No, you signed the contractual obligations. I'm changing the locks."

    I'm absolutely pro-equality, especially in couples, but really. I think most men want a sensible, committed relationship - that is to say sharing in, not distributing, responsibilities.
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    (Original post by zain88)
    If females want to stay at home and bring up the kids and take care of the house then they should, if they don't they definitely shouldn't.
    Some women are brought up in such a way that they are only able to take care of housework and kids, and i think its a shame to let other potential not be explored, but if that is what they are best at and don't think they could do anything else then so be it.

    However, I think there is a part in a lot of males, deep down, which subconsciously expects a woman to be in charge of housework and kids, even if she works more than him. It doesn't mean he won't help out, he'll just leave the overall management to her. He won't automatically take it upon himself as his responsibility to make sure she has enough clean bras in her drawer etc, whereas it is more "normal" for a woman to ensure her family has clean socks. lol. this is a big generalisation but i feel it is common to some extent in a lot of couples.

    Personally, I think if i ever had kids, there is no way i'd be taking maternal leave and my partner wouldn't take paternal leave. I'm quite passionate about equal parenting. If his job earned lots more money than mine did and it really would be a problem for him to leave work then I'd be ok staying at home, MAYBE. But in the equally likely chance that my job (i'm going into medicine, so i'd be a doctor) earned more money and mattered to me more than his job mattered to him then i'd definitely expect him to be ok with taking paternal leave and me carrying on working. However this is all hypothetical and i don't think i'd ever have a kid if we were both not ready to give up our careers. And because i can imagine my career being the centre of my life, it's unlikely i will have children.
    Well just cus you're a doctor doesn't stop you having kids. My friend's parents are both doctors and they are a household of 5.

    I think if a woman have kids, then it's probably best for her to stay home. It's not about being sexist and what-nots - it's just about, generally speaking, women are better with children and are more empathetic and are just generally more intuitive about that kind of thing.

    As for housework, I think it should be shared. However it depends on who's had a more stressful day to see who gets a larger amount of housework to do I think.
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    (Original post by Rainy)
    "Do you mind picking up the kids from school today? I know it's my day, but if I don't get this project finished I'll lose my job."

    "No, you signed the contractual obligations. I'm changing the locks."

    I'm absolutely pro-equality, especially in couples, but really. I think most men want a sensible, committed relationship - that is to say sharing in, not distributing, responsibilities.
    That's not a valid counter-argument. Mata said she would leave her husband if he REFUSED to do things. That isn't refusing, that's negotiating, and is perfectly acceptable.
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    Women staying at home is far better for society. It enables men to be able to fufill the requirements of their job to the best of their ability without having to worry about domestic issues which have traditionally been womens work. It worked in the past it will work now.

    And also there is always hope it can keep womens bloody lib quiet. And that is a good thing
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    (Original post by Rainy)
    "Do you mind picking up the kids from school today? I know it's my day, but if I don't get this project finished I'll lose my job."

    "No, you signed the contractual obligations. I'm changing the locks."

    I'm absolutely pro-equality, especially in couples, but really. I think most men want a sensible, committed relationship - that is to say sharing in, not distributing, responsibilities.
    That would come under the themse of "respect and understanding" which I mentioned in my first post. I expect them, and thus I give them.

    I expect a man to do his share for the marriage; for the children. But I will also do my share. Its a mutual agreement in which we both attempt to make each others' lives easier, and help each other financially, in childcare and in housework. And when I have to work late, he will pick up the kids.
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    Yea
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    (Original post by zain88)
    That's not a valid counter-argument. Mata said she would leave her husband if he REFUSED to do things. That isn't refusing, that's negotiating, and is perfectly acceptable.
    Yes, that too. :p:
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    (Original post by irisng)
    Well just cus you're a doctor doesn't stop you having kids. My friend's parents are both doctors and they are a household of 5.

    I think if a woman have kids, then it's probably best for her to stay home. It's not about being sexist and what-nots - it's just about, generally speaking, women are better with children and are more empathetic and are just generally more intuitive about that kind of thing.

    As for housework, I think it should be shared. However it depends on who's had a more stressful day to see who gets a larger amount of housework to do I think.
    how old are those 5 kids? i seriously doubt both of them were full time doctors when their kids were each newly born. Being 2 doctors makes things so much easier than one doctor though; both can be more understanding about the situation and can work around each other's shift times etc.

    if both were full time doctors when a kid was born then i don't think thats fair on the kids. if i wanted to have kids, it like to bring them up as a full-time job with my partner, and never have to compensate time with them because of my career. for me, it's either or. what's the point in having kids if a babysitter/nanny etc has to look after them half the time?
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    (Original post by Daveinnorfolk)
    Women staying at home is far better for society. It enables men to be able to fufill the requirements of their job to the best of their ability without having to worry about domestic issues which have traditionally been womens work. It worked in the past it will work now.

    And also there is always hope it can keep womens bloody lib quiet. And that is a good thing
    just because it worked doesn't mean both parties were happy about it.

    the fact that men assume that they are the workers is what we are trying to counteract. many women are just as capable workers as men, if not more. and many men are just as capable of doing housework. it's the way that gender roles have been developed over time that makes one gender more adapted to a role. this doesn't mean it can't be "undeveloped" and made to suit both parties.

    what about a women who works, why should she have to worry about domestic issues?

    i'm too tired to argue with you right now, and excuse me for saying this but what you said in your post was bull****.
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    (Original post by mysterious lady)
    Guys, do you think that women should stay at home, cook for you, clean the house, take care of the children etc?
    Definitely, as long as we earn the money and they go out and spend it on shoes.

    (Yes, I'm stereotyped, but I'm gay, women are redundant to me. :p:)

    Those who say women should have equal rights and should do exactly half the housework - fine, if they do half the work to earn money outside the home. In the end it's whatever works in each relationship.
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    (Original post by Mata)
    That would come under the themse of "respect and understanding" which I mentioned in my first post. I expect them, and thus I give them.

    I expect a man to do his share for the marriage; for the children. But I will also do my share. Its a mutual agreement in which we both attempt to make each others' lives easier, and help each other financially, in childcare and in housework. And when I have to work late, he will pick up the kids.
    Maybe I read wrongly, but "If, once we are married, he stops doing his half of the housework, his half of the childcare or his half of the earning, then there will be serious talks" gives me the shakes. If a man is unwilling to do any of the above, then he's clearly in the wrong. As would a woman. Your post just smacked of expectancy and absence of compromise, that's all. Yes, actually, I think I would want there to be more than merely "respect and understanding". Maybe I'm a romantic, but I'd rather a loving relationship where support is key, than a "mutual agreement"; I'm sure you would too.
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    (Original post by Mata)
    To reiterate: I'm not quibbling over how much we earn, I'm arguing that the way we use what we earn should be fair, and in the interests of a good marriage. A man who earns less/is awful at washing up/can't really change a nappy isn't a bad husband. A man who deliberately keeps much-needed money from the family, refuses to do any household jobs and does not participate in childcare is a bad husband. Just as a woman who does those things is a bad wife.
    Fair enough and I now agree with what you are saying. As long as you understand that men do put a lot into marraiges financially and otherwise. From your first post I got the impression that you thought that all men are currently lazy people who who want to shirk all their responsibilities. As long as you understand that women have to start contributing as well and start doing half of those traditional 'manly' jobs then I completely agree with you. Although I don't see why men and women can't support and complement each other, rather than having to do 50% of everything equally.

    (Original post by Mata)
    My original post may have been unclear; for that I am sorry.
    No need to apologise.
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    (Original post by zain88)
    how old are those 5 kids? i seriously doubt both of them were full time doctors when their kids were each newly born. Being 2 doctors makes things so much easier than one doctor though; both can be more understanding about the situation and can work around each other's shift times etc.

    if both were full time doctors when a kid was born then i don't think thats fair on the kids. if i wanted to have kids, it like to bring them up as a full-time job with my partner, and never have to compensate time with them because of my career. for me, it's either or. what's the point in having kids if a babysitter/nanny etc has to look after them half the time?
    Sorry, by household, I mean the family - so by 5 I included the parents in there. So 3 children. They're 13, 14 and 18. Not sure if they were full-time doctors while they were still newborns, but I do know my friend had a nanny, yeh.

    Although yeh, I agree - if you have kids, you should definitely sacrifice for them including your career. Yeh, it's best not to have children if you can't give up your job.
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    Females need to stay at home and make me some God damn pie.
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    (Original post by Rainy)
    Maybe I read wrongly, but "If, once we are married, he stops doing his half of the housework, his half of the childcare or his half of the earning, then there will be serious talks" gives me the shakes. If a man is unwilling to do any of the above, then he's clearly in the wrong. As would a woman. Your post just smacked of expectancy and absence of compromise, that's all. Yes, actually, I think I would want there to be more than merely "respect and understanding". Maybe I'm a romantic, but I'd rather a loving relationship where support is key, than a "mutual agreement"; I'm sure you would too.
    Hmm.

    I think that I have the right (as does everyone) to expect certain things from a relationship - I would make it clear to my husband that I would expect him to attempt to go halves with me in terms of the amount of childcare and housework we did, and to contribute half-half towards purchases that benefitted us both. In return, I would do exactly the same. I would work hard to make life easy for him, and to be accepting and understanding when he had a problem. I wouldn't marry someone without being massively in love with them, and hopefully in a modern, loving relationship, the things I mentioned above (sharing housework, childcare and finances) would come naturally.

    However, in the event of the husband not fulfilling what I consider to be his marital responsibilities, I wouldn't sit idly by and let myself do things which I felt degraded me and the integrity and trust in our marriage. I'm not talking about me doing the dishes more often or petty things like that; I'm talking about a husband who believes that it is my job as the 'female' to do household chores.

    I'm totally willing to discuss things, to accept that the husband might have a problem or a worry. But... when it comes to mutual respect and belief that your other half is your equal, I won't compromise. I come from a divorce in which my father didn't contribute half/half in terms of finance, childcare or homemaking and I know the toll it has on both the mother and the children.
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    (Original post by Amnesia)
    Fair enough and I now agree with what you are saying. As long as you understand that men do put a lot into marraiges financially and otherwise. From your first post I got the impression that you thought that all men are currently lazy people who who want to shirk all their responsibilities. As long as you understand that women have to start contributing as well and start doing half of those traditional 'manly' jobs then I completely agree with you. Although I don't see why men and women can't support and complement each other, rather than having to do 50% of everything equally.


    No need to apologise.
    I don't think all men are lazy people :p:

    As I said, I would assume that any man I marry would automatically want to go halves in terms of things to do with our lifestyle. Its only if he suddenly turns around and refuses that the problem arises.

    I am so adamant that a man contributes, because I have been raised to contribute to everything that I possibly can, regardless of my perceived 'cultural gender', and I am shocked that a man wouldn't do the same. I assure you that I believe in changing tyres and fixing shelves.

    When I say doing 50% of things equally, I don't mean that we divide every single chore and make sure that we take turns. If he's really good at ironing (please God) and I'm good at the dishes, then those can be our little jobs. So long as, in the end, one of us is not doing a grossly large amount of work compared to the other.

    I swear to God I'm not a man-hating feminist.
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    (Original post by Mata)
    I don't think all men are lazy people :p:

    As I said, I would assume that any man I marry would automatically want to go halves in terms of things to do with our lifestyle. Its only if he suddenly turns around and refuses that the problem arises.

    I am so adamant that a man contributes, because I have been raised to contribute to everything that I possibly can, regardless of my perceived 'cultural gender', and I am shocked that a man wouldn't do the same. I assure you that I believe in changing tyres and fixing shelves.

    When I say doing 50% of things equally, I don't mean that we divide every single chore and make sure that we take turns. If he's really good at ironing (please God) and I'm good at the dishes, then those can be our little jobs. So long as, in the end, one of us is not doing a grossly large amount of work compared to the other.

    I swear to God I'm not a man-hating feminist.

    i agree wholeheartedly with every word you have said. you spoke my mind again! only i'm not so good at putting it into words...
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    (Original post by halfoflessthan50p)
    why do people see looking after kids as a bad thing and working as a good thing? Id wanna spend as much time with my kids as i could, its not a chore.

    I guess it would be hard at times but its gonna be more rewarding in the end than a job. Theres so many 'new-age fathers' these days. I think mens attitude to parenting is changing
    I agree with you, I see women playing with kids around noon on a weekday in the park and i just think , oh crap i bet I won't be able to do any of that with my kids, I'll be stuck at work.
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    Definately yes, hands down women were made to cook, clean and make babies only....
 
 
 
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