Musings on the macho culture: a justified attack or not? Watch

Riku
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http://www.upworthy.com/theres-somet...into-men?c=gt1

Hey

I posted a thread about a similar issue last year in H+R I think, but it might have been archived by now, so here's an update.

What are your thoughts on the 'macho' culture still present in society? I asked on another thread 'why are men shamed by their peers for expressing emotions or their inner self?' The replies were basically 'women are more emotional, we're not, it's wrong for men to be emotional'.

I really related to this video on George Takei's page while scrolling my Facebook today-not because my dad was a poor role model but because I lacked him most days in my life for years following my parents' divorce, and because I've ended up with a lot of confusing messages from the media about who I'm 'supposed' to be to fit in.
Funnily enough it's Mental Health Awareness week, and a statistic cited on the video claimed 50% of young males don't seek help for mental health difficulties, or generally emotional difficulties, and some not even physical difficulties, some then going on to develop more severe problems, some committing suicide. Others feel a need 'toughen up' and end up joining gangs to prove their distorted conception of what it means to 'be a man'.


I found a few people criticised this video for a number of reasons, some reasonable, some less so:

1. This is a movement localised in the USA, but it's a phenomenon occurring worldwide. I'd say that there are some elements present in the UK where I'm from.

2. The video did take extreme examples and the father figures were generally deliberately chosen douche-bags, apart from that one lovely man who vowed to nurture his son to accept his sensitive side.

3. The architect of this movement is Miss Representation, a feminist-and apparently feminists shouldn't tackle male issues because they're not men and don't understand us? (lol BS imo, but feel free to argue otherwise)

4. The most frustrating reply from men-this is all part of the continuing 'pussification' of men. They believed videos like these would slowly emasculate men and force them to be someone who they're naturally not, and before you know it we'd all be 40-year old virgins crying to our mum every night.
Personally I feel the last replies were symptomatic of the very problem that the documentary itself seeks to tackle-that not only is expressing emotion a feminine trait, but feminine traits are a sign of weakness.
I did however notice that these repliers were also the most right-wing, homophobic and close-minded in general.

I don't feel that men should be forced to prove they have feelings and express them outwardly, that would be reverse discrimination from the extreme consequences of the video. Some guys do like sports, and a bit of 'rough and tumble' (has anyone used that phrase in the last half century? :P). Nothing wrong with that, being a guy isn't a bad thing.
But if one is feeling forced to suppress that side to conform to the expectations of their peer group and their perceived expectations of society, if they feel they will be losing part of their 'manhood' (and thus self-respect and respect from others) if they show that side; then it's a problem.


I'm coming to the conclusion that to 'be a man' should be more about taking responsibility for your actions and seeking to do the right thing for those you love and society, even if it's the hard thing and comes at a cost to yourself, than it should be about 'sucking up' emotion.

Although I would also say that surely that's just a sign of being a reasonable, mature adult than anything? Why's responsibility inherently a masculine attribute?

How do you respond to this video and the issues it raises?
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Bill_Gates
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57% you will need to develop a setting before you start the essay. Do you want the 2:1 or not?
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Moosferatu
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Men need women, and women need men. We like to bang each other. The end.

And of course, if your sexuality isn't fixed on the "hetero" area, then amend the above statement as you please.
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Kiss
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What's wrong with telling someone to stop being a pussy? If they're whining over the most frivolous little thing they WILL grow up to be an attention seeking crybaby.

And the link between 'manning up' and spree shooters is preposterous. But then, I'm not so surprised since it was from the people who did the 'Missrepresentation' bull****.
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Riku
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(Original post by Bill_Gates)
57% you will need to develop a setting before you start the essay. Do you want the 2:1 or not?
What? This isn't for an essay, this is general discussion.

(Original post by Moosferatu)
Men need women, and women need men. We like to bang each other. The end.

And of course, if your sexuality isn't fixed on the "hetero" area, then amend the above statement as you please.
The whole point of the video is to suggest
a)
b) Aforementioned men are gay/in the closet

How is hat right?




(Original post by Kiss)
What's wrong with telling someone to stop being a pussy? If they're whining over the most frivolous little thing they WILL grow up to be an attention seeking crybaby.

And the link between 'manning up' and spree shooters is preposterous. But then, I'm not so surprised since it was from the people who did the 'Missrepresentation' bull****.
I take your point but we're talking about 10-year old boys here mostly. I think you can give them some leeway.
I don't think the video's encouraging boys to cry about getting a paper cut as an adult or have homework to do, which would lead to attention-seeking crybabies. I think it's about them not being able to express any deep feelings in public, even in friendship groups, for fear of shame. So boys not going on to do their dream occupation if it's too 'artsy' for example. In fact the video implied they were being condemned by peers for being interested in their education at all as 'nerdy' 'uncool' and (strange logic for the last one) 'girly'.

The link for the spree shooters is a spurious extreme, however I can see a link between the macho culture of silence and gang violence.
In any case being taught that it's better to conceal difficult emotions than acknowledge them and response appropriately will likely cause problems in later life.
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Kiss
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(Original post by Riku)
I take your point but we're talking about 10-year old boys here mostly. I think you can give them some leeway.
I don't think the video's encouraging boys to cry about getting a paper cut as an adult or have homework to do, which would lead to attention-seeking crybabies. I think it's about them not being able to express any deep feelings in public, even in friendship groups, for fear of shame. So boys not going on to do their dream occupation if it's too 'artsy' for example. In fact the video implied they were being condemned by peers for being interested in their education at all as 'nerdy' 'uncool' and (strange logic for the last one) 'girly'.

The link for the spree shooters is a spurious extreme, however I can see a link between the macho culture of silence and gang violence.
In any case being taught that it's better to conceal difficult emotions than acknowledge them and response appropriately will likely cause problems in later life.
That happens for any state school, it doesn't matter about gender - anyone who is seen to be above the average is deemed a geek by their peers, it has nothing to do with masculinity.

I can see why they're trying to encourage a more open dialogue with men and discussing their feelings, but to apply that to every aspect of life is damaging and a hindrance: you wouldn't have someone discuss their life problems right before PE or a school sports competition/game against an opposing school, would you? The modern feminist attempt to reprogram masculinity is pathetic.
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