should the man be the head of the house? Watch

Poll: should the man be the head of the house?
yes (52)
36.62%
no (90)
63.38%
DK_Tipp
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#41
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#41
(Original post by The_Dragonborn)
I can see where you're coming from here but I think some people on TSR would view this as adhering to gender roles and therefore misogynistic.

IMO, setting roles and responsiblilties in a household is a good thing, whether or not they are traditional "gender roles" e.g. man = breadwinner, woman = homemaker. It means that there is a system in place to ensure that everyone contributes, which sounds like equality to me.
The woman is not just "the homemaker" in this case, she's responsible for managing the family finances. In how many car insurance adds is the woman portrayed as head of the household talking about what a great deal AVIVA gave her? I don't think women are traditionally given this responsibility.

In some sense it does conform to gender roles but with a much more expansive, influential role for the matriarch and a lot less pressure on the man of the house.
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The_Dragonborn
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#42
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#42
(Original post by Chlorophile)
Oh, and the alternative is better? You want to go back to an age where women were the property of their husbands and had no control over their lives? Where arranged marriage were the norm? Where wife-battering and marital-rape were legal? When all marriage was done by the Church and the Church alone? Where love was defined by old men in the Vatican or the Church of England?
This is not necessarily true. Back then, there were traditional gender roles in place. Although by modern standards it sounds oppressive, it was a system, at the time, that seemed logical and that worked. I know many women of older generations who do agree with the traditional roles because it ensured that each person in the household contributed in his/her own way, which sounds like equality to me.
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yo radical one
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#43
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#43
Nah

My father is an incompetent moron and I want my future wife to oppress me :sexface:
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lucaf
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#44
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#44
I don't see any reason why they should
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Red one
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#45
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#45
(Original post by The_Dragonborn)
Would rep but I'm out, sorry!
I'll rep you instead!





(Original post by Chlorophile)
Oh, and the alternative is better? You want to go back to an age where women were the property of their husbands and had no control over their lives? Where arranged marriage were the norm? Where wife-battering and marital-rape were legal? When all marriage was done by the Church and the Church alone? Where love was defined by old men in the Vatican or the Church of England?

You asked me to give you one observable example of the negative impact of tradition removal and I gave you three. :rolleyes: I do not support abusive relationships or misogyny quite the opposite. I only recognise that men and women have different roles and responsibilities in a give relationship.



(Original post by Ronove)
It's only 'quaint' when you're not the one having important decisions made for you by someone else. Moving country affects the woman. Buying a house affects the woman. Choosing the school the children go to does not affect the man. If the woman is cooking, choosing what to eat for dinner does not affect the man (he can just find something else if he doesn't like what was cooked, before you try to suggest it does affect him).


OK, so if the woman is the main breadwinner, you're saying she can make decisions on buying a new house and car and moving countries for jobs and so on?
If a woman is the main breadwinner she should have more decision-making than say a fulltime housewive. I have never experienced or observed relationships where the woman had a better pay out though.
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The_Dragonborn
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#46
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#46
(Original post by DK_Tipp)
The woman is not just "the homemaker" in this case, she's responsible for managing the family finances. In how many car insurance adds is the woman portrayed as head of the household talking about what a great deal AVIVA gave her? I don't think women are traditionally given this responsibility.

In some sense it does conform to gender roles but with a much more expansive, influential role for the matriarch and a lot less pressure on the man of the house.
Lol I wasn't necessarily saying that the woman is the homemaker (I was just arguing a point), but yes I understand your point.
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Chlorophile
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#47
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#47
(Original post by The_Dragonborn)
This is not necessarily true. Back then, there were traditional gender roles in place. Although by modern standards it sounds oppressive, it was a system, at the time, that seemed logical and that worked. I know many women of older generations who do agree with the traditional roles because it ensured that each person in the household contributed in his/her own way, which sounds like equality to me.
It sounds oppressive because it is oppressive. Just because people were indoctrinated into accepting a system doesn't mean that system is right! Most North Koreans believe that their political system is the greatest thing on the planet, yet it very blatantly isn't.


(Original post by Red one)
You asked me to give you one observable example of the negative impact of tradition removal and I gave you three. :rolleyes: I do not support abusive relationships or misogyny quite the opposite. I only recognise that men and women have different roles and responsibilities in a give relationship.
You didn't give me a negative impact of tradition removal, you gave me three ways how removing tradition has turned an absolutely horrific situation into a mildly problematic situation. I should also add that I don't agree that the increasing divorce rate isn't necessarily bad.
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username207685
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#48
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#48
(Original post by Red one)
Increase in underage pregnancies, single mothers and divorce rate since 50 years ago. All of these are by-products of the progressive society you seem to be shoving down my throat.
So you think we should adhere to the gender roles of 70+ years ago and have women subservient to men, as was tradition?

Ok.

You're a woman and should stop trying to contribute to an intellectual conversation. You lack the cognitive capacity and reasoning skills to hold an informed opinion or make a persuasive argument. You are embarrassing yourself, and more importantly, you are embarrassing your husband (if such a man exists with the necessary patience to withstand your hysteria and disobedience). Also, you're no longer allowed to vote.
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theoferdinand
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#49
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#49
depends on your culture tbh or how much of a man the man is . me personally i will always be head of my household and my wife will have to answer to me
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Ronove
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#50
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#50
(Original post by Red one)
I'll rep you instead!








You asked me to give you one observable example of the negative impact of tradition removal and I gave you three. :rolleyes: I do not support abusive relationships or misogyny quite the opposite. I only recognise that men and women have different roles and responsibilities in a give relationship.





If a woman is the main breadwinner she should have more decision-making than say a fulltime housewive. I have never experienced or observed relationships where the woman had a better pay out though.
You quite tellingly don't say that the woman, as main breadwinner, should have the same say in decision-making as the man would in a relationship where he is the main breadwinner.

Your views have nothing to do with roles in a relationship, but sex/gender. Your views are pure, unadulterated sexism.

And if you know of no couples where the woman earns more, it would appear you don't mix with the real world very much.
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The_Dragonborn
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#51
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#51
(Original post by Chlorophile)
It sounds oppressive because it is oppressive.
I would disagree. If anything, women were treated with far more respect back then than they are now - were there songs about "getting *****es" or "pulling tens" back in the 1950s for example? No, and yet now, when we are supposed to have "equality" women are objectified.

While I don't necessarily support gender roles, I do believe that each person in a household should have a role - it ensures that everyone contributes equally, and everyone shares in the household. Sounds like equality to me.
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corax
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#52
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#52
No, what century are we living in again?
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Red one
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#53
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#53
(Original post by Chlorophile)
You didn't give me a negative impact of tradition removal, you gave me three ways how removing tradition has turned an absolutely horrific situation into a mildly problematic situation. I should also add that I don't agree that the increasing divorce rate isn't necessarily bad.

Do you know that the UK has the highest underage pregnancy rate in all of western Europe? If you believe this is a mildly problematic situation, I urge you to try and check some teenage pregnancy forums or speak to a pregnant teen. About a third of underage pregnancies end in abortion, do you think that's okay?
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thecrediblehulk
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#54
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#54
(Original post by Red one)
I have never experienced or observed relationships where the woman had a better pay out though.
can you imagine a lioness choosing a maneless lion who is smaller than her.......awkawrrrrrrd!!
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Chlorophile
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#55
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#55
(Original post by The_Dragonborn)
I would disagree. If anything, women were treated with far more respect back then than they are now - were there songs about "getting *****es" or "pulling tens" back in the 1950s for example? No, and yet now, when we are supposed to have "equality" women are objectified.

While I don't necessarily support gender roles, I do believe that each person in a household should have a role - it ensures that everyone contributes equally, and everyone shares in the household. Sounds like equality to me.
"Women were treated with far more respect back then..."

I don't even know how to respond to this. You've made me speechless, good job.
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IBAlex
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#56
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#56
Ah, the well educated students of the future. Doesn't the future look bright?
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Chlorophile
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#57
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#57
(Original post by Red one)
Do you know that the UK has the highest underage pregnancy rate in all of western Europe? If you believe this is a mildly problematic situation, I urge you to try and check some teenage pregnancy forums or speak to an pregnant teen. About a third of underage pregnancies end in abortion, do you think that's okay?
This is the fault of a lack of education, not progression.
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thecrediblehulk
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#58
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#58
ok i see the yes % is slightly going up. come on western guys , you can do it! having balls is not a crime, you don't need to feel guilty about it. you're not a monster because you didn't cry while watching the notebook with your gf.
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ilem
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#59
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#59
(Original post by thecrediblehulk)
can you imagine a lioness choosing a maneless lion who is smaller than her.......awkawrrrrrrd!!
Good thing we aren't lions then.

Tradition is bad precisely because it can lead to some people considering themselves as inferior to others, as evidenced in this thread where quite a few people, both male and female, are still taking it for granted that men are somehow more capable of decision making.
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Red one
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#60
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#60
(Original post by Chlorophile)
This is the fault of a lack of education, not progression.

They lack the necessary education because they got pregnant too young as your modern society touts that losing your virginity at 14 is the norm.
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