Is Physics REALLY impossible?

Hey.

I know someone who's really interested in studying Physics at university. However, the only thing that's putting him off taking it to degree level is that he might find it too difficult, and even though he's really interested in it, he doesn't want to go to university and then drop out. So, it comes to me to ask those on TSR:

Are Physics degrees as difficult as people make them out to be? What's the most difficult bit you encounter when studying Physics? How hard is it to get a 2.1 or 1st in Physics, and how hard do you have to work/gifted do you have to be to achieve this?

Thanks a lot.

(edited 8 years ago)

Reply 1

harr

15

If he's interested in physics and good at it he'll do better at it than any other degree (at the same standard of university). The only thing to note is the importance of maths. You can study physics at Cambridge (just as an example) without physics A level (either through maths then transfering to physics or through natsci, which needs further maths with mechanics modules to study the physics course), but you can't study physics without maths. To get into a top uni he should be looking at an A in A level maths and preferably further maths as well (along with an A in physics).

Reply 2

fonzievision

14

harr

If he's interested in physics and good at it he'll do better at it than any other degree (at the same standard of university). The only thing to note is the importance of maths. You can study physics at Cambridge (just as an example) without physics A level (either through maths then transfering to physics or through natsci, which needs further maths with mechanics modules to study the physics course), but you can't study physics without maths. To get into a top uni he should be looking at an A in A level maths and preferably further maths as well.

Most universities WILL ask for physics A level. To get into a top uni A in both maths and physics will be needed, but further maths is a mere bonus.

Reply 3

ChemistBoy

16

Physics has encouraged the perception that it is incredibly difficult, it is, in fact, no more difficult that any other area of study, but you need to have a certain skill set to be successful. Maths is very important (but your friend has that covered) as physics is all about mathematical descriptions of physical phenomena.

If he is genuinely interested in physics then that is what he should do as he is likely to be more successful than if he studied another area. The world needs more physicists too.

Reply 4

harr

15

fonzievision

Most universities WILL ask for physics A level. To get into a top uni A in both maths and physics will be needed, but further maths is a mere bonus.

I was just emphasing the importance of maths. I was saying that maths A level is almost as important, if not just as important, as the physics A level. I said that to get into any top university you will need an A in maths and preferably in further maths. I thought it was obvious that I meant you would need an A in physics as well (I've changed it to mention that I meant that now). Outside of the top couple you could probably get in with a B in maths as long as you had an A in physics, though you'd really want an A.

He's doing Maths, Further Maths, Physics and Economics for A level. Economics being taken as a broadening subject...

The subjects that he's chosen look perfect to me. I'd have thought that anyone who can get an A in physics and do further maths should do fine at university.

Reply 5

material breach

12

ChemistBoy

Physics has encouraged the perception that it is incredibly difficult

You think so?

Reply 6

ChemistBoy

16

material breach

You think so?

Yes for sure, it's only recently that things have changed. I went to an Institute of Physics (of which I am a member) lecture on recruitment to undergraduate courses - one of the things that was brought up was this very fact. A significant minority of students where put off physics degree because of the perception that the subject was too difficult, the speaker, an executive of the IoP, was critical of the academic response to this which was either indifferent or encouraging of the fact despite the subject being in crisis. However, I don't think that is the main reason why physics is so unpopular.

Reply 7

fonzievision

14

Sentooran

I thought that that was the bare minimum? As in: without an A in Physics and Further Maths, degree level would be impossible. Or that's what my teacher says anyway...

Well, your teacher is wrong then. I know a few people studying Physics. Only one had Further Maths.. and he's not the one doing best of them all.

Reply 8

harr

15

Sentooran

I thought that that was the bare minimum? As in: without an A in Physics and Further Maths, degree level would be impossible. Or that's what my teacher says anyway...

You say that he's bright and that he's interested. These are the two most important things. 100% in all physics modules and 3 A levels worth of maths may be useful both for getting accepted and once he is on the course, but are not required. Universities aren't going to accept people who they expect to do badly and yet many good ones set AAB or ABB offers and don't ask for further maths.

Reply 9

Kolya

17

Sentooran

What do you think is? And why is it that Physics is considered hard? What is it actually like?

Your line of questioning does not make sense. It is similar to saying, 'How hard is English?' Almost everybody can write a story of a sort but you require practice, patience and hard work in order to be able to write a gripping novel...

I believe one reason why it is considered hard is because it has a large amount of Mathematics in it and the public tend to have a Maths-phobia but this is really just dodging the question!

Reply 10

ChemistBoy

16

Sentooran

What do you think is? And why is it that Physics is considered hard? What is it actually like?

Well if you look at numbers they haven't fallen that much, however the total number of students in the UK has risen sharply which to some is indicative of a "real" loss in percentage terms. Physics is seen as difficult because we are exposed to images of genii and supposed genii from the subject (Einstein and Hawking for example) and one assumes that to have any impact in the subject one has to be at that level and that that level is very high indeed. The other sciences do not have such role models in the public eye. Of course, as a chemist, my experience is of physicists, not physics courses - physicists are very good at what they are good at, but they are just as bad as everyone else at crossing the discipline gap - physics does not somehow unlock the whole world of science for you and physicists struggle just as badly with chemical concepts as chemists with physical concepts, neither is more difficult that the other.

Also, couldn't this speaker be ever so slightly biased? Because if he's from the Institute of Physics, he'll want more people to study Physics... so he'll say that the subject isn't as difficult as it is to encourage more people to take it.

Well, this lecture was to academics and those already studying physics (or other members like me), so I don't think it was a recruitment drive as such. He was discussing the problems facing the subject and proposals to deal with them.

Reply 11

material breach

12

ChemistBoy

Yes for sure, it's only recently that things have changed. I went to an Institute of Physics (of which I am a member) lecture on recruitment to undergraduate courses - one of the things that was brought up was this very fact. A significant minority of students where put off physics degree because of the perception that the subject was too difficult, the speaker, an executive of the IoP, was critical of the academic response to this which was either indifferent or encouraging of the fact despite the subject being in crisis. However, I don't think that is the main reason why physics is so unpopular.

I realise, however I was more interested by you saying that you thought it was an image that physicists have promoted.

The newsletters from the IOP have had large range of ideas expressed in them about whether the percieved decline in the number of physicists is due to bad recruitment and poor teaching which fails to convey an euthanism for the subject or whether its because physics is actually very hard and a subject for the elite.

The idea of it being only for the able subject though I think is view that the rest of society is as much as fault for as physicsits. Clearly the range of views in the IOP newsletters show that there a lot of physicsists who aren't promoting it as an elite subject.

Reply 12

jpowell

15

If Physics was impossible then there wouldn't be any physicists. There are physicists. Therefore Physics is not impossible.

Reply 13

dazmanultra

1

Studying physics at university requires a good work ethic... keeping up with homeworks and reading and going through notes and practice questions outside of lectures is a good idea. Otherwise, whilst you can sit in lectures nodding your head, thinking you understand everything, you can get to revise for exams (or even to the exam itself) and find you really know nothing.

With such a subject, there's no middle ground... you either know what to do for the question or you don't, and often if you don't, you're in no man's land. Unlike English, or Law where you might be able to have a shot at the answer.

Reply 14

shiny

12

ChemistBoy

Physics is seen as difficult because we are exposed to images of genii and supposed genii from the subject (Einstein and Hawking for example) and one assumes that to have any impact in the subject one has to be at that level and that that level is very high indeed.

I think it manifests itself in what people write in their UCAS personal statements. So many applicants talk about quantum gravity or astrophysics and how they have read Brian Greene, the Brief History of Time etc. Nothing wrong with that, but it seems strange that in a subject which covers so many different things, so many people end up talking about the same few topics.

Reply 15

Ana

19

It's not that bad, especially not in first year, I did very little work this year (despite plenty of good intentions :redface:

), and am averaging a 2:1. I'd emphasis what everyone has said, your friend sounds like he has just as good a chance of doing well as most physics students do :smile:

I'd say the important thing is interest and willingness to learn, intelligence is less important.

Reply 16

Zafda

8

well.
i dunno what its like at uni but im sure its not impossible if he found it alright at A Level and GCSE

Reply 17

The_Kangaroo

1

I am genuinly interested in Physics and Mathematics, so I found them fairly easy - but Chemistry I found near enough impossible! And my partner, I am sure, will tell you that I suck at nearly everything outside physics and maths.

I can do what I can do, but anything else is a challenge.