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Gerry Adams arrested! Breaking News!

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Original post by yo radical one
I don't know much about the details of the conflict personally and I have no family is Northern Ireland (as far as I am aware :erm:) but honestly I've noticed the opposite. People (particularly those on the left) present the IRA as the underdog oppressed by the evil British Imperialists and the Unionists as far-right neo-fascists.


I very rarely hear that attitude - I just prefer to remind everyone that the UVF were at least as bad as the IRA, and bits of them too are still active.

The British were welcomed by many, but they chose to focus in on the IRA, instead of equally target loyalists. That and the facts a lot of British-NI records were destroyed is I think why they are seen with SUCH content.
Original post by yo radical one
I don't know much about the details of the conflict personally and I have no family is Northern Ireland (as far as I am aware :erm:) but honestly I've noticed the opposite. People (particularly those on the left) present the IRA as the underdog oppressed by the evil British Imperialists and the Unionists as far-right neo-fascists.


Its not about the IRA or any armed group, its much deeper than that, its that catholics in Northern Ireland were heavily heavily discrimated against for many years in terms of housing, jobs etc.

The violent response from the IRA was utterly shameful and wrong so I have no sympathy for what happens to Gerry Adams or any of his colleagues, they must face the repercussions of their past.

But a lot of British people in the mainland are deeply deeply ignorant of the atmosphere that was present in Northern Ireland against the catholic community at that time, that built hatred up towards the British establishment, then when incidents like Ballymurphy and Bloody Sunday occured, those who wanted a violent response (e.g. the PIRA) must have thought it was christmas as the powers of recruitment that gave them sadly were huge.
[video="youtube;gOJbDXg9Uwc"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gOJbDXg9Uwc[/video]

Thought this was worth posting. It might explain to some people why people in the Nationalist community in Northern Ireland are angry and why Sinn Fein are crying foul.

DISCLAIMER: I am not a Sinn Fein supporter nor do I endorse their claim that this arrest is politically motivated. However I think it's important to place things in context. Very often posters not familiar with the North end up scratching their heads or just getting out right angry because "Republicans" appear to be comfortable with terrorism. The reality is far more complex.
Original post by DK_Tipp
[video="youtube;gOJbDXg9Uwc"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gOJbDXg9Uwc[/video]

Thought this was worth posting. It might explain to some people why people in the Nationalist community in Northern Ireland are angry and why Sinn Fein are crying foul.

DISCLAIMER: I am not a Sinn Fein supporter nor do I endorse their claim that this arrest is politically motivated. However I think it's important to place things in context. Very often posters not familiar with the North end up scratching their heads or just getting out right angry because "Republicans" appear to be comfortable with terrorism. The reality is far more complex.


Excellent post
Original post by yo radical one
People (particularly those on the left) present the IRA as the underdog oppressed by the evil British Imperialists and the Unionists as far-right neo-fascists.

That backs-up the fact Labour and the Guardian are institutions which have always gone out of their way to destroy anything "British".

Funny how the pro-republican Social Democratic and Labour party takes its whip from..... the British Labour party.
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by billydisco
That backs-up the fact Labour and the Guardian are institutions which have always gone out of their way to destroy anything "British".

Funny how the pro-republican Social Democratic and Labour party takes its whip from..... the British Labour party.


The SDLP is a self identified social democratic party and associates with other social democratic/centre left parties and political blocks including the Irish Labour Party, the British Labour Party and the Party of European Socialists in the European Parliament.

So what exactly is your point? Apart from your already documented hatred of anything liberal or left centre...
Original post by DK_Tipp
The SDLP is a self identified social democratic party and associates with other social democratic/centre left parties and political blocks including the Irish Labour Party, the British Labour Party and the Party of European Socialists in the European Parliament.

So what exactly is your point? Apart from your already documented hatred of anything liberal or left centre...

That it would have to be a left-wing part who are pro-republican.

Labour destroyed the UK on purpose- some lefties HATE their own country.
Original post by billydisco
That it would have to be a left-wing part who are pro-republican.

Labour destroyed the UK on purpose- some lefties HATE their own country.


You do know that John Hume (Former SDLP leader) was a huge advocate for peace and won the Nobel Peace Prize for it - right?
Original post by That Bearded Man
Excellent post


Up to a point. He's relying on the usual allegation that the non-arrest of British paras is evidence of a highly distorted system. The issues surrounding what British soldiers did have generally been regarded in past negotiations as separate to the question of past terrorism crimes within NI.

It will be interesting to see what happens now he's been released without charge. I can't see the CPS doing anything with it. The allegation that Adams was being questioned for 17 hours a day and therefore essentially sleep-deprived, if true, is bound to stir things up. Most people assumed that undue duress in prisoner interrogations was a thing of the past in Northern Ireland. :rolleyes:
Original post by That Bearded Man
You do know that John Hume (Former SDLP leader) was a huge advocate for peace and won the Nobel Peace Prize for it - right?

How does being an advocate of peace contradict me saying lefties are generally against anything British?
Original post by That Bearded Man
I very rarely hear that attitude - I just prefer to remind everyone that the UVF were at least as bad as the IRA, and bits of them too are still active.

The British were welcomed by many, but they chose to focus in on the IRA, instead of equally target loyalists. That and the facts a lot of British-NI records were destroyed is I think why they are seen with SUCH content.

Eeerrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr. The Loyalists were not murdering soldiers and policemen. Why would the Army have targeted them ?
Original post by Fullofsurprises
Up to a point. He's relying on the usual allegation that the non-arrest of British paras is evidence of a highly distorted system. The issues surrounding what British soldiers did have generally been regarded in past negotiations as separate to the question of past terrorism crimes within NI.

It will be interesting to see what happens now he's been released without charge. I can't see the CPS doing anything with it. The allegation that Adams was being questioned for 17 hours a day and therefore essentially sleep-deprived, if true, is bound to stir things up. Most people assumed that undue duress in prisoner interrogations was a thing of the past in Northern Ireland. :rolleyes:

I bet Adams did not suffer the three days of terror and brutal torture that Mrs McConville suffered.
Original post by Old_Simon
Eeerrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr. The Loyalists were not murdering soldiers and policemen. Why would the Army have targeted them ?


Because they were murdering civilians?
Original post by Old_Simon
I bet Adams did not suffer the three days of terror and brutal torture that Mrs McConville suffered.


Of course! If he's guilty, he should pay for his crimes. However, I was talking about the issue of torture and duress being used in interrogations - one of the key things agreed in the peace agreement was that methods of that sort being used by the authorities would end. It doesn't sound very good that the PSNI have (apparently) been subjecting him to sleep deprivation, regardless of the crime.
Original post by Old_Simon
Eeerrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr. The Loyalists were not murdering soldiers and policemen. Why would the Army have targeted them ?



Original post by anarchism101
Because they were murdering civilians?


The civilians (UK citizens) they were deployed to protect in the first place.
Original post by Fullofsurprises
Up to a point. He's relying on the usual allegation that the non-arrest of British paras is evidence of a highly distorted system. The issues surrounding what British soldiers did have generally been regarded in past negotiations as separate to the question of past terrorism crimes within NI.

It will be interesting to see what happens now he's been released without charge. I can't see the CPS doing anything with it. The allegation that Adams was being questioned for 17 hours a day and therefore essentially sleep-deprived, if true, is bound to stir things up. Most people assumed that undue duress in prisoner interrogations was a thing of the past in Northern Ireland. :rolleyes:


Dunno where this has come from but I bet it's nonsense. Gerry Kelly (SF MLA) visited Adams in custody and said "he looked well and was being well treated".
Original post by DK_Tipp
Dunno where this has come from but I bet it's nonsense. Gerry Kelly (SF MLA) visited Adams in custody and said "he looked well and was being well treated".


"A source close to him", according to the media.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-27272797

The claim should be answered one way or another. If it's true, it's very disturbing. If it's a Sinn Fein falsehood, that should be exposed as well.
Original post by Fullofsurprises
"A source close to him", according to the media.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-27272797

The claim should be answered one way or another. If it's true, it's very disturbing. If it's a Sinn Fein falsehood, that should be exposed as well.


Maybe he was. But Adams himself described his treatment by the PSNI as "ok" so I don't think this strand of the story will go any further.
Original post by Fullofsurprises
Of course! If he's guilty, he should pay for his crimes. However, I was talking about the issue of torture and duress being used in interrogations - one of the key things agreed in the peace agreement was that methods of that sort being used by the authorities would end. It doesn't sound very good that the PSNI have (apparently) been subjecting him to sleep deprivation, regardless of the crime.

There is no mention of Police interview techniques in the "Peace Agreement" at all far less it being a "key" thing. It is not and never was.
Original post by Old_Simon
There is no mention of Police interview techniques in the "Peace Agreement" at all far less it being a "key" thing. It is not and never was.


Sorry, I meant the 'peace process', not the document itself. There was a general decision to modernise policing and stop any brutality in the justice system.

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