This discussion is closed.
Amazing
Badges: 0
Rep:
?
#81
Report 15 years ago
#81
(Original post by randdom)
It actually just made me pitty the woman who went though the abortion more. That she would put herself through that made me feel that she must really believe in what she is doing. It just made me think that people should be offering support during this hard time not condemnation that sort of thin really. I think that soaps have a lot to answer to in not really showing the realities of abortion but I don't think it has made me any more hard line really because I still feel that at the early stage it is the mothers choice.
The thing is, most women get a tremendous amount of support though. There are a very large numbers of organisations who's main business is to provide abortions and help women throughout the process. Just because there's a few scumbags who claim to be pro-life and go about doing nothing but upset women by telling them they're murderers and stuff after having an abortion, doesn't mean that in reality many of them are subjected to such treatment. I'm generally against abortion, but the people who do such things are scum. Although I particularly find it saddening that many pro-choicers try to dismantle any argument against abortion by pointing to such people, who are very much in the minority of those against abortion. I think a lot of women are wrong for having abortions for particular reasons, but I wouldn't really hold it against them as they don't believe what they're doing is wrong. I don't find the few women who never bother with contraception and expect sympathy for having so many abortions particularly impressive though.
0
Jonatan
Badges: 13
Rep:
?
#82
Report Thread starter 15 years ago
#82
(Original post by Amazing)
Yes, but assuming there are no special circumstances involved, then a woman can perfectly legally have a an abortion at 23 weeks and 6 days, but not one at 24 weeks. I think that it'd make much more sense if, whilst keeping the definite cut off points we have now, allow a doctor to judge how developed the foetus is and have guidelines on what stage of growth the foetus can be at before abortion, rather than basing it off random time intervals.
In practice what this means is to include a greater number of cut points so that the transition from one interval to another is not so sudden as it is today. You may (as you sugest) include a period where the mother is free to chose provided the doctor does not "veto" the decision as to speak. The question is whether the extra administration and costs acosiated with such a system can be justified. What if one just set the breakpoint with some extra margin and then just said that you do not allow abortion after , say 24 weeks, because although some pregnancies may not have reached so far at this point one has to be certain. In the end, what it really comes down to is how quickly the foetus develops, and I think we should leave it to the experts to determine where it is reasonable to put the limit.
0
Jonatan
Badges: 13
Rep:
?
#83
Report Thread starter 15 years ago
#83
(Original post by Amazing)
The thing is, most women get a tremendous amount of support though. There are a very large numbers of organisations who's main business is to provide abortions and help women throughout the process. Just because there's a few scumbags who claim to be pro-life and go about doing nothing but upset women by telling them they're murderers and stuff after having an abortion, doesn't mean that in reality many of them are subjected to such treatment. I'm generally against abortion, but the people who do such things are scum. Although I particularly find it saddening that many pro-choicers try to dismantle any argument against abortion by pointing to such people, who are very much in the minority of those against abortion. I think a lot of women are wrong for having abortions for particular reasons, but I wouldn't really hold it against them as they don't believe what they're doing is wrong. I don't find the few women who never bother with contraception and expect sympathy for having so many abortions particularly impressive though.
Perhaps you should set a quota to how many abortions you can have during a given amonth of time That way people would have to start thinking about contraception after having their 6th abortion...
0
riffraff
Badges: 1
Rep:
?
#84
Report 15 years ago
#84
(Original post by Jonatan)
Perhaps you should set a quota to how many abortions you can have during a given amonth of time That way people would have to start thinking about contraception after having their 6th abortion...
good idea
0
randdom
Badges: 20
Rep:
?
#85
Report 15 years ago
#85
Are there really that many women who have unprotected sex all the time and have loads of abortions? I would have thought it was quite rare.
0
Lawz-
Badges: 12
Rep:
?
#86
Report 15 years ago
#86
I think you'd be suprised - I know quite a few women that will have unprotected sex and who simply figure they will either not get pregnant or that they can take the morning after pill...

All the same I know a few who have had 3 abortions by the age of 22
0
zazy
Badges: 1
Rep:
?
#87
Report 15 years ago
#87
(Original post by Jonatan)
I cant beleive those who claim they think abortion is the same thing as murder. The reason is simple. If these people truly beleive this, then why are they not reacting to the large numbers of abortions that take place in our society? If the law allowed mothers to slit the throughts of their newborns merely because they did not want to have them, then I know that I for one would be up at the governments doorstep screaming for a change. If these people truly beleive that abortion is as bad as murder, then I am horrified to see how neglectant they are to the fact that it occurs on such a large scale.
It all depends whether you consider an ebryo to be a living human with rights and also whether you value human life or not....
0
Amazing
Badges: 0
Rep:
?
#88
Report 15 years ago
#88
(Original post by Jonatan)
Perhaps you should set a quota to how many abortions you can have during a given amonth of time That way people would have to start thinking about contraception after having their 6th abortion...
Heh. I think the NHS stop paying after the second or third abortion. I don't really see why it's provided for free in the first place though, as unless if it's a danger to the woman's life, then it's not actually an essential "operation", and if anything is more akin to plastic surgery - removing an "inconvenience".

I believe the figures in America are something like 50% of abortions are because no contraception was used at all, about 35% because contraception failed, and the rest for medical reasons and rape. I have no idea what it is in Britain, but I assume the stats will be quite similar. Basically, anybody who "forgets" to use contraception is an idiot, and I will never have any respect for people who can't just use a little bit of common sense.
0
Linda
Badges: 3
Rep:
?
#89
Report 15 years ago
#89
(Original post by Amazing)
Heh. I think the NHS stop paying after the second or third abortion. I don't really see why it's provided for free in the first place though, as unless if it's a danger to the woman's life, then it's not actually an essential "operation", and if anything is more akin to plastic surgery - removing an "inconvenience".

I believe the figures in America are something like 50% of abortions are because no contraception was used at all, about 35% because contraception failed, and the rest for medical reasons and rape. I have no idea what it is in Britain, but I assume the stats will be quite similar. Basically, anybody who "forgets" to use contraception is an idiot, and I will never have any respect for people who can't just use a little bit of common sense.
I think it is partially because many teenagers would have difficulties affording it and may for various reasons not be able to tell their parents. Basicly the argument is that if someone cannot afford to have an abortion then they are also unlikely to afford raising a child, and it would therefore be quite wrong to force the womman to go through a pregnancy because of her economical position.
0
Amazing
Badges: 0
Rep:
?
#90
Report 15 years ago
#90
(Original post by Linda)
I think it is partially because many teenagers would have difficulties affording it and may for various reasons not be able to tell their parents. Basicly the argument is that if someone cannot afford to have an abortion then they are also unlikely to afford raising a child, and it would therefore be quite wrong to force the womman to go through a pregnancy because of her economical position.
Then shouldn't abortions only be free for those who are poor? Why should a woman earning a decent a salary have to pay out nothing?
0
Dude
Badges: 14
Rep:
?
#91
Report 15 years ago
#91
(Original post by Amazing)
Then shouldn't abortions only be free for those who are poor? Why should a woman earning a decent a salary have to pay out nothing?
You can turn that question around to her point of veiw you know. Why should she have to pay when someone else getting the same thing done get it for free.
0
Bigcnee
Badges: 2
Rep:
?
#92
Report 15 years ago
#92
The simple reason is this:

Abortion is not clear-cut (as murder is). Otherwise, it would not be legal. You can still think it amounts to murder and disagree with it, whilst understanding that it is a complex moral issue.

I would've thought this was obvious.
0
drago di giada
Badges: 0
Rep:
?
#93
Report 15 years ago
#93
Anyone feeling up to telling me what I missed in here? Been a bit busy and there is WAY to much to read.
0
riffraff
Badges: 1
Rep:
?
#94
Report 15 years ago
#94
(Original post by drago di giada)
Anyone feeling up to telling me what I missed in here? Been a bit busy and there is WAY to much to read.
basically another abortion thread- they're all interchangeable
0
NDGAARONDI
Badges: 16
Rep:
?
#95
Report 15 years ago
#95
(Original post by tessie)
thats a very good point but what day if a 14 yr old girl as raped and becomes pregnant? the birth will probably ruin both her life and the life of the child she will have, but its too bad? you shouldnt have been raped then?
That was the case before tha Abortion Act 1967 - R v Bourne (1939) I think, you can use duress as a defence for it. It seems to me the Act was a devious technique. It was only making the laws statutory, when most of it was covered by case-law. May be there was an ulterior motive?

(Original post by randdom)
Personally I don't think that abortion is murder. I don't think that early abortion is anyway because the feotus doesn't even have have a brain yet.
You can get done for murdering a child without a brain, it is human if it has been expelled from the mother's womb, according to the law. There is this strange medical term for brainless. I did see something on the TV about this kid having no brain and he was like 5 years old or something. How he survives I do not know! Was on the news or something, wish I could remember. Anyone know?

(Original post by Mysticmin)
At the end of the day it's the woman's decision because it's her body. Why should she be forced to carry a baby she never wanted for nine months?

But I do strongly disagree with abortion due to accidental pregnancy. The sad thing is these babies will probably be put up for adoption.
Don't we need more children up for adoption though? There are plenty of excellent would-be parents that adopt children. I realise there are circumstances where abortion must be used, but it doesn't help if you do hear someone who used it as a 'get out clause' so to speak because they were reckless about conceiving etc.

(Original post by Howard)
Murder? My ass.
Did you know if I stabbed a pregnant mother in the womb and the child was born and died afterwards I could be indicted for manslaughter? It does not make sense that I can manslaughter something but not murder it! Attorney-General Reference (No 3 of 1994) (1997) Yet if it dies within her body it is only GBH.
0
ruffian
Badges: 0
Rep:
?
#96
Report 15 years ago
#96
what you doing stabbing a woman anyway? forget the baby, u just stabbed a woman god damnit
0
KandyKane
Badges: 0
Rep:
?
#97
Report 15 years ago
#97
[QUOTE=Jonatan]I cant beleive those who claim they think abortion is the same thing as murder. The reason is simple. If these people truly beleive this, then why are they not reacting to the large numbers of abortions that take place in our society? If the law allowed mothers to slit the throughts of their newborns merely because they did not want to have them, then I know that I for one would be up at the governments doorstep screaming for a change. If these people truly beleive that abortion is as bad as murder, then I am horrified to see how neglectant they are to the fact that it occurs on such a large scale.[/QUOTE

I think abortions are fine. There are many cases in which giving birth to the baby is not in the best interests of either the mother or the baby. And I understand that getting an abortion is not an easy decision, but it is often the best option.
0
hihihihi
Badges: 0
Rep:
?
#98
Report 15 years ago
#98
abortion has so many arguments for and against. for every argument there's basically an anti argument. take this case for example; some say that the fetus has a right to live if the women has unprotected sex. but what about pregnancy due to defective contraception or rape -in either case pregnancy has resulted involuntarily- should the women be allowed abortion then?
but then one could counter argue that the women can avoid pregnancy altogether by having a hysterectomy, which is very harsh..

and so on. so i don't think i can really be totally be against or for but sometimes i'm inclined towards pro abortion.
0
jackgiraffe
Badges: 0
Rep:
?
#99
Report 15 years ago
#99
(Original post by yawn1)
So there you have it Jonotan - this is an example of the means that some pro-lifers will go to to ensure that abortionists are prevented from carrying out their 'murderous' deeds! They try to close down the 'killing' clinics to save babies.

David Steele has so much to answer to as a result of his Abortion bill in 1967.
There is a groundswell of anti to the Roe v Wade act which allows abortion in USA.

For too long, young people have been exposed to this idea that if the birth of their child is not appropriate for them at the particular stage of life they are at, then that life can be extinguished, enabling them to carry on their own particular thing. Then, when it is appropriate to have a child they become caring and nuturing to that life growing in the womb.

I do not understand that inconsistency - if a life is a life when you want that life, then why is it not when it is unwanted?
this is the most commonsense i have ever read on this subject
0
jackgiraffe
Badges: 0
Rep:
?
#100
Report 15 years ago
#100
[QUOTE=KandyKane]
(Original post by Jonatan)
I cant beleive those who claim they think abortion is the same thing as murder. The reason is simple. If these people truly beleive this, then why are they not reacting to the large numbers of abortions that take place in our society? If the law allowed mothers to slit the throughts of their newborns merely because they did not want to have them, then I know that I for one would be up at the governments doorstep screaming for a change. If these people truly beleive that abortion is as bad as murder, then I am horrified to see how neglectant they are to the fact that it occurs on such a large scale.[/QUOTE

I think abortions are fine. There are many cases in which giving birth to the baby is not in the best interests of either the mother or the baby. And I understand that getting an abortion is not an easy decision, but it is often the best option.
how are they not in the best interests of the baby? families are crying out for babies to adopt. how is killing the baby in its best interests? what you mean is, a woman should not have to take responsibility for her own actions, if those actions lead to pregnancy. so just say it! it's ok to kill foetuses for the woman's freedom. abortion is never the best option, it is just the fastest option, and (at the time) the easiest for some women. abortion is the selfish option.
0
X
new posts
Back
to top
Latest
My Feed

See more of what you like on
The Student Room

You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

Personalise

Do you work while at uni?

Yes I work at university (84)
33.6%
No I don't (118)
47.2%
I work during the holidays (48)
19.2%

Watched Threads

View All