Are degree's that important?

You don't need a degree for any of those things and the ICAEW qualification is at least on the same level as an undergraduate degree on the National Qualifications Framework (NQF). My understanding is that ICAEW finals and the final year of a degree are both NQF 6.

If you do really want a degree later on, then do this after you qualify:

http://careers.icaew.com/school-students-leavers/Entry-routes/University-and-higher-education/birkbeck-degree

If you go to university, all you will get for it is about £45k of debt and a qualification that is less valuable than what the Big 4 firm is offering to pay for. You will also miss out on three year's salary. It's just not worth it.

Arguably consulting (particularly the two areas he mentions) is going to be very difficult to break in to without a degree? Won't be much of an issue for the other two, although may restrict some choices further down the line.

Aren't the final ACA exams were equivalent to a masters qualification, not a bachelors?

OP, just to play devils advocate, bear in mind if you don't go to uni you'll miss three years of... uni! Worth considering whether you want to spend your late teens with quite a high pressure job? Also bear in mind the "£45k of debt" isn't real debt, it's a student loan, very different. In the grand scheme of your life that's not going to be a massive amount of money, assuming you reach your ambitions above.

All that said, the school leaver route is a very lucrative opportunity and you'll kick yourself for skipping it if you end up unemployed as a graduate. I would probably be leaning towards the school leaver scheme in your shoes with the benefit of hindsight.

You don't need a degree for any of those things and the ICAEW qualification is at least on the same level as an undergraduate degree on the National Qualifications Framework (NQF). My understanding is that ICAEW finals and the final year of a degree are both NQF 6.

If you do really want a degree later on, then do this after you qualify:

http://careers.icaew.com/school-students-leavers/Entry-routes/University-and-higher-education/birkbeck-degree

If you go to university, all you will get for it is about £45k of debt and a qualification that is less valuable than what the Big 4 firm is offering to pay for. You will also miss out on three year's salary. It's just not worth it.

ACA is equivalent to, or even higher than a masters degree.

ACA is equivalent to, or even higher than a masters degree.

I'm definitely an advocate for not going to uni, but uni is a bunch of fun and all the spiel about growing as a person, once in a lifetime experience etc. is very much true. Imo, degrees are important, but not necessarily in and of itself, the life experience and network is the real value of university.

Maybe I'm woefully wrong, but I don't see the point in a degree unless you're planning to go into a profession where a degree is specifically required (Medicine, Law etc.) or you plan to go into further research.

For most people, a degree is simply a means to put off working and getting into a mountain of debt while you're at it.

Maybe I'm woefully wrong, but I don't see the point in a degree unless you're planning to go into a profession where a degree is specifically required (Medicine, Law etc.) or you plan to go into further research.

For most people, a degree is simply a means to put off working and getting into a mountain of debt while you're at it.

On purely academic level, I can now confirm that ICAEW is NQF 7, equivalent but not higher than a Masters degree. However, I would agree that the ACA is more valuable than a Masters degree, because the work experience requirement not only sets it apart but is probably more valuable than the exams, at least to benefit from perception (in truth, you could spend a long time ticking boxes, but others disagree with me on that so we shan't dwell on it)!



Whilst I agree these experiences are attainable at university, they are certainly not unique. The debt arrangements are much more unique than the experiences, which could just as easily be gained as a holiday rep, a backpacker or indeed a trainee hanging out with lots of other trainees at a Big 4 firm.


I agree with this, generally, although it does annoy me sometimes that those without means are to all intents and purposes becoming excluded from studying humanities subjects. This becomes even more true at Masters and PhD level, where poorer students can't wait forever for a permanent job. I don't particularly relish the idea that History Depts will become dominated by rich folk in the next few years either.

Agreed. However, having done a masters (LL.M) and almost having completed my ACA (with CAI), the academic difficulty of the ACA is leaps and bounds ahead.

The NQF guidelines are of limited utility given the fact that they break down qualification's comparability on a very basic level. But don't get me wrong, I do accept your point.

I dunno, I'm doing the harder exams of the ICAS qualification at the minute and it's nowhere near as difficult as my undergrad degree. Guess it depends where you go and what you do

For most people, a degree is simply a means to put off working and getting into a mountain of debt while you're at it.

University is an expensive route if you're not quite sure

yeah but at least the bad stuff is counterbalanced by all the sex you have at uni.

My undergrad and masters were in Law at Russel Group Uni so by no means a soft degree. The CAP II exams (second stage of the Chartered Accounts Exams in Ireland) were the worst set of exams I've ever had to do. The national pass rate is something like 55% and only 70% of big 4 candidates managed to pass all of the exams in their first sitting. The FAE's (finals), which I'm currently sitting, have a pass rate of 60% (c.75% @ the big 4).

Actually, I disagree on this. University is the best thing to do if you're not quite sure. School leaver schemes require a huge amount of commitment, you need to be certain what you want to do in the future others you will either drop out of the scheme or fail and have have no other options without a degree. Expensive doesn't come into it as all a student loan means is effectively paying slightly more "tax" once earning over a certain threshold

My understanding was that ICAI had a particularly brutal set of finals papers?



I'm with Felicity on this one. You can walk away from a school leaver scheme and go and do a degree and you can get a student loan to do that. If, however, you do a degree and later decide you want to do something else that requires a degree, the position I find myself in now (wanting to do a law degree) you will find:

1) You are not eligible for a student loan because you already have a degree;
2) The fees charged may be higher than someone doing a first degree and possibly charged at the same level as an international student.