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Is heterosexuality natural?

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Original post by Geo21
After reading many topics I thought this would be interesting. I am not asking for anyone to compare it against homosexuality or tell me why homosexuality is unnatural or natural, just heterosexuality please.

So discuss and allow me to observe haha! :smile:

After reading comments I have decided to add on: please do not use comparison as an argument and only tell me why heterosexuality is natural,normal or acceptable. That argument is immensely overplayed loooool


What definition of the word "natural" are you using?
Original post by andragonous
Does it mean doing what the body is designed to do? If so... designed by who?


To say that the body is "designed" to do something doesn't necessarily require the existence of a designer, because the word "designed" is being used in a loose sense.

For example, regardless of whether or not one believes in a God, one might say that dolphins are "designed" to live in water, rather than on land. Even though theoretically, a dolphin could live on land if it wanted to, it is not a matter of coincidence that its body is specifically suited for movement, propulsion and communication in water. This may be the result of many years of evolution, but the effect is that dolphins' bodies are "as though" they were designed to live in water. It is based on this that you could say that one lifestyle is in a sense, more "natural" than the other.
Reply 42
Original post by tazarooni89
What definition of the word "natural" are you using?


To be honest I was just responding the constant threads on TSR based on homosexuality being unnatural in some sort of mad rant a few days ago haha. Since then I have 'stopped watching' this thread and kinda forgotten about it. I think that this definition that states nature as ''existing in or derived from nature; not made or caused by humankind'' cannot possibly be used in argument when discussing us a whole as we have now extended our adaptations in creating things like technology, complex social structures and have lost what adaptations would be for.

I think I'm going off on a bit of rant but how natural are the lives we live when people debate how natural something is through something completely man made??
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by tazarooni89
To say that the body is "designed" to do something doesn't necessarily require the existence of a designer, because the word "designed" is being used in a loose sense.

For example, regardless of whether or not one believes in a God, one might say that dolphins are "designed" to live in water, rather than on land. Even though theoretically, a dolphin could live on land if it wanted to, it is not a matter of coincidence that its body is specifically suited for movement, propulsion and communication in water. This may be the result of many years of evolution, but the effect is that dolphins' bodies are "as though" they were designed to live in water. It is based on this that you could say that one lifestyle is in a sense, more "natural" than the other.


You might use the word loosely but I think if you literally believe in a design, you have to assume the existence of a designer.

If all that 'designed' means is 'what the body is suited to do' then I suppose you're in the same loop where one can just respond by asking "suited for what"?

Suited for survival? Heterosexuality probably is not all that helpful in this sense. I mean it might form bonds with people that make survival more likely, safety in numbers and all...

Suited for reproduction? I suppose heterosexuality could be seen as this, although it isn't a necessary or sufficient condition.

Happiness... yes I suppose so...

I could go on with speculations about what this 'natural' means but I think my agenda is pretty clear. I have absolutely no idea what people mean when they talk about how being gay is not natural. I am not entirely sure that they know what they mean either.
Well I suppose people can't help bing pedophiles then


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Reply 45
Original post by lilypear
Well, I would think that it's kind of natural because the only way you can reproduce is through the good old coitus (e.g a penis and a vagina)

But there's a lot of animals out there that are homosexual :hmm:


By saying "there's a lot of animals" is bit naive if I may say so. Almost all follow their natural instinct which is to mate with the same species of the opposite sex i.e heterosexuality. But because a lot of inbreeding and mental health goes unchecked in animal populations any odd behavior like two male Lions banging one another is attributed to these causes. Very few are homosexual. If an animal tries to bum rape another male of the same species, it is likely a mistake and the individual does not have homosexual feelings, only that trait can be attributed to the human species.
Original post by andragonous
You might use the word loosely but I think if you literally believe in a design, you have to assume the existence of a designer.

If all that 'designed' means is 'what the body is suited to do' then I suppose you're in the same loop where one can just respond by asking "suited for what"?

Suited for survival? Heterosexuality probably is not all that helpful in this sense. I mean it might form bonds with people that make survival more likely, safety in numbers and all...

Suited for reproduction? I suppose heterosexuality could be seen as this, although it isn't a necessary or sufficient condition.

Happiness... yes I suppose so...

I could go on with speculations about what this 'natural' means but I think my agenda is pretty clear. I have absolutely no idea what people mean when they talk about how being gay is not natural. I am not entirely sure that they know what they mean either.


I gave an example in my earlier post didn't I? I presume you understood what I meant when I suggested that it is natural for a dolphin to live in water rather than on land? Or that it is natural for lions to eat meat, but not for sheep to eat meat?

Regardless of whether or not someone consciously designed the human body, the point is that certain body parts have obvious functions. The function of the legs is for standing and walking. The function of the hands is not for standing and walking, even though some people might train themselves to be able to do this. Similarly, there is no body part which has been "designed" (or has evolved) specifically for the function of having sex with the same gender, whereas the fact that the penis fits into the vagina, that both have nerve endings for sexual pleasure, that this act can lead to pregnancy etc. is no coincidence, but an evolutionary inevitability.

Also, I'm not sure what you mean by "heterosexuality is not a necessary nor sufficient condition for reproduction". If we're discounting, "unnatural" (artificial, man made) forms of conception, then heterosexual intercourse is certainly necessary for conception. And the heterosexual orientation exists specifically because it incentivises this.
Original post by tazarooni89
I gave an example in my earlier post didn't I? I presume you understood what I meant when I suggested that it is natural for a dolphin to live in water rather than on land? Or that it is natural for lions to eat meat, but not for sheep to eat meat?

Regardless of whether or not someone consciously designed the human body, the point is that certain body parts have obvious functions. The function of the legs is for standing and walking. The function of the hands is not for standing and walking, even though some people might train themselves to be able to do this. Similarly, there is no body part which has been "designed" (or has evolved) specifically for the function of having sex with the same gender, whereas the fact that the penis fits into the vagina, that both have nerve endings for sexual pleasure, that this act can lead to pregnancy etc. is no coincidence, but an evolutionary inevitability.

Also, I'm not sure what you mean by "heterosexuality is not a necessary nor sufficient condition for reproduction". If we're discounting, "unnatural" (artificial, man made) forms of conception, then heterosexual intercourse is certainly necessary for conception. And the heterosexual orientation exists specifically because it incentivises this.


"I gave an example didn't I?" You gave an example of some bodily functions being more 'suited' for certain activities e.g. a dolphin living in water. It is clear in the case of the dolphin that living in water suits the mammal’s comfort, chances of survival and reproduction. My question with regard to whether the human body is more suited to heterosexuality is (and was in my previous post): suited for what purpose? It isn't clear to me that it's a necessary or sufficient condition for survival, reproduction or happiness.


"heterosexuality is certainly necessary for reproduction". Has a non-heterosexual male ever impregnated a woman before? If yes, then heterosexuality is not at all a necessary condition. I have no idea how you could argue that it is a necessary condition, given that the word refers to EXCLUSIVE attraction to the opposite sex. What about those creatures (and I'm referring to creatures of hundreds of different species, not just human beings) that engage in sexual acts with both sexes?
Original post by andragonous
"I gave an example didn't I?" You gave an example of some bodily functions being more 'suited' for certain activities e.g. a dolphin living in water. It is clear in the case of the dolphin that living in water suits the mammal’s comfort, chances of survival and reproduction. My question with regard to whether the human body is more suited to heterosexuality is (and was in my previous post): suited for what purpose? It isn't clear to me that it's a necessary or sufficient condition for survival, reproduction or happiness.


What do you mean 'suited for what purpose'?
A dolphin living in water isn't a "necessary or sufficient" condition for comfort, survival or reproduction either. It's just more conducive to all of those things than living on land, because the dolphin has adapted specifically for the purpose of living in water, rather than anywhere else. Something doesn't have to be "necessary or sufficient" for a purpose in order to be considered suited for that purpose.

Similarly, heterosexuality (including the heterosexual component of bisexuality) is more conducive to reproduction than homosexuality. The human body has specifically evolved and adapted for the purpose of being able to engage in heterosexual intercourse (because our species wouldn't have lasted very long without it), whereas this is not the case for any kind of homosexual intercourse.

"heterosexuality is certainly necessary for reproduction". Has a non-heterosexual male ever impregnated a woman before? If yes, then heterosexuality is not at all a necessary condition. I have no idea how you could argue that it is a necessary condition, given that the word refers to EXCLUSIVE attraction to the opposite sex. What about those creatures (and I'm referring to creatures of hundreds of different species, not just human beings) that engage in sexual acts with both sexes?


I said that heterosexual intercourse a necessary condition for reproduction (ignoring methods which are 'unnatural' in the sense that they are man-made). Heterosexuality is just something that incentivises engaging in heterosexual intercourse. It's true that bisexuality (which is essentially a simultaneous occurrence of heterosexuality and homosexuality) can also do the same - but only the heterosexual component of it can do that.
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by j.sethzai
What about bestiality and paedophilia? Are they natural?


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are you for real?
All sexualities are natural
Reply 51
Heterosexuality is natural, otherwise all organisms would be extinct.
Reply 52
Original post by xKaiden
Heterosexuality is natural, otherwise all organisms would be extinct.




"Oh hai thar!"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parthenogenesis
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asexual_reproduction
I, like Freud, believe that people are innately bisexual, and only 'move' toward either hetero and homo- sexuality during their lives
Original post by lilypear
Well, I would think that it's kind of natural because the only way you can reproduce is through the good old coitus (e.g a penis and a vagina)

But there's a lot of animals out there that are homosexual :hmm:



Its more a case of a wild animal having a one in ten chance of becoming a homosexual
Original post by Madisonrose
Well I suppose people can't help bing pedophiles then


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Wtf!

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