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The Ultimate England Thread II watch

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    Hi guys,

    I've briefly renamed this thread and stickied it to increase exposure on TSR throughout the tournament.

    It will revert to KK's original title and will be put back in the normal Football forum a few days after if England get knocked out.
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    football is 10% tactics, 45% luck and 55% luck. I don't know why you lot bother to strategise because games are never determined by the formations. They're decided by the weather conditions, the fans, if the players got good sleep the night before.

    It's quite ridiculous to compare football, or any physical sport, to something like chess.
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    (Original post by dire wolf)
    football is 10% tactics, 45% luck and 55% luck. I don't know why you lot bother to strategise because games are never determined by the formations. They're decided by the weather conditions, the fans, if the players got good sleep the night before. It's quite ridiculous to compare football, or any physical sport, to something like chess.
    I don't know if your inability to add up was an unsuccessful joke or just a mistake but please clarify the actual percentages so that they add up 100.Games are more likely to be determined by tactics, formations and players than anything else. You can have all the home support you want but a bad team is unlikely to win games.You also say that football is 100% luck (I will assume you only meant 90% due to adding up mistakes) which is just ridiculous. There is a reason it is the same teams there every year in most competitions and why Brazil and Spain are favourites. If it is just luck then the same teams wouldn't be consistently at the top (unless you claim they are consistently lucky over 20+ years which is even more ridiculous.)If tactics and strategies play such a small part then why do club owners sack the manager when it goes wrong and why does this usually have a big effect on results. This season Crystal Palace have played in front of the same fans, at the same conditions and I don't think their sleeping schedules changed massively yet they made a MASSIVE improvement when the manager (the guy setting the tactics) changed. Or was that all just luck as well?
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    (Original post by Alex Doran)
    I don't know if your inability to add up was an unsuccessful joke or just a mistake but please clarify the actual percentages so that they add up 100.Games are more likely to be determined by tactics, formations and players than anything else. You can have all the home support you want but a bad team is unlikely to win games.You also say that football is 100% luck (I will assume you only meant 90% due to adding up mistakes) which is just ridiculous. There is a reason it is the same teams there every year in most competitions and why Brazil and Spain are favourites. If it is just luck then the same teams wouldn't be consistently at the top (unless you claim they are consistently lucky over 20+ years which is even more ridiculous.)If tactics and strategies play such a small part then why do club owners sack the manager when it goes wrong and why does this usually have a big effect on results. This season Crystal Palace have played in front of the same fans, at the same conditions and I don't think their sleeping schedules changed massively yet they made a MASSIVE improvement when the manager (the guy setting the tactics) changed. Or was that all just luck as well?
    k dthen
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    I don't see why people are worried about Uruguay. They wouldn't even have qualified if Brazil had taken part in qualifying.
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    (Original post by cBay)
    I don't see why people are worried about Uruguay. They wouldn't even have qualified if Brazil had taken part in qualifying.
    I guess it's just Suarez and Cavani are both WC, it's an easy slip up game couple of moments asleep could be a couple of goals.




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    (Original post by dire wolf)
    football is 10% tactics, 45% luck and 55% luck. I don't know why you lot bother to strategise because games are never determined by the formations. They're decided by the weather conditions, the fans, if the players got good sleep the night before.

    It's quite ridiculous to compare football, or any physical sport, to something like chess.
    lol @ this
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    (Original post by Alex Doran)
    I don't know if your inability to add up was an unsuccessful joke or just a mistake but please clarify the actual percentages so that they add up 100.Games are more likely to be determined by tactics, formations and players than anything else. You can have all the home support you want but a bad team is unlikely to win games.You also say that football is 100% luck (I will assume you only meant 90% due to adding up mistakes) which is just ridiculous. There is a reason it is the same teams there every year in most competitions and why Brazil and Spain are favourites. If it is just luck then the same teams wouldn't be consistently at the top (unless you claim they are consistently lucky over 20+ years which is even more ridiculous.)If tactics and strategies play such a small part then why do club owners sack the manager when it goes wrong and why does this usually have a big effect on results. This season Crystal Palace have played in front of the same fans, at the same conditions and I don't think their sleeping schedules changed massively yet they made a MASSIVE improvement when the manager (the guy setting the tactics) changed. Or was that all just luck as well?
    it basically was luck. it is not for nothing that the pundits say 'anything can happen in football'.

    Also, 'formation' don't mean anything in this context: the players are MOVING AROUND, so how can their stay in some specific order? It's all a bit of a nonsense really.

    people love football, so they try to make it look more intellectually challenging than it really is. The reality is that most of the managers are dumb as hell, but they get the jobs because they've spent their lives playing football.
    The day a football club employs a professional chess player, or some war general (they bloody well have enough money to do it) is the day that I'll believe that there is any real strategy involved in the sport.
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    (Original post by dire wolf)
    it basically was luck. it is not for nothing that the pundits say 'anything can happen in football'. Also, 'formation' don't mean anything in this context: the players are MOVING AROUND, so how can their stay in some specific order? It's all a bit of a nonsense really.people love football, so they try to make it look more intellectually challenging than it really is. The reality is that most of the managers are dumb as hell, but they get the jobs because they've spent their lives playing football. The day a football club employs a professional chess player, or some war general (they bloody well have enough money to do it) is the day that I'll believe that there is any real strategy involved in the sport.
    So you are saying Tony Pulis turning Palace around was complete luck (well 100% out of 110% according to you.) You think Steve Bruce picking a different formation from the rest of the league had no impact on where Hull finished this season? Clubs could employ pretty much whoever they want as managers and they choose the people they do because they will be good at it. You say "most managers are dumb as hell" and yet you previously made something add up to 110%. That really says enough about your intelligence. It is quite difficult to say someone else is "dumb" when you can't even add up to 100 successfully.You then quote pundits as if to prove your point. I think it would be very difficult to find another person in the world who can honestly say they agree with you.
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    (Original post by Alex Doran)
    So you are saying Tony Pulis turning Palace around was complete luck (well 100% out of 110% according to you.) You think Steve Bruce picking a different formation from the rest of the league had no impact on where Hull finished this season? Clubs could employ pretty much whoever they want as managers and they choose the people they do because they will be good at it. You say "most managers are dumb as hell" and yet you previously made something add up to 110%. That really says enough about your intelligence. It is quite difficult to say someone else is "dumb" when you can't even add up to 100 successfully.You then quote pundits as if to prove your point. I think it would be very difficult to find another person in the world who can honestly say they agree with you.
    all I'm saying is that most of the managers are dumb as hell and you wouldn't want someone dumb as hell running the military. you obviously care a lot about football and how smart you are, so you were always going to get upset by this. maybe just relax and enjoy the game and quit being so bloody insecure..?

    i dont care whether people agree with me or not
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    (Original post by dire wolf)
    all I'm saying is that most of the managers are dumb as hell and you wouldn't want someone dumb as hell running the military. you obviously care a lot about football and how smart you are, so you were always going to get upset by this. maybe just relax and enjoy the game and quit being so bloody insecure..? i dont care whether people agree with me or not
    I do enjoy the game, I just don't see how you can claim "most of the managers are dumb as hell" given you failed to add up to 100. Also if managing a team was so easy then why you think they get paid so much to do it? I don't see how you can claim most of football is luck because if so, why do the same teams win the same things every year?
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    (Original post by Alex Doran)
    I do enjoy the game, I just don't see how you can claim "most of the managers are dumb as hell" given you failed to add up to 100. Also if managing a team was so easy then why you think they get paid so much to do it? I don't see how you can claim most of football is luck because if so, why do the same teams win the same things every year?
    because they have good players. good players don't need tactics to do well though.

    'hurr durr he put me in CAM and now suddenly i cant kick a ball anymore' lulz
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    (Original post by dire wolf)
    because they have good players. good players don't need tactics to do well though.

    'hurr durr he put me in CAM and now suddenly i cant kick a ball anymore' lulz
    You're right. Bale would be a beast of a centre half.


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    (Original post by dire wolf)
    because they have good players. good players don't need tactics to do well though.'hurr durr he put me in CAM and now suddenly i cant kick a ball anymore' lulz
    Lionel Messi is certainly the best footballer in the world over the last 5 years and arguably the greatest ever. He has performed above and beyond every single other player in the world on a consistent basis for Barcelona and his goals record, his performances and his reputation show that. Argentina have incredible individual players such as Aguero, Di Maria, Messi, Mascherano but they never quite gelled as a team and Messi was booed by his own fans because they thought he was not doing well enough. This is actual proof that incredible players do not always play well when under poor management, or in a system they don't like. If Messi, arguably the greatest player ever, can't perform in some situations then I don't think there is a better point to prove your entire argument invalid. He is a great player and when there were bad tactics, he did not perform.
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    (Original post by Alex Doran)
    Lionel Messi is certainly the best footballer in the world over the last 5 years and arguably the greatest ever. He has performed above and beyond every single other player in the world on a consistent basis for Barcelona and his goals record, his performances and his reputation show that. Argentina have incredible individual players such as Aguero, Di Maria, Messi, Mascherano but they never quite gelled as a team and Messi was booed by his own fans because they thought he was not doing well enough. This is actual proof that incredible players do not always play well when under poor management, or in a system they don't like. If Messi, arguably the greatest player ever, can't perform in some situations then I don't think there is a better point to prove your entire argument invalid. He is a great player and when there were bad tactics, he did not perform.
    lol, you know nothing about football. I'm done.
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    What I want to know is whether Shaw can play at Right Back. Because, if I see Johnson pull another horror show against Italy, I honestly will call Roy Hodgson up myself and tell him to send that attempt at a Right Back back to England.

    (Original post by Nichrome)
    Why is Rio a pundit now? The guy is a moron - can barely string a sentence together. Can't stand listening to his sloth, monotone voice.
    Lets be honest, at least he's better than Andy Townsend.
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    (Original post by dire wolf)
    lol, you know nothing about football. I'm done.
    Absolutely nothing wrong with what he said.
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    (Original post by Kenan and Kel)
    Absolutely nothing wrong with what he said.
    Cr7>All

    only a fool, or someone ignorant of the rules of true football, would disagree. Take your pick I guess
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    (Original post by dire wolf)
    Cr7>All

    only a fool, or someone ignorant of the rules of true football, would disagree. Take your pick I guess
    :rofl:

    **** sake, not dragging myself into this one
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    (Original post by dire wolf)
    lol, you know nothing about football. I'm done.
    2013 and 2014 Ronaldo was the best in the world but I think you might notice that I wrote over the last 5 years Messi has been the best. That is shown by any statistic and his general play is truly unique. Whether you agree with that bit or not is actually irrelevant to my point. My point was that Messi is a different player in a Barca team with a certain shape and tactics compared to him in the Argentina team. I think you read my post and realised that everything I said was absolutely correct and disproved you. This meant that you felt the need to make the discussion about something else because you had no reply. Please do not comment on Messi vs Ronaldo because neither of us will convince the other, please only comment on my actual point that I think proves fairly conclusively that tactics and formations have a massive impact.
 
 
 
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