Hey there! Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free

Can someone summarise this Ukraine/Russia war?! Watch

    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    11
    ReputationRep:
    I've read a lot of different things, I just want a summary of what's actually going on
    • Offline

      15
      Russia stole the Crimea back, separatists in the East want to join Russia once more, Ukraine's a cesspit etc, you need to go back centuries to understand why this is happening.
      • Community Assistant
      Online

      21
      ReputationRep:
      (Original post by Sophsha)
      I've read a lot of different things, I just want a summary of what's actually going on
      Basically the EU and Russia are each trying to pull Ukraine into them and as a result the country is being torn apart.
      Offline

      3
      ReputationRep:
      Ukraine becomes closer to the EU

      Putin does not like this

      Putin invades Crimea and calls a total joke of a referendum on Crimea (literally, remaining part of Ukraine was not an option on the ballot paper)

      Option "become part of Russia" obviously wins the election so Russia annexes Crimea

      A bunch of ethnic Russia paramilitaries start charging all over eastern Ukraine taking government buildings and raping and killing non-Russians who disagree

      The West stands around and does nothing as an aggressive foreign power invades a county right on their doorstep

      ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

      As a general point, I have noticed that a lot of Muslims on TSR support Putin (because he is a enemy of the USA and they feel the US does not behave it should towards the Islamic world), but bear in mind that in Russia hatred of Muslims is not only normal, but effectively encouraged by the government. In the rural parts, Cossacks are given a free reign to charge around abusing ethnic Turks, Tartars etc, push them off their land and kill them without any sort of punishment
      • Community Assistant
      Offline

      18
      ReputationRep:
      This section on the BBC might help.

      Basically, towards the end of 2013 protests began against the government, after the government abandoned an EU deal in favour of closer ties with Russia. The president (now former, of course) fled in February this year, and was replaced by an interim government.

      In March, Russia seized Crimea from Ukraine.

      Between April and May, pro-Russian separatists began to operate in parts of Eastern Ukraine, with fighting breaking out occasionally. Many claim that Russia have been supporting these fighters and even sending some of their own people over the border. Fighting has continued since then.

      Poroshenko won the election in May 2014 and became the new president of Ukraine with a more pro-Eu government. Since then government troops have made some gains against separatists.

      It's a bit more complicated than that though.
      Offline

      19
      ReputationRep:
      (Original post by Sophsha)
      I've read a lot of different things, I just want a summary of what's actually going on
      Ukraine has traditionally been seen by the Russians as a buffer zone as they were invaded 3 times ( Napoleon, WW1 and WW2) through that area.

      Once Ukraine leaves to join the EU, then it leaves Russia in a vulnerable position as it becomes far more difficult to control Ukraine through measures like gas prices.

      The other issue is that many Russians in the East of the country do not want to be part of Ukraine.
      Offline

      10
      ReputationRep:
      America has now taken over the country in their attempt to gradually subdue russia. russia answered back by allowing this but taking crimea (not to be cut off from one of their main navel bases).
      sphere of russian power during the cold war is in red:
      http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb2...Assistance.png
      NATO bases before ukraine's revolution:
      http://socioecohistory.files.wordpre...tary_bases.jpg
      Kazakhstan and the smaller countries to the south were all part of the USSR, afghanistan was occupied by it and eastern europe wa
      the only former memeber of the USSR now not under the control of america and/or the EU is Belarus which is called the 'last acis of eveil im Europe.
      america (or the west if you prefer) is territorial expanding. Russia doesnt like this.
      • Thread Starter
      Offline

      11
      ReputationRep:
      What are you guys wanting Ukraine to go for? Join the EU or Russia?
      • Community Assistant
      Online

      21
      ReputationRep:
      (Original post by Sophsha)
      What are you guys wanting Ukraine to go for? Join the EU or Russia?
      I'm pro-EU in the sense that Russia is the real enemy to the west but I oppose further EU expansion until countries are wealthy and to restructure the EU properly. Once Ukraine has a GDP of say 30k, then welcome aboard.
      • Offline

        15
        (Original post by Sophsha)
        What are you guys wanting Ukraine to go for? Join the EU or Russia?
        I'm not wanting Ukraine in the EU, I'm pro-Russia in this instance and the time will come where Ukraine will need tanks being sent in to shut them up as this war is stupid, Ukraine is and always will be a part of Russia just like Scotland to the UK.
        • Community Assistant
        Offline

        18
        ReputationRep:
        (Original post by tehFrance)
        Ukraine is and always will be a part of Russia just like Scotland to the UK.
        Ukraine has been an independent country for much of its history, including since the fall of the Soviet Union. It certainly does not belong to Russia, and it is in no way comparable to the Scottish independence debate.
        Offline

        0
        ReputationRep:
        EU and Ukraine president wanted to do a deal.
        Deal off after Ukraine and Russia do a deal.
        People who wanted closer ties with Eu cause a revolution.
        Revolution is backed by the West.
        Ukraine agree to EU deal.
        Russia not very happy, send troops into the Crimea.
        The country is divided, Russian separatists in the East want a united Russia and West want a EU member state.
        Europe imposed sanctions on Russia for allegedly arming the separatists.
        Offline

        16
        ReputationRep:
        I have no idea about history but to me it looks like Russia stealing land from Ukraine.

        This is what I've seen on sky and the BBC so will obviously be somewhat biased.
        Offline

        2
        ReputationRep:
        There was illegitimate coup in Ukraine most likely funded by the West. This supported by people in the west of Ukraine, but not those in the East who still supported the old president. Therefore the country became divided with the pro-EU and the pro-Russians. Crimeans wanted to be part of Russia, and therefore had a referendum. Crimea used to be part of Russia until they gave it to Ukraine but now since Ukraine want to cut off Russia, taking Crimea back was done to preserve the status quo. Russia's navy is situated there as well as many ethnic Russians living there.
        Now the pro-Russian separatists are fighting the Ukrainian army. Whilst MH17 was a war crime by the pro-Russians, the Ukrainian army itself has also been shelling innocent civilians but ofc western media won't cover that.
        Basically Russia is at fault for supporting the pro-Russians and Crimea should of been settled with a more legitimate vote (even with a proper,legit vote Crimea would of voted to join Russia). Ukraine is at fault because it's an illegitimate government who took power through violence and therefore have no right to rule Ukraine.
        Offline

        0
        ReputationRep:
        (Original post by nevergohalfpace)
        There was illegitimate coup in Ukraine most likely funded by the West. This supported by people in the west of Ukraine, but not those in the East who still supported the old president. Therefore the country became divided with the pro-EU and the pro-Russians. Crimeans wanted to be part of Russia, and therefore had a referendum. Crimea used to be part of Russia until they gave it to Ukraine but now since Ukraine want to cut off Russia, taking Crimea back was done to preserve the status quo. Russia's navy is situated there as well as many ethnic Russians living there.
        Now the pro-Russian separatists are fighting the Ukrainian army. Whilst MH17 was a war crime by the pro-Russians, the Ukrainian army itself has also been shelling innocent civilians but ofc western media won't cover that.
        Basically Russia is at fault for supporting the pro-Russians and Crimea should of been settled with a more legitimate vote (even with a proper,legit vote Crimea would of voted to join Russia). Ukraine is at fault because it's an illegitimate government who took power through violence and therefore have no right to rule Ukraine.
        That hasn't actually been confirmed (although it's likely, we still shouldn't jump to conclusions).

        - As for it being a war-crime it could be considered one but I don't think it was intentional, mistakes do happen in times of war, whoever was responsible needs to be found and punished but it should not be used as a pretext for war.

        - Western Ukraine have rejected the Russian three point plan for federalism that would restore peace in the region, it's quite clear that Russia doesn't want the entire of the Ukraine otherwise it would have taken it already.


        I also have a question about the plane. If it was heading directly towards them and they thought it was a military plane what were they supposed to do? It could have killed civilians on the ground. A tweet that was previously deleted also said 'We warned you', where was this warning? And if there was an official warning why is there still flights going over the area?
        • Community Assistant
        Offline

        18
        ReputationRep:
        (Original post by nevergohalfpace)
        Ukraine is at fault because it's an illegitimate government who took power through violence and therefore have no right to rule Ukraine.
        The current Ukrainian government was democratically elected, there was a presidential election in May won by Poroshenko. And the interim government before it was established after the former president was voted out by MPs.
        Offline

        2
        ReputationRep:
        The criminal West provoked Russia into reacting to the state-sponsored overthrow of the legitimate Ukrainian government.
        Offline

        2
        ReputationRep:
        (Original post by RFowler)
        The current Ukrainian government was democratically elected, there was a presidential election in May won by Poroshenko. And the interim government before it was established after the former president was voted out by MPs.
        what was the turnout though in east?
        • Community Assistant
        Offline

        18
        ReputationRep:
        (Original post by nevergohalfpace)
        what was the turnout though in east?
        There were parts where it didn't happen, probably because of separatists forcibly shutting down polling stations. Nationwide turnout was over 60% as far as I remember.
        Offline

        3
        ReputationRep:
        Putin wants Ukraine because the gas pipes go through Ukraine into the rest of Europe giving him the ability to turn them off to starve the rest of Europe of a vital resource. He also wants the other gas gateway countries back like Bulgaria. The USA and EU have done everything in their power to stop this happening. Countries like Ukraine and Bulgaria have both in the past been starved of gas and both have suffered as pretty much pawns in this political game of chess between the USA/EU and Russia.

        Its all about resources and status in short.

        (Original post by Sophsha)
        What are you guys wanting Ukraine to go for? Join the EU or Russia?
        I want Ukraine to be an independent sovereign country that is not part of the EU or a Russian block. If Crimea wants to become Russian then geographically it should be known as a part of Russia and Ukraine should just become a smaller independent nation. This would probably end up advantageous to them anyway as smaller countries tend to do better as proven through numerous case studies throughout history.

        I want every country in the EU now to go back to being independent and for us to set up trade agreements on a one to one basis.

        I am against the EU and large political blocks and quite frankly would like a world of smaller devolved independent states with less power as a collective group. Its far less likely countries the size of Switzerland are going to go around doing this sort of stuff. They only do when they have political backing of a superpower or are a superpower themselves. I'm also in favour of all the USA states becoming fully independent tbh.
       
       
       
    • See more of what you like on The Student Room

      You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

    • Poll
      Did TEF Bronze Award affect your UCAS choices?
      Useful resources
    • See more of what you like on The Student Room

      You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

    • The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

      Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

      Quick reply
      Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.