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'Straight white guy festival' causes controversy

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Original post by Truths
Sorry to burst your bubble. Hip Hop, Grime & House were predominately black movements and were not influenced by Germans in anyway shape or form. Try again.




Sorry to burst your afrocentric bubble, but Kraftwerk were the pioneers in electronic music in the 1970s. Everything you named came at earliest in the 1980s.

http://arts.nationalpost.com/2014/03/30/cultural-studies-why-kraftwerks-influence-is-pervasive-in-pop-from-bowie-to-new-wave-and-kanye-west-to-arcade-fire/?__federated=1

"It’s one of pop music’s supreme ironies that a group conceived as separately from the African-American tradition as could possibly be imagined should end up, through no particular design of their own, embraced by that tradition."
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by Mick.w
I actually don't think he's too bad tbh. he's able to argue like a man. fair enough he might avoid some of the more difficult questions but he doesnt argue like a girl at least.

i wouldnt call him a sjw.
feeling sensitive to being asked where he's from in such a multicultural society is probably due to the fact that he's just not proud of being where he's from. i think he made that pretty clear when he said he would trade his heritage to get white privilege.

thats not being a social justice warrior. its being a sellout/bounty.



some of the more difficult questions i.e. all of them

Nah I think he is one of these types who believe that 6000 years ago, african empires spanned the entire planet and that melanin gives you some sort of magical powers
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by Mick.w
beyonce and jay z are international. i dont think their fan base majority is black anymore.
i know certainly the crowed that turned up to jay z's concert in london a while back was largely white and middleclass. it even made the news.


Beyoncé is not as international as you think. The US is her biggest market. And even if you combine all the sales from other countries, it still wont be half of what she sold in the US from her last album. Beyoncé's song Partition was only sent to urban radio, so I think it's safe to say that the black community are her ground. Although she is very versatile, and is marketed to white people too. In regards to the tour I went to Beyoncé's show a few months ago and there were hardly any black people. But that's probably because the tickets are expensive. I don't see it as a reflection of her fanbase. I'm sure most black people can still afford a £7 album.

Original post by Mick.w
also uve just proven that rnb which is still obviously intended for women has its most popular song as "these hoes aint loyal" which is quite misogynistic. yet its still targeted towards a female fanbase.


Wuuut? The song is written and sang from a males perspective? How is marketed towards woman when it puts them in a negative light. Maybe you can argue that Trey Songz is marketed towards women because he sings about love, sex and romance. But Chris has both genders in his fan base.

Original post by Mick.w
but I am curious. can you tell me a scene that is to black men what heavy metal is to white men?


Hip Hop?

Original post by TheAnusFiles
Sorry to burst your afrocentric bubble, but Kraftwerk were the pioneers in electronic music in the 1970s. Everything you named came at earliest in the 1980s.

http://arts.nationalpost.com/2014/03/30/cultural-studies-why-kraftwerks-influence-is-pervasive-in-pop-from-bowie-to-new-wave-and-kanye-west-to-arcade-fire/?__federated=1

"It’s one of pop music’s supreme ironies that a group conceived as separately from the African-American tradition as could possibly be imagined should end up, through no particular design of their own, embraced by that tradition."

Is it hard that hard to understand that although, germans may have contributed to music technology or electronic music, they had nothing to do with genre's pioneered by black people? That's like saying because the wheel appears as early as the Mesopotamian era, Ancient Greece pioneered the motorbike. I'm sorry, Germans are not responsible for Grime, and they never once claimed responsibility. Try again.

Original post by Mick.w
I actually don't think he's too bad tbh. he's able to argue like a man. fair enough he might avoid some of the more difficult questions but he doesnt argue like a girl at least.

Stopped reading from there.

Original post by Truths
Is it hard that hard to understand that although, germans may have contributed to music technology or electronic music, they had nothing to do with genre's pioneered by black people? That's like saying because the wheel appears as early as the Mesopotamian era, Ancient Greece pioneered the motorbike. I'm sorry, Germans are not responsible for Grime, and they never once claimed responsibility. Try again.




I never said they pioneered grime. What I said was that without white German bands who created this style of electronic music, grime would never have existed. Kanye West's music for example is his own creation, but it draws heavily from Kraftwerk, and it is ludicrous to think that had they not existed his music would have been exactly the same. What you are claiming is that music like grime is a 100% african creation without any european influence whatsoever, which is false.

Essentially it is like lauding the iPod while claiming that the inventor of the MP3 had nothing to do with it.
Original post by TheAnusFiles
I never said they pioneered grime. What I said was that without white German bands who created this style of electronic music, grime would never have existed. Kanye West's music for example is his own creation, but it draws heavily from Kraftwerk, and it is ludicrous to think that had they not existed his music would have been exactly the same. What you are claiming is that music like grime is a 100% african creation without any european influence whatsoever, which is false.

Essentially it is like lauding the iPod while claiming that the inventor of the MP3 had nothing to do with it.

You and I both know that isn't true when electronic music developed around many parts of the world around the same time independently. You are confusing technology with genre. You can observe the timeline yourself. And even then Psychedelic rock became a movement in America 1st. There is no resemblance between Krautrock and Grime music. Music does not follow a linear path. You can buy 10 books on Grime, none will credit Krautrock. You can buy 10 books on Krautrock, none will mention grime. I wont be discussing this anymore. Do you even know how we reached this comment? I do. You were clutching at flaws and deflecting. Bye.

Original post by Truths
You and I both know that isn't true when electronic music developed around many parts of the world around the same time independently. You are confusing technology with genre. You can observe the timeline yourself. And even then Psychedelic rock became a movement in America 1st. There is no resemblance between Krautrock and Grime music. Music does not follow a linear path. You can buy 10 books on Grime, none will credit Krautrock. You can buy 10 books on Krautrock, none will mention grime. I wont be discussing this anymore. Do you even know how we reached this comment? I do. You were clutching at flaws and deflecting. Bye.


It didn't. You are just outright lying now. My point wasn't specific to grime. You were saying that white people steal black music. My response was that the likes of Kayne have copied the styles of white bands.

P.S. all the bands in your timeline were white anyway.

(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by TheAnusFiles
It didn't. You are just outright lying now. My point wasn't specific to grime. You were saying that white people steal black music. My response was that the likes of Kayne have copied the styles of white bands.

P.S. all the bands in your timeline were white anyway.



And I don't think we will ever reach an agreement on origins of what ever genres so I'm just going to cut to the chase. Kanye can make 100 electronic songs, he will never become the face of synthpop. That title seems to be resting firmly in the hands of David Guetta/Calvin Harris etc. Yet Elvis became the king of rock n roll & white people have become the face of Jazz.And now they are moving onto arrogating R&B and Hip Hop Music. It is clear.
Original post by Truths
And I don't think we will ever reach an agreement on origins of what ever genres so I'm just going to cut to the chase. Kanye can make 100 electronic songs, he will never become the face of synthpop. That title seems to be resting firmly in the hands of David Guetta/Calvin Harris etc. Yet Elvis became the king of rock n roll & white people have become the face of Jazz.And now they are moving onto arrogating R&B and Hip Hop Music. It is clear.


Only as those genres are dying anyway. That's what happens with major labels moving in like maggot feeding on dead genres.

The best black hip-hop:

25 years ago: NWA/PE

20: 2pac, Biggie Smalls

Now: Lil Wayne... Lil Wayne

Happened to punk/grunge too. Used to be a white working class/left wing genre, soon the labels move in once the good bands are over and it starts turning into rubbish
Original post by Jordooooom
http://metro.co.uk/2014/07/23/straight-white-guy-festival-sparks-controversy-4807716/

So apparently there were flyers for a festival solely for white straight guys. It may not even be a real thing but nevertheless it has stirred some controversy.

What are you thoughts?

Personally I think such a festival is stupid and pointless but I don't understand the anger towards it. It's not like it's mlpromoting hate at anyone? (As far as we can tell)


Well don't go then.
Reply 411
Avatar for Jordooooom
Jordooooom
OP
Original post by speedbird
Well don't go then.


Well I wouldn't be going anyway seeing as it's half way across the world you tit
Original post by TheAnusFiles
Only as those genres are dying anyway. That's what happens with major labels moving in like maggot feeding on dead genres.

The best black hip-hop:

25 years ago: NWA/PE

20: 2pac, Biggie Smalls

Now: Lil Wayne... Lil Wayne


Lil Wayne isn't best hip hop artist, nor is the most successful hip hop artist this decade, nor is he the new face of hip hop. Not when Drake, Jay Z, Kanye and even J. Cole continue to outsell him.
Original post by Yi-Ge-Ningderen
This.

Lets also not forget about the thousands of white slaves owned by Africans that the left don't like people talking about as it undermines their argument and schools shamelessly don't teach about.


Funny thing is the Arabs owned black slaves longer than Europeans but it's whitewashed entirely in school textbooks and everywhere else...wonder why.

Same with the Babary Arabs enslaving Southern Europeans and the Islam Turkic armys which enslaved populations of slavs, the word slav actually come from slave.
Original post by Truths
Beyoncé is not as international as you think. The US is her biggest market. And even if you combine all the sales from other countries, it still wont be half of what she sold in the US from her last album. Beyoncé's song Partition was only sent to urban radio, so I think it's safe to say that the black community are her ground. Although she is very versatile, and is marketed to white people too. In regards to the tour I went to Beyoncé's show a few months ago and there were hardly any black people. But that's probably because the tickets are expensive. I don't see it as a reflection of her fanbase. I'm sure most black people can still afford a £7 album.

well the us is her biggest market but 10% of the us is black. so most of that us audience will be white. white people still listen to urban radio. your own experiences back up my point. album sales are not very high and not as much of a money maker as touring.

in fact i know a lot of dj's that only play some of their good stuff live and never release it because they just wouldnt make money on it due to downloads.

Original post by Truths

Wuuut? The song is written and sang from a males perspective? How is marketed towards woman when it puts them in a negative light. Maybe you can argue that Trey Songz is marketed towards women because he sings about love, sex and romance. But Chris has both genders in his fan base.


so your saying chris brown is marketed towards men? seriously?

Original post by Truths

Hip Hop?



I went to see marilyn manson in birmingham. a very ethnically mixed city. other than security. i didnt see 1 black person there. there was also hardly any women.

at heavy metal concerts you will find hardly any women or ethnic minorities.

hip hop concerts are predominantly women. or a mixed audience of black and white/other.

im yet to see a comparable scene.
Original post by Truths
Stopped reading from there.




funny gifs

wasnt writing it for you to read though, i was talking to theanusfiles. but glad you noticed.

and i also wrote it before your quality of discussion plummeted.
Original post by Mick.w
well the us is her biggest market but 10% of the us is black. so most of that us audience will be white.


Not necessarily. You have no evidence to back up that conclusion. Interchange Beyoncé with Brandy, Fantasia or any other female R&B act and you will understand why that logic is a failure.

Original post by Mick.w
white people still listen to urban radio. your own experiences back up my point.


White people are a minority audience when it comes to Urban radio, and black people are the vast majority. Hence if Beyoncé sends certain songs only to Urban radio, it is clear who she is marketing herself too...

Original post by Mick.w
album sales are not very high and not as much of a money maker as touring.


And this is relevant because?

Original post by Mick.w
so your saying chris brown is marketed towards men? seriously?


Well yeh duh. Especially with lyrics like these:

Just got rich
Took a broke ***** bitch
I can make a broke bitch rich
But I don't **** with broke bitches

Got a white girl with some fake titties
I took her to Dubai with me



They are clearly not gender neutral. This is a song for guys to sing. In fact I hear DJ's constantly announcing "This ones for the fellas" before the song comes up.

Original post by Mick.w
hip hop concerts are predominantly women.

im yet to see a comparable scene.


It's kinda common sense that audiences for gigs vary depending on location. They are not a true reflections of the overall fanbase. Show me a thread on any hip hop forum of your choice that has more female posters than male. I'll be waiting. But in the meantime, lets take a stroll through my gallery.

Exibit A: Wiz Khalifa Concert

Spoiler



Exibit B: Kendrick Concert

Spoiler


Exibit C: J cole Gig

Spoiler


I rest my case, gently. Goodnight.

(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by Truths
Not necessarily. You have no evidence to back up that conclusion. Interchange Beyoncé with Brandy, Fantasia or any other female R&B act and you will understand why that logic is a failure.

and you have no evidence to back up that american sales = black sales. which was your point.

Original post by Truths

White people are a minority audience when it comes to Urban radio, and black people are the vast majority. Hence if Beyoncé sends certain songs only to Urban radio, it is clear who she is marketing herself too...

and what proof do you have of that? exhibit what?

Original post by Truths

And this is relevant because?


well if your going to use sales as evidence of demographics you have to take spending trends as a contributing factor. most youngsters download their music for free. album sales will be in favour of people with disposable incomes and probably of a less internet savvy age group.

Original post by Truths

Well yeh duh. Especially with lyrics like these:

Just got rich
Took a broke ***** bitch
I can make a broke bitch rich
But I don't **** with broke bitches

Got a white girl with some fake titties
I took her to Dubai with me




chris brown has always been marketed towards women. post rihanna he tried to open back to a male audience. however his new look is as a bad boy rnb singer. much like drake or the weeknd. notice that even when chris brown had beaten rihanna there were droves of women demonstrating support for him. he is a poster boy for girls. even boondocks satired this. its quite obvious he's marketed towards girls despite his negative outlook towards women.

Original post by Truths

They are clearly not gender neutral. This is a song for guys to sing. In fact I hear DJ's constantly announcing "This ones for the fellas" before the song comes up.


yes they could also play kelis my milk shake brings all the boys to the yard and say its for the fellas too.

kings of leon - use somebody was a song intended for "the fellas" on the surface. but really it was for the girls. because it was meant to reel in soft hearted female audiences. it was their initial release of their new look which was sexier for the girls as they went away from the hill billy looking git up from earlier in their career.

Original post by Truths

It's kinda common sense that audiences for gigs vary depending on location. They are not a true reflections of the overall fanbase. Show me a thread on any hip hop forum of your choice that has more female posters than male. I'll be waiting. But in the meantime, lets take a stroll through my gallery.

Exibit A: Wiz Khalifa Concert

Spoiler



Exibit B: Kendrick Concert

Spoiler


Exibit C: J cole Gig

Spoiler


I rest my case, gently. Goodnight.



i never said fanbase. i said scene. theres a difference.

also online forums are very different spaces to music scenes.

house music is intended for girls. its for club culture. club culture brings in girls 1st as guys will follow the girls. yet the same girls that turn up clubbing would never go on a house music forum.

also. im sure you looked long and hard for those pics to make your point. as i just googled those artists names and had to troll through to find those pics.

not only that. but these "heavy hitting" exhibits you have show numerous pockets of women and non blacks.

now considering you went out your way to find the ultra male ultra black pics. its pretty poor.

as i said. there is no equivalent to white men and heavy metal

EDIT: also y do you always use female gifs to illustrate yourself?
(edited 9 years ago)
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Avatar for ApeMob
ApeMob
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Original post by ChickenMadness
You look pretty hot in your avi too tbh. And ye I know there are other factors as well but a lot of the propaganda is just biased and negatively affects men. Most of it is probably unintentional though. Like 'don't be that guy'.

But there are areas where men just have no rights compared to women that aren't going to be fixed any time soon because of big feminist organisations that would oppose it. For example, a woman can get pregnant and pretty much put any man's name down as the father. And even though that man isn't the biological father he'l still have to pay child support for the next 18 years.


Lol thanks but there's always DNA tests:s-smilie:. I don't any man who will accept responsibility without that information. In the end what seems to be favoritism for women is really just reparations for a time when women truly were subjugated.
Original post by ApeMob
Lol thanks but there's always DNA tests:s-smilie:. I don't any man who will accept responsibility without that information. In the end what seems to be favoritism for women is really just reparations for a time when women truly were subjugated.


yes nice avi. im a fan of the jersey shore look.

women are not entitled to reparations for just being women. and legal discrimination is not a reparative.

in america men have to prove that they are not the father. they are guilty till proven innocent. for the father to get a dna test he must first have custody of the child. women can easily stop this. if the father has custody of the child he will have to pay for the dna test.

also many men cannot pay for legal aid to fight for their case in court. the courts predisposition is bias towards women. unless the man has money and time. and even then.

if you think your son deserves to go to prison because he lost his job and cannot keep up child payments then i think your an awful mother and should not be allowed to be the chaperone of children.

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