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When human shields are used, who is more guilty... Watch

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    Those who deliberately put innocents in the line of fire, or those who callously ignore them.

    It is a common tactic used by terrorists and insurgents throughout the world today. Launch an attack from a school or a religious center and then cry foul to the international community when the opposing side retaliates. It has proven to be a very effective method of defeating a enemy of superior military strength.

    What we so often fail to ask in our collective indignation at these atrocities, is whose actions are more appalling. Those who intentionally endanger innocent lives, in order to capitalize on their deaths through the stage of international opinion, or those who refuse to exercise restraint, in the face of a tactic designed to exploit that very restraint.

    Which of the two groups actually desires the largest toll of innocent casualties?
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    (Original post by ckingalt)
    Those who deliberately put innocents in the line of fire, or those who callously ignore them.

    It is a common tactic used by terrorists and insurgents throughout the world today. Launch an attack from a school or a religious center and then cry foul to the international community when the opposing side retaliates. It has proven to be a very effective method of defeating a enemy of superior military strength.

    What we so often fail to ask in our collective indignation at these atrocities, is whose actions are more appalling. Those who intentionally endanger innocent lives, in order to capitalize on their deaths through the stage of international opinion, or those who refuse to exercise restraint, in the face of a tactic designed to exploit that very restraint.

    Which of the two groups actually desires the largest toll of innocent casualties?
    My assumption is that you're mainly talking about Israel v Gaza here.

    Ultimately the primary and most justifiable reason for military aggression should be to protect your own people. Israel is doing this. Hamas is doing the opposite.

    You try telling the families of those killed in Gaza which they would prefer. To stop being bombed, or to have bleeding-heart liberals in the West feeling sorry for them. Needless to say, they will choose the former.

    Unfortunately, Hamas repeatedly choose the latter, and are thus directly responsible for the deaths of their own people.
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    (Original post by ckingalt)
    Those who deliberately put innocents in the line of fire, or those who callously ignore them.
    those who deliberately put innocents in the line of fire. hands down.
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    Yep, "deliberately put innocents in the line of fire" has always been the most effective strategy. But I believe it's a coward way of fighting what they are fighting for. I hope they all find peace, after all.


    (Original post by ckingalt)
    Those who deliberately put innocents in the line of fire, or those who callously ignore them.

    It is a common tactic used by terrorists and insurgents throughout the world today. Launch an attack from a school or a religious center and then cry foul to the international community when the opposing side retaliates. It has proven to be a very effective method of defeating a enemy of superior military strength.

    What we so often fail to ask in our collective indignation at these atrocities, is whose actions are more appalling. Those who intentionally endanger innocent lives, in order to capitalize on their deaths through the stage of international opinion, or those who refuse to exercise restraint, in the face of a tactic designed to exploit that very restraint.

    Which of the two groups actually desires the largest toll of innocent casualties?
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    It has to be the side which uses human shields and human hostages by a country mile. The other side can't exactly back off, as that could result in the death of the hostages anyway, so it's not really their fault that they aren't 'exercising restraint'.
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    They're guilty of different things. One side is guilty of risking innocent lives, and the other is guilty of actually ending them. Personally, I find the latter more reprehensible in isolation, but there are always more factors to consider when considering which side is 'worse' in the broader sense.

    In the Israel/Gaza situation, it is fairly clear that neither side gives much of a damn about the Palestinian people. Both sides are fighting for ideologies.
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    Can one split them, on any objective or other measure?
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    Tired of saying this but if you were referring to the gaza / israel conflict the un has found no evidence of hamas using human shields

    And to answer your questions i think both are bad but the ones using human shields are worse

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    (Original post by #Ridwan)
    My assumption is that you're mainly talking about Israel v Gaza here.

    Ultimately the primary and most justifiable reason for military aggression should be to protect your own people. Israel is doing this. Hamas is doing the opposite.

    You try telling the families of those killed in Gaza which they would prefer. To stop being bombed, or to have bleeding-heart liberals in the West feeling sorry for them. Needless to say, they will choose the former.

    Unfortunately, Hamas repeatedly choose the latter, and are thus directly responsible for the deaths of their own people.
    Hear hear. They don't even try to keep their weapons and military targets away from 'their' people.
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    If Israel do nothing, Hamas will fire rocket after rocket. Hamas are the true evil while Israel is protecting themselves. We should thank them as they are wiping out an extensive terrorist network within Gaza.
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    This has happened alot on the region on a whole, tactics to attack the enemy and then attempt to hide within a population of innocents.

    If i was an innocent I would run away if i knew there were Hamas fighters in the area, no matter what happens Israel would value the lives of its citizens far higher than the lives of its enemies (Every country would), so the whole blending in thing usually results in more than the necessary amount of people being blown away.
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    (Original post by MASTER265)
    If Israel do nothing, Hamas will fire rocket after rocket. Hamas are the true evil while Israel is protecting themselves. We should thank them as they are wiping out an extensive terrorist network within Gaza.

    I find it strange how people can defend Gaza when most of them are terrorists or potential terrorists.
    It is possible for both sides in a conflict to be evil.
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    (Original post by TurboCretin)
    It is possible for both sides in a conflict to be evil.
    Hamas and Palestinian propaganda speaks of mass genocide and cleansing of Israel and it's non-Muslim population. Then you have Israel who have made it clear if the rockets stop and terrorist threat is removed they will remove all military intervention and live in peace. All Hamas want is to wipe Israel and the Jewish ideology of the face of the earth. I know who I would choose to be the innocents. Just because they respond like a lion does not make them the evil. Palestine messed with the lion and are paying the consequences.
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    (Original post by MASTER265)
    If Israel do nothing, Hamas will fire rocket after rocket. Hamas are the true evil while Israel is protecting themselves. We should thank them as they are wiping out an extensive terrorist network within Gaza.

    I find it strange how people can defend Gaza when most of them are terrorists or potential terrorists.
    good goy
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    (Original post by MASTER265)
    Israeli leaders dream of mass genocide and cleansing of Palestine and it's non-Jewish population. Then you have Palestine who have suffered unbelievable civilian casualties and yet Israel continues to indiscriminately bomb residential areas. All Israel want is to wipe Palestine and its people off the face of the earth. I know who I would choose to be the innocents. Just because they are led by a bunch of zealots does not make them evil. Hamas messed with a better armed bunch of zealots and are paying the consequences.
    Fixed for you.

    It is so easy to make things sound so black and white. The fact of the matter is that Israel is committing crimes against humanity, and has been doing so for the last 70 years. The actions/existence of Hamas in Gaza is the excuse, not the reason. Israel's behaviour predates Hamas coming into power by decades.
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    (Original post by TurboCretin)
    Fixed for you.

    It is so easy to make things sound so black and white. The fact of the matter is that Israel is committing crimes against humanity, and has been doing so for the last 70 years. The actions/existence of Hamas in Gaza is the excuse, not the reason. Israel's behaviour predates Hamas coming into power by decades.
    Ha funny, keep defending the terrorists but don't complain when they hit you at home. All these idiots want to do is destroy the west
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    (Original post by MASTER265)
    Ha funny, keep defending the terrorists but don't complain when they hit you at home. All these idiots want to do is destroy the west
    Please point out where I defended terrorists. I said both sides are in the wrong.
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    (Original post by TurboCretin)
    Please point out where I defended terrorists. I said both sides are in the wrong.
    You defended them when you put down the actions of Israel. The only way to prevent a devastating terrorist attack from Hamas is to eradicate them by any means possible. Hamas will keep firing rockets whether Israel pullout or continue their efforts, plus they have been building tunnels for months/years so they were always planning attack. They won't stop until Israel are flattened to the ground so tell me what do you expect Israel to do, sit and await oblivion or defend themselves?
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    [QUOTE=ihateusernames;48725277]Tired of saying this but if you were referring to the gaza / israel conflict the un has found no evidence of hamas using human shields

    And to answer your questions i think both are bad but the ones using human shields are worse

    Posted from TSR Mobile[/QUOTE

    Dont havea link sorry, but Stephen Sackur was on the bbc interviewing the head of hamas tonight and was reading to him, word for word from a statement by the un, from staff on the ground, saying how furious they were with hamas for the way they were cynically siting rocket launchers in the grounds of hospitals and schools.
    It was summed up well at the weekend when it was said that the difference between them is that Israel use their rockets to defend their people whereas hamas use their people to defend their rockets.
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    (Original post by MASTER265)
    You defended them when you put down the actions of Israel. The only way to prevent a devastating terrorist attack from Hamas is to eradicate them by any means possible. Hamas will keep firing rockets whether Israel pullout or continue their efforts, plus they have been building tunnels for months/years so they were always planning attack. They won't stop until Israel are flattened to the ground so tell me what do you expect Israel to do, sit and await oblivion or defend themselves?
    Okay, just to clear up this point about Israel protecting itself from rocket attacks: they have arguably the most advanced, most effective missile interception system the world has ever seen. This system is far more effective at preventing specific attacks on Israel than firing rockets into Gaza will ever be, and it does so at zero cost of life to Palestinian civilians. Why, then, does Israel need so desperately to flatten entire districts of Gaza in 'defending itself', and indiscriminately killing hundreds of Palestinians in the process?

    The existence of Hamas in Gaza is simply a convenient excuse for Israel to commit war crimes. I'm not picking sides - I'm not condoning Hamas at all - but you seem set on defending the indefensible here.
 
 
 
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