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    Is it just me, or did he start condemming Israels assasination of Hamas leaders saying Israel should negotiate with Hamas and that they have no right to kill these militants, only months after he defended the British participation in the war in Iraq, said it was a giod thing that both Saddam Huseins sons had been killed, and stating that one should absolutely not negotiate withal-qaida because they are terrorists and that it would be the latest thing to considder? I honestly find it quite remarkabel that the media has not commented this...
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    (Original post by Jonatan)
    Is it just me, or did he start condemming Israels assasination of Hamas leaders saying Israel should negotiate with Hamas and that they have no right to kill these militants, only months after he defended the British participation in the war in Iraq, said it was a giod thing that both Saddam Huseins sons had been killed, and stating that one should absolutely not negotiate withal-qaida because they are terrorists and that it would be the latest thing to considder? I honestly find it quite remarkabel that the media has not commented this...
    Did he say that? That "Israel should negotiate with Hamas" When?
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    I think he said that they should negotiate with palistinians generally. What isreal is doing is bad and he is allowed to his oppinion I wouldn't say he was a hypocrite I mean someone should be telling the public that what isreal is doing is wronge. Politicians are a bit hypocritical and I mean all of the them especially cirtain members of a party who I hate but I won't get into that. Jack straw seems to me at least to be a genuin man and I think he is doing a good thing by speaking up on this issue.
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    (Original post by randdom)
    I think he said that they should negotiate with palistinians generally. What isreal is doing is bad and he is allowed to his oppinion I wouldn't say he was a hypocrite I mean someone should be telling the public that what isreal is doing is wronge. Politicians are a bit hypocritical and I mean all of the them especially cirtain members of a party who I hate but I won't get into that. Jack straw seems to me at least to be a genuin man and I think he is doing a good thing by speaking up on this issue.
    Well urging a negotiated settlement with Palestine isn't the same as urging negotiation with Hamas.
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    (Original post by Howard)
    Well urging a negotiated settlement with Palestine isn't the same as urging negotiation with Hamas.
    In practice it is, because he denies the Israelis to deal with Hamas through military means and sais they should negotiate with the palestinians instead. Also, when Arafat is seriously evaluating to let Hamas into the palestinian governing body then this is in practice what it means.
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    (Original post by randdom)
    I think he said that they should negotiate with palistinians generally. What isreal is doing is bad and he is allowed to his oppinion I wouldn't say he was a hypocrite I mean someone should be telling the public that what isreal is doing is wronge. Politicians are a bit hypocritical and I mean all of the them especially cirtain members of a party who I hate but I won't get into that. Jack straw seems to me at least to be a genuin man and I think he is doing a good thing by speaking up on this issue.
    But clearly, if Israeli action against Hamas is wrong, then so is the British and american action against Al-qaida. Both groups has been clearly identified as terrorist groups by the british government, so why is it unnacceptable when Israel strikes against Hamas, but it is perfectly Justifiable by Britain to strike against al-Qaida ?
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    (Original post by Jonatan)
    But clearly, if Israeli action against Hamas is wrong, then so is the British and american action against Al-qaida. Both groups has been clearly identified as terrorist groups by the british government, so why is it unnacceptable when Israel strikes against Hamas, but it is perfectly Justifiable by Britain to strike against al-Qaida ?
    IMO it's MORE justifiable for Israel to strike Hamas than for the UK to strike Al Queda. Israel suffers attacks from Hamas almost daily. The UK has yet to suffer an attack by Al-Queda.
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    (Original post by Jonatan)
    In practice it is, because he denies the Israelis to deal with Hamas through military means and sais they should negotiate with the palestinians instead. Also, when Arafat is seriously evaluating to let Hamas into the palestinian governing body then this is in practice what it means.
    I disagree. Staw isn't denying the right of the Israeli's to deal with Hamas through military means. He's simply saying that a negotiated settlement between Israel and Palestine is preferable to continual attack and counter attack. Sounds reasonable.

    Is Arafat "seriously evaluating to let Hamas into the palestinian governing body"? Where does that come from?
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    Of course; but not as big an hypocrisy as his denial of the right of Palestinians to deal with the occupiers by militant means.
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    (Original post by llama boy)
    Of course; but not as big an hypocrisy as his denial of the right of Palestinians to deal with the occupiers by militant means.
    But there is a difference between atacking Israely military targets and the civilian population. Palestinian mmilitants typically target Cafeterias , Schools or buses. Atacks against Israeli soldiers or governmental institutions had been one thing, but targeting civilians is not a right they have.
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    (Original post by Jonatan)
    But there is a difference between atacking Israely military targets and the civilian population. Palestinian mmilitants typically target Cafeterias , Schools or buses. Atacks against Israeli soldiers or governmental institutions had been one thing, but targeting civilians is not a right they have.
    Don't the Israeli's attack Palestinian civilian targets?
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    (Original post by Howard)
    Don't the Israeli's attack Palestinian civilian targets?
    Palestinian civilians are damaged by Israeli atacks, and often killed, but contrary to the Hamas Israel doesnt deliberately target these people. Most of them are caught in crossfire between the IDF and Hamas. True, you could argue that Israel is responsible for tehse deaths since they occur when Israel atack palestinians militants, but it is still not equivalent to blowing up spike bombs in public places with the purpose of killing as many civilians as possible.
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    (Original post by Jonatan)
    Palestinian civilians are damaged by Israeli atacks, and often killed, but contrary to the Hamas Israel doesnt deliberately target these people. Most of them are caught in crossfire between the IDF and Hamas. True, you could argue that Israel is responsible for tehse deaths since they occur when Israel atack palestinians militants, but it is still not equivalent to blowing up spike bombs in public places with the purpose of killing as many civilians as possible.
    But what puzzles me is why so many more Palestinian children get killed than Israeli children despite (as you would suggest) Hamas actually trying to kill Israeli children and Isreal actually trying not to kill Palestinian children. By a factor of ten!!

    Either the Israeli army is comprized entirelgy of blind snipers they are a little less worried about who they hit than you'd like to think.
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    (Original post by Howard)
    But what puzzles me is why so many more Palestinian children get killed than Israeli children despite (as you would suggest) Hamas actually trying to kill Israeli children and Isreal actually trying not to kill Palestinian children. By a factor of ten!!

    Either the Israeli army is comprized entirelgy of blind snipers they are a little less worried about who they hit than you'd like to think.
    well, there are two reasons why more palestinian civilians are killed than Israeli.

    1: Israel does its best to protect Israeli civilians from palestinian militants.

    2: Palestinian militants deliberately position themselves in the midst of as many civilians as possible, knowing that Israel will receive criticism when civilians are hurt during Israeli atempts to target palestinian militants.

    I think the latest statistics show that about 95% of all suecide atacks are foiled or prevented by Israeli inteligence or border checks. Thus the number of Israeli civilians hurt would be far higher than the numbers of palestinians hurt had Israel not been able to catch such a large number of the suecide bombers before they sucessfully reached their targets.
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    Jack Straw a hypocrite?!? The famous radical anti-capitalist Leeds student and NUS President who is now a spineless yes-man in a right-wing 'Labour' government? I cant imagine why anyone in New Labour could be described as a hypocrite(!)

    PS: 'spineless yes-man' is interchangable with politician.
 
 
 
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