Hey there! Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free
x Turn on thread page Beta
    • #1
    • Thread Starter
    #1

    I don't agree with Feminism, because of the NAME, NOT what it wants to try and accomplish. I find that it's a way some women, who simply hate or have something against men, use to cower behind whenever anything "bad" is mentioned involving women.

    There is an OBVIOUS barrier between men and women, even in the 21rst century, but I think we need to take a look at it as whole, not as a closed picture. If we could all just take a step back and fix it TOGETHER, the world would be a better place.

    Forcing people to do something is not going to work... like forcing a child to eat broccoli. If they don't like it they won't eat it, end of. If you tell them how good it is for them, they'll try it and end up eating it for the rest of their lives.

    If you try forcing a Muslim to treat his woman with more "Western" respect... to let her do this things from having a job to driving a car... it AIN'T going to happen because they'll think like you're attacking their religion above all.

    If you tell them how good it is to live side by side, in equality, then maybe, just maybe they'll start to see the bigger picture.

    Am I sexist? Do I really see women as a inferiors? Do I really think that "Women should belong in the kitchen?" ... or "Women should pay attention to what they wear, then they wouldn't get raped?" ...

    My GF certainly thinks I am.. that I can't accept that women have it bad... but isn't that gender bias? isn't THAT the root of sexism itself?
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    Why would you disagree with feminism because of it's name? Because it 'fem' in it? My honest reaction to this is that you should evaluate why you feel this way over a word. Every important and influence space in the world, business, politics, academia, is dominated by men, and a space in which male voices and achievements are validated above women's. Why does the fact that women have this one space that is dedicated to prioritising their needs and voices bother you so much?

    I think that every movement has it's bad seeds - I'm actively involved in feminism, and I'm not going to lie to you about the fact that a small, unbelievably tiny minority of women in feminism aren't very nice people. Just like in every group and movement there are not nice people. Why do you base your entire judgement of a political movement, which, in my opinion, is mainly striving to end sexual violence, intimate partner murder and abuse and improve sexual and maternal health above all things, on some women who maybe aren't a fan of men.

    I also ask you to consider that women who do hate men, whilst wrong, discriminatory and prejudice, more often than not have suffered sexual violence and had terrible experience. Hatred of men is a learned reaction to a bad environment, whereas hatred of women is the default state.

    If you really can't accept that women are in a worse position than men, as you're girlfriend rightly tells you, then I do believe that you are sexist. It's not gender bias to realise this fact - it's the reality for half of the world's population.

    Anyway, I hope I helped you to understand what feminism actually is, as opposed to what you think it is. Don't worry, many people hold this misconceptions and with a little research they're easy enough dispelled. You just have to open your eyes to what's going on around you.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    i think you need to understand feminism better, it's not just about women, it's for everyone, go on tumblr
    Offline

    8
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by moecandy)
    i think you need to understand feminism better, it's not just about women, it's for everyone, go on tumblr
    If you want him to like feminism then that's a bad idea.
    Offline

    13
    ReputationRep:
    I'm sorry? A Muslim woman getting a job or driving a car isn't a "western" thing. Believe it or not, there are many Muslim countries where women drive and, gasp, have jobs.
    Offline

    12
    ReputationRep:
    First of all, a lot of the things you've mentioned about the Muslims as your example, are NOT rooted from their religion, but a rather male-dominated culture. It's all very cultural, because if you talk to a misogynistic 'Muslim' man and tell him to show you the verse in the Quran where it says women can't drive/have a job, he won't be able to show you one.

    Secondly, you mention misandrists, which, judging by the true definition of feminism, are not true feminists, no matter what they call themselves.

    You can't disagree with feminism just because of its name and reputation because it's sort of irrelevant to its original definition or aims. Like, it's a weak reasoning tbh
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    You might TOTALLY be sexist. You could be the most biased person ever–but from what youre saying, how I interpreted it anyway, you dont really sound sexist. *shields self from complete flaming*


    Posted from TSR Mobile
    Offline

    7
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by wotchergrace)
    Every important and influence space in the world, business, politics, academia, is dominated by men, and a space in which male voices and achievements are validated above women's.
    Stop reading here. Nice how you females get your tits out when you want a promotion, or dress up in tightest clothing to get beta's to give you a helping hand.

    Women love to say how "media is it putting pressure on women to look a certain way". Men have it much worse, we need to lift for years only to find out that a physique that women actually mires requires celltech. 10% of gym goers are on gear, that is something women will never be able to do. Women eating a little less to shed those pounds? No way, blame the media for pressuring them to look slightly fit. I would trade in being a female any day, i would be the most HNG female there is. Hardly any GOOD LOOKING AND FIT FEMALES ARE MAKING OVER £30K PER YEAR AT 25.
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    It isn't the place of Muslim men to give "their" women rights. Those women already have those rights - many men (and many women) seek to ensure they can't exercise them.

    I completely agree that the word "feminism" causes way more problems than not in the first world nowadays, and I would be totally on board with a shift to gender egalitarianism, but I personally am not misled by the current word, so I can look past it. There is certainly a lot of bull**** (and tumblr is certainly not the place to avoid it).
    Offline

    14
    ReputationRep:
    I do think a more gender neutral term than "feminism" would be better as there are men AND women who misinterpret the word & believe it means "female supremacists".
    • #1
    • Thread Starter
    #1

    (Original post by moecandy)
    i think you need to understand feminism better, it's not just about women, it's for everyone, go on tumblr

    If it's "not just for women", what's the big deal about calling it Humanism?
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    For F sake, let me explain:

    " What is feminism to you, anon? What’s its end goal? Who does it prioritize? Is it empowerment or liberation? Is it individualistic or collective? What sort of a world do you envision in your ultimate feminist utopia?

    Look, I’m sorry to break it to you, but women produce 60% of this world’s labor, while owning 10% of the fluid capital and 1% of all purchasable land. Are there racial, geographical and historical nuances that go into this? Absolutely. But the gendered lines of exploitation are very clearly delineated. Let me explain this to you. This positioning you speak of that men occupy, which you seek to be “equal” to does not exist without endorsing capitalistic violence and cannibalizing other human beings, robbing them of their autonomy and security. Men did this to women and that’s how men have been able to bolster a culture that thrives from the degradation of women.
    The term equality is shallow. It means nothing essentially. Equal in terms of what? Talent? Capital? Creativity? Skills? Social positioning? In all ways? How can we be equal in talent or skills or creativity when our brains and wiring of our bodies aren’t the same? How can we be equal in capital when many people around the world haven’t even been completely indoctrinated into western globalization and their revenue exists in agriculture, herding, clothes weaving and pastoral farming? The world is an immensely complex place that hosts a countless amount of people and ways of living. What informs us and our lifestyles are a vast array of factors, such as climate, religion, race, class and history. I’m trying to understand how equality can give birth to anything but uniformity, which is wholly counterintuitive to the end goal of all liberation politics.
    Equality is a euphemism for assimilation. Instead, shouldn’t we strive for a world that destroys all innately oppressive structures and titles? Do you wanna know what kind of women are regularly heralded as being equals to their male counterparts? Hillary Clinton. Condoleezza Rice. Female US and IDF soldiers. How many infographs have you seen that portray essentially oppressive characters as “breaking boundaries” and shaking up the core (of what, I don’t know)? When in reality they aren’t dismantling structures, they’re just providing a facelift to it. Neoliberal feminism has created a society in which women such as Hillary Clinton, who are unabashedly anti immigration, pro Israel and have a familial legacy of violence are given more airtime and praise than revolutionary women who remain exiled, such an Assata Shakur. The former desires to be one in the same as her male cohorts, while the other continuously critiques the structure of male supremacy. Definitely not a coincidence.
    Feminism, at its very core, is a liberation ideology that intimately engages with the harmfulness of masculinity/femininity as traits coerced upon children, teens and adults, how gendered injustices come into fruition through social, academic, economical and labor institutions and how we can create a world which upheaves patriarchy as a global phenomenon. The fact that equality (more clearly understood as assimilation) and a society in which women exploit men are the two only foreseeable options to you is troubling, to say the least and sounds like an iteration of patriarchy itself (either you join or you’re against us)."


    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    Sexist is a word invented by women to be used by women against men they don't like :rolleyes:
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    That's not sexist.
    Offline

    8
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by wotchergrace)
    I also ask you to consider that women who do hate men, whilst wrong, discriminatory and prejudice, more often than not have suffered sexual violence and had terrible experience. Hatred of men is a learned reaction to a bad environment, whereas hatred of women is the default state.

    If you really can't accept that women are in a worse position than men, as you're girlfriend rightly tells you, then I do believe that you are sexist. It's not gender bias to realise this fact - it's the reality for half of the world's population.
    Is there any evidence to support that? I'm sorry, but you are defending bigotry. I've heard racists say the same thing "we only think this way because of how Asians have acted". I think it's normally rubbish, people have their prejudices, then you only look at things that happen that back them up. I'm sure most misandrists can point to examples where men have treated them badly, but then humans often treat each other badly. Female on female bullying can be brutal, but they'll ignore times women are dicks, or men are kind.

    I support feminism, but I don't like this idea that it should be a competition between who has it worse. It totally depends. Women are more likely to suffer sexual violence, have lower pay, lower career opportunities and be domestically abused. Men are more likely to suffer physical violence, be denied access to their children, die, be given harsher prison sentences. Which is worse? Totally depends on your priorities in life, especially career (better to be a man) versus family (better to be a woman).

    I think men would generally be a lot more receptive to feminism if playing down the importance of men's issues wasn't so common.

    (Original post by idontevenbeth)
    Equality is a euphemism for assimilation. Instead, shouldn’t we strive for a world that destroys all innately oppressive structures and titles? Do you wanna know what kind of women are regularly heralded as being equals to their male counterparts? Hillary Clinton. Condoleezza Rice. Female US and IDF soldiers. How many infographs have you seen that portray essentially oppressive characters as “breaking boundaries” and shaking up the core (of what, I don’t know)? When in reality they aren’t dismantling structures, they’re just providing a facelift to it. Neoliberal feminism has created a society in which women such as Hillary Clinton, who are unabashedly anti immigration, pro Israel and have a familial legacy of violence are given more airtime and praise than revolutionary women who remain exiled, such an Assata Shakur. The former desires to be one in the same as her male cohorts, while the other continuously critiques the structure of male supremacy. Definitely not a coincidence.
    This is awful, exclusivist feminism. I don't support Israel, but you do not have to be anti-Israel to be a feminist. People do not have to follow your politics to be a feminist. By the way, the fact you couldn't use a non-American example (Thatcher would have been the most obvious) betrays the fact that your apparant enlightened world view doesn't extend to a basic knowledge of other countries politics. It should be obvious why it's good to have women in leadership or traditionally male only positions, and you attacking them only hurts your own cause.

    The idea that war and violence are "male things" is very debateable, and arguably sexist. We know from the horrors of Bloody Mary that female leadership does not stop vicious murder, and there's plenty of examples of brutal women leaders in history, seen postively like Boudicia or negatively like Ranavona the First.
    • #1
    • Thread Starter
    #1

    (Original post by Mankytoes)
    Is there any evidence to support that? I'm sorry, but you are defending bigotry. I've heard racists say the same thing "we only think this way because of how Asians have acted". I think it's normally rubbish, people have their prejudices, then you only look at things that happen that back them up. I'm sure most misandrists can point to examples where men have treated them badly, but then humans often treat each other badly. Female on female bullying can be brutal, but they'll ignore times women are dicks, or men are kind.

    I support feminism, but I don't like this idea that it should be a competition between who has it worse. It totally depends. Women are more likely to suffer sexual violence, have lower pay, lower career opportunities and be domestically abused. Men are more likely to suffer physical violence, be denied access to their children, die, be given harsher prison sentences. Which is worse? Totally depends on your priorities in life, especially career (better to be a man) versus family (better to be a woman).

    I think men would generally be a lot more receptive to feminism if playing down the importance of men's issues wasn't so common.

    Agreed.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Anonymous)
    If it's "not just for women", what's the big deal about calling it Humanism?
    dont ask me, i didnt name it!
    • #1
    • Thread Starter
    #1

    (Original post by SophiaLDN)
    I'm sorry? A Muslim woman getting a job or driving a car isn't a "western" thing. Believe it or not, there are many Muslim countries where women drive and, gasp, have jobs.
    Oh but the grand majority don't ... and that's what feminism wants, isn't it? that ALL women can get a job *gasp*
 
 
 
Reply
Submit reply
Turn on thread page Beta
TSR Support Team

We have a brilliant team of more than 60 Support Team members looking after discussions on The Student Room, helping to make it a fun, safe and useful place to hang out.

Updated: August 19, 2014
Poll
Are you going to a festival?

The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

Write a reply...
Reply
Hide
Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.