The Student Room Group

It's murder ever justified?

do you think that murder can ever be jusified. a friend of mine said that if some murdered someone but was a schizophrenic he would feel sorry for that person, as it's not their fault.
also someone else said that if you were raised in an environment that promoted violence and turned into a murder they would forgive them Would you forgive them for murder.
it's their any case in which u think murder is jusified.

Scroll to see replies

Reply 1

Yes, in some circumstances, it can be justified, but these are very limited, and of course, are as a last resort.
But it is hard exactly to state which are and which aren't justifiable causes, and even in a background of violence, although there is some justification, it doesn't mean that it shouldn't also be brought with punishment.

But it depends if you mean is murder ever justified enough to be unpunishable by law, and again, i think in extreme circumstances, yes it can, but only when other lives are in danger if the act is not committed.

Reply 2

Iluvatar
Yes, in some circumstances, it can be justified, but these are very limited, and of course, are as a last resort.
But it is hard exactly to state which are and which aren't justifiable causes, and even in a background of violence, although there is some justification, it doesn't mean that it shouldn't also be brought with punishment.

But it depends if you mean is murder ever justified enough to be unpunishable by law, and again, i think in extreme circumstances, yes it can, but only when other lives are in danger if the act is not committed.



It can never be justified. If it were justified that would mean that it was a sensible and correct course of action for the murderer to take.

Murder can be explained or sometimes excused (eg if it was done in self defense or as a result of a mental illness), but cannot be justified. The example of a person growing up in violent circumstances is no justification for taking a life. We are all in control of our own destinies, and can stop ourselves from murdering people if we choose. If a person has violent tendencies, he or she can seek help.

Reply 3

well do you think that (this is kinda about capitial punsihment) taking one's life means that you should take another person life. e.g. electric chair do you think that a murderer should be kill if they are caught or it's it to good for them. for many people life imprisonment is not really life it's not justice to them it os going soft.
Anyone seen dead man walking, should watch it it's kinda like the green mile and shows that taking the man life didn't really bring justice to anyone

Reply 4

Trousers
It can never be justified. If it were justified that would mean that it was a sensible and correct course of action for the murderer to take.

Murder can be explained or sometimes excused (eg if it was done in self defense or as a result of a mental illness), but cannot be justified. The example of a person growing up in violent circumstances is no justification for taking a life. We are all in control of our own destinies, and can stop ourselves from murdering people if we choose. If a person has violent tendencies, he or she can seek help.


I agree that making the difference between explaining and justifying is important. Sometimes, in the most extreme circumstances, murder can be more understandable than otherwise but at least currently I think that it's never really justified.

Reply 5

Ahollisan
well do you think that (this is kinda about capitial punsihment) taking one's life means that you should take another person life. e.g. electric chair do you think that a murderer should be kill if they are caught or it's it to good for them. for many people life imprisonment is not really life it's not justice to them it os going soft.
Anyone seen dead man walking, should watch it it's kinda like the green mile and shows that taking the man life didn't really bring justice to anyone


Its wierd. I was actually thinking about this myself this morning, for no particular reason...

If the person has a reason to kill (and i mean any actual reasoning, including stuff like race), then they should be imprisoned for life (of course, there are exceptions about life meaning life and stuff, but anyway).
If the crime has no reason, then it should be a death penalty, as there is no possibility for recovery.
A reasoned murder, no matter how bad the reason is, means that there is something to reform, some target.
If there is no target for reform, then there is no possibility for it, and i'm afraid that the conclusion that draws is some sort of death penalty.

Reply 6

Iluvatar
Its wierd. I was actually thinking about this myself this morning, for no particular reason...

If the person has a reason to kill (and i mean any actual reasoning, including stuff like race), then they should be imprisoned for life (of course, there are exceptions about life meaning life and stuff, but anyway).
If the crime has no reason, then it should be a death penalty, as there is no possibility for recovery.
A reasoned murder, no matter how bad the reason is, means that there is something to reform, some target.
If there is no target for reform, then there is no possibility for it, and i'm afraid that the conclusion that draws is some sort of death penalty.
Hmm.. as logical as that seems to be, it raises a few issues. Firstly, how do you define reason? Surely inevitably all actions have cause, which if originating from conscious processes constitutes as reason. Therefore (if it were possible) for someone to kill without reason would be highly improbably - they would have to lack consciousness making it very hard. Even if this were to happen - an unconscious person commiting murder, then I'd find it questionable to consider their termination appropriate punishment. I assume what you meant was 'viable reason' which then becomes entirely subjective.

As for the original question, I think you mean killing, not murder. Otherwise it becomes a question of the validity of the legal system (assuming justified things are legal). Killing can certainly be justified, at least legally in terms of war, self-defence, certain abortions etc.

Relating to actual murders though, I think murders can at least be understood - can't think of a case where it can't. Hence it has predisposing 'causes' which may constitute reason. However whether a reason is justifiable is entirely subjective. Whether people should be excused for factors beyond their control, such as poverty etc I think depends on what is considered the important function of the legal system. If punishment and deterrence are critical, then excusing wouldn't be favoured. However, for the sole purpose of rehabilitation - if 'excusing' helps reform (i.e. modifying sentence to accomodate individual requirements), then surely it is a valid principle.

Reply 7

rIcHrD
Hmm.. as logical as that seems to be, it raises a few issues. Firstly, how do you define reason? Surely inevitably all actions have cause, which if originating from conscious processes constitutes as reason. Therefore (if it were possible) for someone to kill without reason would be highly improbably - they would have to lack consciousness making it very hard. Even if this were to happen - an unconscious person commiting murder, then I'd find it questionable to consider their termination appropriate punishment. I assume what you meant was 'viable reason' which then becomes entirely subjective.

As for the original question, I think you mean killing, not murder. Otherwise it becomes a question of the validity of the legal system (assuming justified things are legal). Killing can certainly be justified, at least legally in terms of war, self-defence, certain abortions etc.

Relating to actual murders though, I think murders can at least be understood - can't think of a case where it can't. Hence it has predisposing 'causes' which may constitute reason. However whether a reason is justifiable is entirely subjective. Whether people should be excused for factors beyond their control, such as poverty etc I think depends on what is considered the important function of the legal system. If punishment and deterrence are critical, then excusing wouldn't be favoured. However, for the sole purpose of rehabilitation - if 'excusing' helps reform (i.e. modifying sentence to accomodate individual requirements), then surely it is a valid principle.


Reason, as in some sort of cause of their action against that person, i think is the best way to put it.
And i find it hard to see how an unconscious person could murder.

Reply 8

Iluvatar
Reason, as in some sort of cause of their action against that person, i think is the best way to put it.
And i find it hard to see how an unconscious person could murder.


But then everyone has a reason. The reason could be "she looked at me in a funny way", "he killed my brother", "he raped me" or "the voices in my head told me to kill her because she's tall". You have to draw the line somewhere.

Reply 9

Ahollisan
do you think that murder can ever be jusified. a friend of mine said that if some murdered someone but was a schizophrenic he would feel sorry for that person, as it's not their fault.
also someone else said that if you were raised in an environment that promoted violence and turned into a murder they would forgive them Would you forgive them for murder.
it's their any case in which u think murder is jusified.

Never!!!:mad: Murder means you intended to kill.

Reply 10

jyuk
Never!!!:mad: Murder means you intended to kill.


what if it was to save your life? What if someone was going to release a huge amount of toxic gases or something, that would kill hundreds of thousands, and you were the only one who could stop it?

Reply 11

PadFoot90
what if it was to save your life? What if someone was going to release a huge amount of toxic gases or something, that would kill hundreds of thousands, and you were the only one who could stop it?

Hmmmmmm, why did you have to ask that question.

Well of course I believe it is the right thing to do in that situation. Because in essence you would be promoting the murder of others if you didn't do anything about it.
Evil should be destroyed, so I guess you proved me wrong. Well I obviously didn't think hard enough.

Reply 12

Firstly you can be excused for homicide in some cases. For example the term crime of passion refers to how in a murder case somebody can plea that they killed the person because of a sudden anger or heartbrake i.e. they just saw their wife fecking some bloke, so he kills the bloke without the element of premeditation. His sentence would then be reduced to manslaughter.
There is the element of universiliasability which if it said that killing was ok it wouldn't work as everyone would kill each other.
However, if we look at the above situation via universilisability it would say that it was ok as "I will a world where you can kill somebody fecking your wife/girlfriend as long as it isn't predmeditated." because this would work. The same with saying it is ok to kill someone in self defence as this would work for the same reason.

Reply 13

Yes it can be justified, no matter how Liberals may try to brain wash the human race but what they don't realise is that Humans are primative and have basic instincts.
An eye for an eye is correct (no retorts of the one who wondered India in a nappy please)

Reply 14

lol, i am a liberal and i said that it can be justified.

Reply 15

I think in some extreme cases-such as shooting a person about to kill lots of people is is understandable, and I don;t think if everyone knew the circumstances you would be expected to serve a life-sentence for that.
However I don't agree with the idea of killing someone because they murdered someone. Essentially this would be murder again - where do you stop the cycle? You could say that "it's ok" as you were doing justice, but i'm sure the person who committed the crime in the first place thought they were doing justice.

Reply 16

jyuk
Never!!!:mad: Murder means you intended to kill.


But could it be understood if they'd killed someone close to you, or imagine having a child. I think if i had a kid, and anyone so much as harmed a hair on its head i'd go mental. So if someone that close to me was killed I would murder. Its the vengeance thing.

Reply 17

Ahollisan
do you think that murder can ever be jusified. a friend of mine said that if some murdered someone but was a schizophrenic he would feel sorry for that person, as it's not their fault.
also someone else said that if you were raised in an environment that promoted violence and turned into a murder they would forgive them Would you forgive them for murder.
it's their any case in which u think murder is jusified.
There is a lot of difference between it not being someone's fault they commit murder, someone being forgiven for committing murder and someone being justified in committing murder.
When someone is thought to be justified- either by a court or by society at large- in killing someone it isn't defined as murder. Murder is by definition an unjustified killing. There are various degrees of homicide and manslaughter between justified and unjustified killing.

Reply 18

Well here may be such an example you can think about http://lawwiki.bbcity.co.uk/wakka.php?wakka=RvDudleyAndStephens1884

Reply 19

If someone shot my mother (on purpose and in cold blood), and I shot them, I consider that justified. Vegnence killings like that are justified in my opinion.