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Father's educational achievements strongest indicator of childrens' academic success watch

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    (Original post by King of Evil)
    Excuse me?
    I'll admit I'm a scientist rather than a frequent essayist, but the long sentences, minimalist punctuation, awkward sentence structure and sheer wordiness meant I had to reread it a few times to work out what was being said.

    I still have no idea what this means:

    "I just acknowledge that more foolish people do unfortunately confuse themselves over what is clearly evident"
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    (Original post by llacerta)
    I wonder whether it is the father's educational achievements per se, or rather their attitude towards education, that is the best predictor.
    Or is this about mothers and whom they choose as partners?

    We are starting to leave the world where most parents of most students will have few if any qualifications. In 1975 19% of school leavers left school with no O level equivalent passes. You have 21% with 5 or more passes.

    From the late 1970s onwards the old apprenticeship system had broken down.

    There comes a point where there are relatively few "good catches" for husbands (the military, oilmen, building tradesmen) with no school qualifications to speak of.
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    (Original post by nulli tertius)
    Or is this about mothers and whom they choose as partners?

    We are starting to leave the world where most parents of most students will have few if any qualifications. In 1975 19% of school leavers left school with no O level equivalent passes. You have 21% with 5 or more passes.

    From the late 1970s onwards the old apprenticeship system had broken down.

    There comes a point where there are relatively few "good catches" for husbands (the military, oilmen, building tradesmen) with no school qualifications to speak of.
    Forgive me if I'm being dense, but I don't really understand what you're saying here.

    I get that you're saying that nowadays, fewer people leave school without any qualifications, and alongside the apprenticeship system breaking down, this led to an increase in the proportion of individuals going onto university etc. And then you say that there are fewer "good catches" (referring to jobs, I assume? And not wives?) for men with no qualifications. So in general, more and more men are going further in their education.

    But I still don't see how this relates to why educational achievement of the father predicts the child's academic success...More women were also getting such qualifications. Similarly, just because the sample demographic might have shifted doesn't mean that this would then necessarily predict academic success. Just because the proportion of those with few academic qualifications has decreased doesn't mean that there should therefore be a correlation between this and their child's academic success.
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    (Original post by llacerta)
    Forgive me if I'm being dense, but I don't really understand what you're saying here.

    I get that you're saying that nowadays, fewer people leave school without any qualifications, and alongside the apprenticeship system breaking down, this led to an increase in the proportion of individuals going onto university etc. And then you say that there are fewer "good catches" (referring to jobs, I assume? And not wives?) for men with no qualifications. So in general, more and more men are going further in their education.

    But I still don't see how this relates to why educational achievement of the father predicts the child's academic success...More women were also getting such qualifications. Similarly, just because the sample demographic might have shifted doesn't mean that this would then necessarily predict academic success. Just because the proportion of those with few academic qualifications has decreased doesn't mean that there should therefore be a correlation between this and their child's academic success.
    Generalising (and ignoring the changes in women's' economic power) female success has been measured in making a good marriage and raising a family that has more material success than the couple themselves enjoyed.

    In the past male success was tied to educational achievement for a much smaller number of men than it is today. As the key to male success has become more closely tied to educational achievement, women may have become more educationally selective in their choice of husbands (do you ask your boyfriends how many head of cattle they have or whether they are likely to make foreman at t'mill?) and more aggressively promote the educational success of their children (rather than say, in the case of girls, having them make a good match or in the case of boys encouraging them to join a good regiment, a good factory or the police force).

    As a result male educational success may correlate to but not be causative of children's' educational attainment.
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    (Original post by nulli tertius)
    Generalising (and ignoring the changes in women's' economic power) female success has been measured in making a good marriage and raising a family that has more material success than the couple themselves enjoyed.

    In the past male success was tied to educational achievement for a much smaller number of men than it is today. As the key to male success has become more closely tied to educational achievement, women may have become more educationally selective in their choice of husbands (do you ask your boyfriends how many head of cattle they have or whether they are likely to make foreman at t'mill?) and more aggressively promote the educational success of their children (rather than say, in the case of girls, having them make a good match or in the case of boys encouraging them to join a good regiment, a good factory or the police force).

    As a result male educational success may correlate to but not be causative of children's' educational attainment.
    Ah, okay, I see what you're saying now, makes sense.

    Although the first question I ask on a date is always "are you likely to make foreman at t'mill?"
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    (Original post by iloveteddy14)
    That depends if you work at your gcses and a levels and change your mindset the better life would be for you. If the more you believe you are screw up the more you will fail. (Self fulfilling prophecy)?


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    I tried my best at GCSEs and A-levels. Sometimes the best is not good enough.
    If it's the truth, then I guess I will fail in life.

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    My academic achievements definitely mirror my Mum more than my Dad. My Dad dropped out of uni after a year and went into work, whilst I've finished my undergraduate degree and just started a masters. My Mum also has both undergraduate and postgraduate qualifications and she was the one supporting me in my desire to do a masters rather than my Dad who thought it about time I got a job and earned some money.
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    (Original post by Obiejess)
    Guess I beat the odds then.

    Dad = 1×C grade at CSE the rest Us

    Mum= mainly Cs at GCSE, with two Bs and a D

    Me = A* star student


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    Didn't know they did A**s
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    (Original post by Rinsed)
    I'll admit I'm a scientist rather than a frequent essayist, but the long sentences, minimalist punctuation, awkward sentence structure and sheer wordiness meant I had to reread it a few times to work out what was being said.

    I still have no idea what this means:

    "I just acknowledge that more foolish people do unfortunately confuse themselves over what is clearly evident"
    It's simply my own way of communicating. I have odd syntax and I don't overuse punctuation. I use the appropriate vocabulary and if the meaning isn't transparent then I'm afraid you're not the most perceptive individual...
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    You can do it perhaps try other subjects and see what suits you. I find that I am naturally suited to psychology, English literature and and sociology and I am also naturally suited to health and social care


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    (Original post by King of Evil)
    It's simply my own way of communicating. I have odd syntax and I don't overuse punctuation. I use the appropriate vocabulary and if the meaning isn't transparent then I'm afraid you're not the most perceptive individual...
    Underlined is the word I think you have fundamentally missed the point of. If your intention was to convey your meanings via words, you were not particularly effective.

    But this segue has dragged a tad off-topic...
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    (Original post by Rinsed)
    Underlined is the word I think you have fundamentally missed the point of. If your intention was to convey your meanings via words, you were not particularly effective.

    But this segue has dragged a tad off-topic...
    Just because you are too dense to read what I have carefully typed out does not make me a poor communicator. **** off.
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    (Original post by Rinsed)
    Underlined is the word I think you have fundamentally missed the point of. If your intention was to convey your meanings via words, you were not particularly effective.

    But this segue has dragged a tad off-topic...
    Here is a translation.

    "I have accepted the fact that foolish people tend be confused by those things that are clear"

    Basically foolish people are quite dumb.
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    my dad doesnt have any formal qualifications. he works in construction. i have no aspiration to be in construction

    /debunked
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    Dad didn't even turn up to his GCSEs and I'm hoping to be a Medicinal Chemist... hope I don't end up following his footsteps haha
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    Children look up to authority and particularly parental figures, the parents are instrumental in teaching their children values. The cycle of poverty exists because, and to put it bluntly but harshly, feckless parents who place little importance on social, physical and mental achievement have a far greater influence than schools. Good parents teach good values, they also have connections which means even if they don't they can still get their feckless children jobs, bad parents pass on bad values which schools have difficulty overriding. It's not always parents fault, sometimes it might be the crappy school as well, but good parents will notice this and remove them and put them in a new one.
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    (Original post by Edminzodo)
    My Dad got a U in his Latin O-Level . . . And no one in my family has ever done A-Levels . . .

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    If you socalised with smart people they probably passed their values onto you, or maybe you were intuitively like that, or maybe your parents had learned from their mistakes and brought you up well, or the school was good...
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    (Original post by DErasmus)
    Children look up to authority and particularly parental figures, the parents are instrumental in teaching their children values. The cycle of poverty exists because, and to put it bluntly but harshly, feckless parents who place little importance on social, physical and mental achievement have a far greater influence than schools. Good parents teach good values, they also have connections which means even if they don't they can still get their feckless children jobs, bad parents pass on bad values which schools have difficulty overriding. It's not always parents fault, sometimes it might be the crappy school as well, but good parents will notice this and remove them and put them in a new one.
    Hmm, feckless might be a bit strong..? Parents might not have the knowledge to be able to tell when a school is bad, or they might not have the resources to be able to move their children out of a bad school. Cultural Capital.

    Also the quote in my OP:
    "But there is evidence that children and parents from poorer backgrounds develop lower expectations as children grow older – they stop believing that their children will be able to achieve high ambitions, or do not know how to help them do so”
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    How do people who are arguing this is due to culture, parental encouragement, and parental wealth respond to the result of twin studies that show the success of children more strongly correlates to that of the biological parent than the adoptive parents? Is it not more likely to be merely the result of inherited intelligence?
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    (Original post by Observatory)
    How do people who are arguing this is due to culture, parental encouragement, and parental wealth respond to the result of twin studies that show the success of children more strongly correlates to that of the biological parent than the adoptive parents? Is it not more likely to be merely the result of inherited intelligence?
    Do you have a link to the studies...?
 
 
 
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