Turn on thread page Beta
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    I never said they were dumb. I think intelligence is a very relative matter. Misinformed, on the other, is different.

    But misinformation combined with close-mindedness/arrogance is a deadly combination.

    And ignorance.. well. I have met my fair share of Americans who have been largely anti-Muslim, anti-Liberal, etc. Also, many users here have talked about stories where they have met Americans overseas who were just simply just rude or close-minded, as well as over-opinionated without listening to others. But of course that is not a trait that is solely American.

    I am merely just quoting others and listing why so many people find contempt towards Americans, which I find, to certain degrees, agreeable.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by daiquiri)
    And ignorance.. well. I have met my fair share of Americans who have been largely anti-Muslim, anti-Liberal, etc.
    im largely anti-Muslim and anti-Liberal. perhaps im ignorant, but I'll wait for you to confirm that with me.

    Also, many users here have talked about stories where they have met Americans overseas who were just simply just rude or close-minded,
    they met Americans overseas? which stories are these? I was under the impression they met Americans who left the US to see the centre of the univ...sorry, Europe.

    as well as over-opinionated without listening to others. But of course that is not a trait that is solely American.
    indeed. the Dutch and the French would walk away with that award in my opinion.

    I am merely just quoting others and listing why so many people find contempt towards Americans, which I find, to certain degrees, agreeable.
    how constructive.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by vienna95)
    im largely anti-Muslim and anti-Liberal. perhaps im ignorant, but I'll wait for you to confirm that with me.
    Perhaps the reason why you are anti-Muslim and anti-Liberal is because you are ignorant of their beliefs. Or you could be a bigot. Or close-minded to what they believe in.

    Disagreeing with ideas does not make you "Anti-Muslim" or "Anti-Liberal." You have shown your own stance by labelling yourself.

    (Original post by vienna95)
    they met Americans overseas? which stories are these? I was under the impression they met Americans who came to see Europe.
    Sorry, I should have said "oversea Americans." But then, Americans outside their borders should be more open-minded.

    (Original post by vienna95)
    how constructive.
    Saves me the time, thanks.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by daiquiri)
    I am merely just quoting others and listing why so many people find contempt towards Americans, which I find, to certain degrees, agreeable.
    You find it agreeable that so many people hate Americans? :confused:
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    No, I just meant I posted quotes which I agreed with (to certain degrees).
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by daiquiri)
    Perhaps the reason why you are anti-Muslim and anti-Liberal is because you are ignorant of their beliefs.
    or that im fully aware of them and vehemently disagree.

    Or you could be a bigot. Or close-minded to what they believe in.
    anything else?

    Disagreeing with ideas does not make you "Anti-Muslim" or "Anti-Liberal." You have shown your own stance by labelling yourself.
    i disagree with liberal ideas and dont particuarly like the ideology or beliefs it propogates. i oppose it. i am anti-Liberal. what is my stance in your informed eyes?

    Sorry, I should have said "oversea Americans." But then, Americans outside their borders should be more open-minded.
    the American who decides that he wants to spend time in Europe to understand or appreciate another culture that he recognises as being different to his own, is less open-minded than the European who meets the travelling American and raves about how he detests American culture.

    run that by me again.

    Saves me the time, thanks.
    sarcasm is evidently a part of British culture that youre ignorant to.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by vienna95)
    or that im fully aware of them and vehemently disagree.

    i disagree with liberal ideas and dont particuarly like the ideology or beliefs it propogates. i oppose it. i am anti-Liberal. what is my stance in your informed eyes?
    Okay, you are anti-Muslim, and anti-Liberal. Meaning, if you "vehemently disagree" that puts you in the authoritarian-conservative field, right? Depending on how radical your beliefs are, you are basically in the "neo-conservative" area.

    I have my political beliefs. I am open-minded to what people have to say when they offer new ideas. Like whenever liberals pose a socialist alternative, or whenever conservatives criticize social programs. I take it into consideration.

    Unlike you, where basically anything with a label of "liberal" or "Muslim" doesn't get past a hair on your head.

    But then again, in order to deem myself from not being a hypocrite, I would have to be open-minded to such close-minded opinionated people like yourself.


    (Original post by vienna95)
    the American who decides that he wants to spend time in Europe to understand or appreciate another culture that he recognises as being different to his own, is less open-minded than the European who meets the travelling American and raves about how he detests American culture.
    You speak as though Europeans never visit America. You should check your statistics.

    sarcasm is evidently a part of British culture that youre ignorant to.
    Apparently you're unaware of humbleness.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by daiquiri)
    Okay, you are anti-Muslim, and anti-Liberal.
    as i said, largely. i dont see it as an all or nothing sentiment.

    Meaning, if you "vehemently disagree" that puts you in the authoritarian-conservative field, right?
    not particuarly.

    Depending on how radical your beliefs are, you are basically in the "neo-conservative" area.
    again, no such conclusion could be drawn.

    I mean, I have my political beliefs. But I am open-minded to what people have to say when they offer new ideas. Like whenever liberals pose a socialist alternative, or whenever conservatives criticize social programs. I take it into consideration.
    that is to be celebrated, i believe in the same principles.

    Unlike you, where basically anything with a label of "liberal" or "Muslim" doesn't get past a hair on your head.
    another qualification void of any substantiation. surprising from someone who considers themselves to be "open-minded to what people have to say"

    to such close-minded opinionated people like yourself.
    having an opinion seems to be something you relish, why the change of heart when I exercise my right on a discussion forum?

    You speak as though Europeans never visit America.
    no I dont.

    Apparently you're unaware of humbleness.
    im so aware of the virtue of being humble that I value its precious use. I only see fit to apply it when necessary.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by vienna95)
    as i said, largely. i dont see it as an all or nothing sentiment.
    Even though you "vehemently disagree"? If so, since you are fully informed about the beliefs of Muslims and liberals (or so you claim), do give reasons why you hold such a grudge against them [or their beliefs].

    not particuarly.
    Enlighten me.

    again, no such conclusion could be drawn.
    No conclusion can be drawn, but you have already said that you were anti-Liberal and anti-Muslim. There are only so many cards in a deck.

    that is to be celebrated, i believe in the same principles.
    Yet "vehemently disagree" with the beliefs of others?

    having an opinion seems to be something you relish, why the change of heart when I exercise my right on a discussion forum?
    Of course, having an opinion is fine. But why bother posting on a political forum if your opinion will not be changed? To vent at Muslims and liberals?

    im so aware of the virtue of being humble that I value its precious use. I only see fit to apply it when necessary.
    I'm glad.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by daiquiri)
    Even though you "vehemently disagree"? If so, since you are fully informed about the beliefs of Muslims and liberals (or so you claim), do give reasons why you hold such a grudge against them [or their beliefs].
    i dont hold any grudges. i am aware of their opinions and beliefs and happen to disagree with them. you opposed that circumstance but now recognise its validity in wanting me to explain my viewpoint that you had previously written off as ignorant and bigoted.

    Enlighten me.
    it doesnt hold weight. retract the guesswork and ill entertain ideas of concerning my own political orientation.

    No conclusion can be drawn
    thankyou.

    but you have already said that you were anti-Liberal and anti-Muslim. There are only so many cards in a deck.
    which is rather irrelevant to the point you were trying to make, ie that in being in disagreement with a liberal position makes me ignorant. unless being conservative makes me ignorant?

    Yet "vehemently disagree" with the beliefs of others?
    thats right. i find it both healthy and refreshing. youre not convincing me that youre as open-minded as you would have us all believe.

    Of course, having an opinion is fine.
    being opinionated wasnt fine a minute ago.

    But why bother posting on a political forum if your opinion will not be changed?
    when did you establish that?

    To vent at Muslims and liberals?
    to discuss opinions and beliefs with Muslims and liberals and anyone else who wishes to express an opinion or idea.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by vienna95)
    i dont hold any grudges. i am aware of their opinions and beliefs and happen to disagree with them. you opposed that circumstance but now recognise its validity in wanting me to explain my viewpoint that you had previously written off as ignorant and bigoted.
    Well, I perceived you to be anti-Muslim/anti-Liberal in the sense that their opinion is of no influence.

    which is rather irrelevant to the point you were trying to make, ie that in being in disagreement with a liberal position makes me ignorant. unless being conservative makes me ignorant?
    One who is anti-liberal cannot be liberal. One who is anti-Muslim cannot be Muslim (or rather, believing in its beliefs).

    Being in disagreement with a view does not make you ignorant. Rather, I criticized your "vehement disagreement" of certain beliefs to the possibility of having a basis of ignorance.

    thats right. i find it both healthy and refreshing. youre not convincing me that youre as open-minded as you would have us all believe.
    My mind tends to close up when other minds tend to close up.

    being opinionated wasnt fine a minute ago.
    Being opinionated was fine; being close-minded or ignorant, wasn't.

    when did you establish that?
    Since the personal quote wars.

    to discuss opinions and beliefs with Muslims and liberals and anyone else who wishes to express an opinion or idea.
    I agree; that is what I am here for. But, what is the point of expressing an opinion if there is no degree of change involved? If there is no listener, only talker?
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by daiquiri)
    Well, I perceived you to be anti-Muslim/anti-Liberal in the sense that their opinion is of no influence.
    and that perception was false and ill-founded.

    Being in disagreement with a view does not make you ignorant. Rather, I criticized your "vehement disagreement" of certain beliefs to the possibility of having a basis of ignorance.
    "I am open-minded..... Unlike you, where basically anything with a label of "liberal" or "Muslim" doesn't get past a hair on your head.....such close-minded opinionated people like yourself."

    possibility? you saw it as an open and shut case.

    My mind tends to close up when other minds tend to close up.
    again suggesting im closed minded, despite having to consistently withdraw accusations of my ignorance and much less substantiating them.

    Being opinionated was fine; being close-minded or ignorant, wasn't.
    "to such close-minded opinionated people like yourself"..hmm

    Since the personal quote wars.
    or debate as we call it.

    I agree; that is what I am here for. But, what is the point of expressing an opinion if there is no degree of change involved? If there is no listener, only talker?
    i wouldnt know, im quite eager to hear why you have spent the last 5 posts labelling me as closed of mind and ignorant. im also interested to know why,

    i) the American who decides that he wants to spend time in Europe to understand or appreciate another culture that he recognises as being different to his own, is less open-minded than the European who meets the travelling American and raves about how he detests American culture

    ii) being in disagreement with a liberal position makes me ignorant.

    iii) you would equate an anti-Liberal political stance to ignorance. "ignorance well. I have met my fair share of Americans who have been largely anti-Muslim, anti-Liberal, etc."
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by vienna95)
    and that perception was false and ill-founded.
    It was, because it was in my instinct from past debates with trolls on boards.

    possibility? you saw it as an open and shut case.
    Sort of parallel to the false perception.

    again suggesting im closed minded, despite having to consistently withdraw accusations of my ignorance and much less substantiating them.
    No, I'm not indirectly suggesting you're close-minded. I was only explaining my behaviour earlier from perceiving you to be a ignorant person.

    or debate as we call it.
    yes.

    i wouldnt know, im quite eager to hear why you have spent the last 5 posts labelling me as closed of mind and ignorant. im also interested to know why,
    I didn't label you ignorant, you sort of labelled yourself as being "large anti-liberal and anti-Muslim." Now for me, people who are "anti-Liberal/Muslim" tend to be ignorant because they only follow the opposition/believer (depending on whatever side you're on) without having a chance to hearout what many people say.

    But, you have said that you're knowledgeable on their beliefs but still largely disagree with them.

    I asked you for reasons, but you didn't give any.

    i) the American who decides that he wants to spend time in Europe to understand or appreciate another culture that he recognises as being different to his own, is less open-minded than the European who meets the travelling American and raves about how he detests American culture
    Wrong. I said that Americans who spend time in Europe (or leave their country to begin with, rather) are more open-minded to begin with. You made the comparison between Europeans and Americans.

    ii) being in disagreement with a liberal position makes me ignorant.
    No, I did not accuse you of being ignorant. I am merely saying that your anti-liberal and anti-Muslim may have had a basis on ignorance. But you have refuted that and said you were knowledgable on their views - only you have not told why you disagree.

    iii) you would equate an anti-Liberal political stance to ignorance. "ignorance well. I have met my fair share of Americans who have been largely anti-Muslim, anti-Liberal, etc."
    Redudant with ii).

    ANyways, I'd thought I'd apologize for my assumptions earlier. You are an intelligent person. However, I do know there are some people on these boards that side with your beliefs but make posts with the same passion as Rush Limbaugh but with the brain capacity of a monkey aid. Which explains my actions.
    Offline

    14
    ReputationRep:
    First of all, re the nobel prize thing ... Americans have won more for the same reason that the americans drink more than the British ... because there are more of them!

    (Original post by vienna95)
    The British tourist is the most xenophobic and jingoistic of any foreign national in Paris. The American media is far more diverse than almost anything a European nation has to offer. American tourists for the most part are among the most humble and inquisitive people I have ever had the pleasure of meeting?

    "this means 85% of Americans have never left the 'homeland'" - what is the purpose of the single quotes on homeland?

    By all means, there will be plenty of ignorant Americans, but I think Europeans, especially the French and the British, only make hypocritical fools of themselves, by trying to point this out.
    Yep British tourists are often very, very xenophobic and jingoistic. Can't argue with that one

    American media is diverse? Can't argue with that either, I've only ever been to New York ... although from what I gather and from the people I've talked to, NY is a different kettle of fish to the rest of the country.

    Much of the time Americans are extemely inquisitive ... which is one of the things that annoys many Europeans. What they could easily find out in a book they go and ask instead. They treat European cultures with so much ... delicacy that it can be insulting. It's like they see us as charming, quaint and backdated. I know I'm speaking about Americans in general and am in no way applying these statements to all of them

    By the way, I have talked to literally hundreds of Americans online so I think I do have a general idea about the people of the country (although admittedly they're usually about my age and female ) but I have talked to some of the most stupid, and some of the most intelligent people I've ever 'met'. This leads me to believe that there's nothing necessarily wrong with the American populations' intellect on the whole, but I definitely subscribe to the theory that some, especially those further inland, are extremely sheltered from the outside world.
    Offline

    11
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Onearmedbandit)
    Much of the time Americans are extemely inquisitive ... which is one of the things that annoys many Europeans. What they could easily find out in a book they go and ask instead. They treat European cultures with so much ... delicacy that it can be insulting. It's like they see us as charming, quaint and backdated. I know I'm speaking about Americans in general and am in no way applying these statements to all of them
    I agree with a few of the things you have said. I do ask a lot of questions when I travel, but it's only because I want to learn as much as I can about whatever place I happen to be visiting.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    I just wanted to point out another fact as the current theme is how Americans rarely travel abroad.

    Americans have far less holiday time [I switched that from 'vacation time', but I'm not sure if 'holiday time' would be how you would phrase it in UK. So, please don't think I'm an idiot, I tried.] than the typical European worker. Most Americans only have two or three weeks off a year, and a lot of employers stipulate that you can't take all of that time at once, so most people have one or maybe two weeks at a time off work. Most people wouldn't want to spent their short break rushing through airports and crammed into airplanes for several hours. It's just more conducive to stay in North America.
    Offline

    7
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by psychic_satori)
    I just wanted to point out another fact as the current theme is how Americans rarely travel abroad.

    Americans have far less holiday time [I switched that from 'vacation time', but I'm not sure if 'holiday time' would be how you would phrase it in UK. So, please don't think I'm an idiot, I tried.] than the typical European worker. Most Americans only have two or three weeks off a year, and a lot of employers stipulate that you can't take all of that time at once, so most people have one or maybe two weeks at a time off work. Most people wouldn't want to spent their short break rushing through airports and crammed into airplanes for several hours. It's just more conducive to stay in North America.
    I don't think this explains it entirely. In my experience Europeans are generally better informed about other countries than people from the US, even those that they have never visited. Europeans don't seem to have the same feeling that their home is the centre of the world.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by oldthrashbarg)
    In my experience Europeans are generally better informed about other countries than people from the US
    which countries? European ones? From my experience the average American has a better knowledge of a continent such as Asia than the average European.

    , even those that they have never visited. Europeans don't seem to have the same feeling that their home is the centre of the world.
    hehe, dont be so sure.
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    I met loads of great americans when i was there in California and it really changed my views on the people of america. I had the stereotype of fat, dull lazy, loud, ignorant people in my head and met soem really cool people instead.
    I dont agree with all of Americas policies and I didnt agree with the invasion of Iraq but there are lots of things I disagree with in different countries including my own.
    I'd say it was ignorance to assume all Americans are the same. I'd hate for someone to say I was a lacoste wearing, dole collecting, tan loving, blonde permed liverpudlian!
    Offline

    7
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by vienna95)
    which countries? European ones? From my experience the average American has a better knowledge of a continent such as Asia than the average European.
    As I said, I'm only talking about my (limited) experience. Perhaps "knowledge" is not the correct word. I think Europeans generally have a greater capacity for understanding other cultures, and accepting them as equal to their own. Americans seem to consider their own country and (lack of) culture the norm.
 
 
 
Poll
Which accompaniment is best?
Useful resources

The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

Write a reply...
Reply
Hide
Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.